Help me understand?

[v0lcom13sn0w]

im not pissed!

 

[tac]

O. I have three Rolex watches, among about forty others, that is. My cars are Mercedes-Benz and Porsche, too. I guess I'm a bloated plutocrat elitist. And here's me thinking I was a regular kind of guy.

 

[Alexx1401]

1K for a .22 rifle is FAR from something new. Its easy to do this with a lowly 10/22. It's easy to see some examples people have built up and spent that kind of money. Hand me one and I probably could not do much better than I could if I was shooting any of my several stock 10/22's but that's on me and my skill. Some shooters can buy one of these and do stuff that is amazing.
Hell my Wife has several times looked real seriously at a Ruger MK pistol that would run us $700 out the door. Every time she starts looking at one I have been saying "buy the damn thing if you want it". We can certainly afford it no problem. If it will get her to shoot more well worth it to me. Now if she gets it I doubt I will shoot it much better than my favorite 22/45 LITE that I paid much less for. The one she wants is far nicer to look at for sure, and in the hands of someone who is more talented than me I am sure they could make it sing. Hell if Wife wanted one of these 1K rifles and I thought she would actually shoot it I would be telling her buy it tomorrow.

 

[ilikegunspdx]

Don't overlook that in general, we have to pay around twice what you do to buy our guns, especially if they are from the US. You can buy the RPR in 6.5 Creedmore for around $1350 - I've seen them for an even K, over here they are well nigh 2K and up. Leupold scopes? don't get me started...... You also seem to get .22 ammunition for nothing.... I pay £95 for 500 Eley match.

Costy sports here in UK are -

1. Anything to do with horses.

2. Anything to with sail-boats bigger than around 25 feet.

3. Anything to do with fixed-wing 'fun-flying'. Learning to fly costs around $600/hour.

4. Anything, and I mean ANYTHING, to do with rotary-wing. Learning to fly costs around $1000/hour.

5. Polo.

6. Real tennis.

7. Any motor sports. Even demolition derby-style stuff.

8. Anything in sport that is not funded is expensive - if you have a gifted athlete child, like our niece does [acrobatic gymnastics - they live in Scotland]. Travelling seven hundred miles to a competition in Cornwall has to be paid by the parents. For example, the British tumbling and trampolining team won gold medals in Japan two weeks ago. Not only has nobody ever heard of them, they had to pay for it themselves. These are not elitists, just ordinary youngsters who happen to be good at their chosen sport.

Re ammo cost, specialty ammo here is pretty expensive even in .22 but the bulk or even run of the mill stuff is cheap. 2.8 cents per round is about the cheapest. So a 3 second 30 round burst on my 15-22 w/binary costs about 84 cents. The same burst in 223/556 would cost a little over $7 here. 9mm would be about $5 @ 17 cents per round.

 

[Member 34319]

im not pissed!

There's still time.

O. I have three Rolex watches, among about forty others, that is. My cars are Mercedes-Benz and Porsche, too. I guess I'm a bloated plutocrat elitist. And here's me thinking I was a regular kind of guy.

He seems to be a little!

 

[ZigZagZeke]

Sorry, Sir, but 90+ is where you START to get competitive.

That is what I meant to say. I'm also talking about high school kids with limited budgets. A typical winning score would have been as follows:

Prone: 100
Sitting: 100
Kneeling: 99
Standing: 98

Total: 397

 

[tac]

That is what I meant to say. I'm also talking about high school kids with limited budgets. A typical winning score would have been as follows:

Prone: 100
Sitting: 100
Kneeling: 99
Standing: 98

Total: 397

Well, I take all my comment back. Here I am talking about club shooters, and you are talking about high school youngsters.

We have hundreds of the former, but ZERO of the latter.

Please accepterise my apolerations.

 

[ZigZagZeke]

1K for a .22 rifle is FAR from something new. Its easy to do this with a lowly 10/22. It's easy to see some examples people have built up and spent that kind of money. Hand me one and I probably could not do much better than I could if I was shooting any of my several stock 10/22's but that's on me and my skill. Some shooters can buy one of these and do stuff that is amazing.
Hell my Wife has several times looked real seriously at a Ruger MK pistol that would run us $700 out the door. Every time she starts looking at one I have been saying "buy the damn thing if you want it". We can certainly afford it no problem. If it will get her to shoot more well worth it to me. Now if she gets it I doubt I will shoot it much better than my favorite 22/45 LITE that I paid much less for. The one she wants is far nicer to look at for sure, and in the hands of someone who is more talented than me I am sure they could make it sing. Hell if Wife wanted one of these 1K rifles and I thought she would actually shoot it I would be telling her buy it tomorrow.

You might be surprised. Match type accuracy is affected by things like the right pull length and comb height. Trigger settings are also critical. Anything that adds stress or tension to your body as you hold the rifle detracts from accuracy at that level. We always laid off of nicotine and caffeine a couple days before a match.

 

[ilikegunspdx]

That is what I meant to say. I'm also talking about high school kids with limited budgets. A typical winning score would have been as follows:

Prone: 100
Sitting: 100
Kneeling: 99
Standing: 98

Total: 397

That's interesting it is such a tiny difference to win. Do those matches ever have targets where they have to acquire and fire at different targets at speed? That would make it more interesting I would think.?

 

[Alexx1401]

You might be surprised. Match type accuracy is affected by things like the right pull length and comb height. Trigger settings are also critical. Anything that adds stress or tension to your body as you hold the rifle detracts from accuracy at that level. We always laid off of nicotine and caffeine a couple days before a match.

Lot of it with me these days is my eye's. They just don't work like they used to. Of course I never bother shooting from a bench any more though too. I do like a good trigger. That is one thing that still makes a big difference for even me.

 

[tac]

That's interesting it is such a tiny difference to win. Do those matches ever have targets where they have to acquire and fire at different targets at speed? That would make it more interesting I would think.?

I'm guessing that these youngsters are competing in the type of shooting where slow-fire is the norm, as in ISSF target shooting. The kind of shooting you are talking about is not possible with single-shot rifles on an indoor range.

 

[ZigZagZeke]

I'm guessing that these youngsters are competing in the type of shooting where slow-fire is the norm, as in ISSF target shooting. The kind of shooting you are talking about is not possible with single-shot rifles on an indoor range.

My experience was all NRA competition. Club matches and postal matches. All slow fire with a time limit.

 

[Wombat of Doom]

Honestly, I am a little fuzzy on how something can shoot more accurate than the Ruger 17hmr I have. I guess shooting a fly with it at 50 yards technically might be deemed a rule violation at tcgc. But I did it. I can get ridiculous groups with it that make me look like I know what I am doing. I am no competition shooter, but I can appreciate a good rifle. I have a .22 pistol that retailed over 1k, and I don't know what my pre woodsman is worth. Pricey but that .22 Beretta with iron sights can mickey mouse ears a target at 50 yards offhand. And that is with me shooting it. Again, I am no great shot, but sometimes good equipment lets you test your max limits. And I paid less than a grand combined for both pistols mentioned.

 

[CLT65]

Sorry guys. Sometimes I start a thread to figure something out and end up just pissing everyone off because I think differently.

I wouldn't worry about it. I've come to realize when you start a thread, you feel some ownership and responsibility for it's direction, but in reality most threads simply have a life of their own, and go wherever they want to go.

Tac has taken abuse over the years because of his home country, and the general U.S. perception of the different culture and gun laws there. I suspect he's just a bit touchy about it. (Perhaps misunderstood the gist of your question? No offense intended.)

 

[CLT65]

We tend to see gun ownership as a brotherhood, of sorts, but there is vast variety in the "shooting sports" and gun owners in general. We all have different interests, financial means, and levels of discipline and dedication. There's a lot of stuff out there that I can't imagine ever being interested in, in the slightest. To each their own.

I'm not a competitive person. I'm just not interested in competition. I have friends who live for competition. I know people who, when they get into a new discipline, they're all-in. They go nuts spending thousands on equipment. I couldn't afford that even if I wanted to, just like I can't afford the fancy gear, new trucks, boats, and other toys that a lot of the big dogs brag about. That's fine. I could afford all kinds of stuff if I wasn't spending all my money raising a family right now. That was our choice though, so I have no right to be jealous of anyone. I wouldn't trade my family for all the expensive toys in the world.

 

[OutwardHound]

For my .02, I have recently rediscovered the .22 again. I picked up a standard Henry lever action before Thanksgiving, avoiding the (Washington)1639 requirements for "assault rifles". I put on fiber optic front and rear sights. What a sweet shooting rifle. More accurate than I would have thought. Seems to handle any .22 LR ammo, and well, it is just plain fun to shoot.

 

[tac]

My experience was all NRA competition. Club matches and postal matches. All slow fire with a time limit.

Ah, right, NRA = NSRA, with the S standing for 'small-bore', ie .22. Here in yUK there are two sister organisations - the NRA which is for centrefire, and the NSRA for the .22 rimfire. However, this being Yoorup, most of the shooting in .22cal is geared towards the ISSF metric shooting. Apart from shooting at meters instead of yards they are as near as darnit identical. Air weapon shooting comps here are either metric, or the rather quaint UK sport of bell-ringing and pistol shot at seven yards.

Bell-ringing is still VERY popular in many pubs and working mens' clubs throughout the UK, particularly in the Midlands the North. As the name implies, the target is a small bell and might seem to be an easy mark, right?

Wrong.

Watch the video and have a laff.

 

[grandpaknowall]

What's up with 22 rifles going into the $1000 plus market these days?

Is it a club restriction on ammo or distances?

Are we so restricted in states that 22 is now the only option?

I freaking love 22lr, but I simply do not understand how there are 22lr rifles that cost more than their high end center fire counterparts!

Do these high end guns make bulk ammo shoot sub minute?

Is it just gun guys with too much money wanting a Rimfire version of their centerfire gun?

I know some here own a Vuduu or similar, so I'm hoping one of them might chime in.

For reference, this has an msrp of $1100.

View attachment 642200

This action alone with no stock is $1700

View attachment 642201

Meanwhile, this newly released Ruger is only $600 msrp.

View attachment 642202


What am I missing?

I have a standard Ruger 10/22. I punch holes through dimes at 50 yards. The scope I use is a Vortex Tactical. Anything past 50 yards, and environmental's, Drop & drift, come into play. Yes, I do shoot 22lr out to 200 yards plus, and hit clays, but the amount of holdover is insane! IMHO, these high price rifles are all about ego.
I was target shooting out in the woods a few years ago with my heavy barrel Remington 700 308, with a Vortex Viper and hand tuned loads at 620 yards. Up comes this young man and asks if he can shoot beside me. He proudly pulls out a $6,000 Tac-Ops Delta51 with a $3,800 schmidt & Bender. After we both had taken six shoots at my gong, I hit six for six, He hit once. It was at this time where he remembered he had a appointment he had forgot about, an packed up and left.

 

[tac]

I guess I'm losing the plot here, mainly because of the constant reference to 'wealthy gun owners' and the spin-off comments.

Either you can afford to shoot, in which case you do it.

Or you CAN'T afford to shoot, in which case you don't.

I've been to the USA so many times in my life that I long ago lost count, and I KNOW how much stuff costs. So given the cost of shooting - guns and ammunition - you would have to be so far down the breadline NOT to be able to shoot something that being able to buy that gun and ammunition is probably the very last thing on your mind.

Sure, over here there are still big estates, lots of them owned by Mormons from Utah, BTW, as well as the hereditary kind, and I guess that shooting on THEM is a mite restricted. For instance, I don't know the Duke of Norfolk, so it's unlikely that I'd get asked to his Christmas day shoot. But let's get some realism into this discussion - how many of you have been asked to go game shooting with a serving or previous president? Or even mix in that level of society? Please don't hit me with the 'we are all equal in the USA' ethos. We ALL know that just ain't so. Here, too. As with any society, there are the haves and the have-nots.

We are very fortunate, for whatever reason, to be some of the haves, right?

 

[Member 34319]

Again @tac I wasn't trying to piss you off.

My wording could have been better. I could have asked if it was more expensive to shoot over there instead of asking if it was a wealthy thing. Regular folks can own and perform expensive sports too. My bad.

I never called you a lord or duke or many of the other terms YOU posted in your posts. You posted all of that. I've never seen Downtown Abby or even know anything of the other references you posted of.

I simply asked a question, which you didn't really directly answer that question until post #58. Which yes, it's more expensive, thank you for your answer.

I'm a psychology grad with a minor in sociology. I studied a lot of mathematics too. Marketing was always my interest, though I never took a career in it I always get a kick out of it.

I know absolutely nothing about the European market, nor it's shooting sports culture. I have speculations, hence my questioning. If the market over there is expensive due to various means? Ok. I'd love to hear about it.

Reno