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Which rifle would you keep in this SHTF scenario?

I'm always curious about finding ammo post SHTF. What store won't already be picked over? Whose stash will you find? Are you going to be a raider?
I just want to know where all the easy to find ammo I keep seeing mentioned is going to be.
"Easy to find" is relative.. as opposed to, say "Unavailable".. Besides .22LR, the .223/5.56 is probably the most manufactured ammo in this country. By comparison, very little AK ammo is made here, so we will be dependent on what supplies may be in warehouses or sitting in cargo holds of docked vessels in port. It stands to reason that people will have stocks to trade in local markets. Living near a large Army base for over 40 years I have observed that supplies of various things including ammunition have been surplussed out and become available on the local markets. If you shoot 5.56, 9mm, and to a lesser extent .45 acp and 7.62X51, surplus can be an option.
Being a "raider" is a last option of the desperate, we'll leave that niche to the poorly prepared.
 
I'm always curious about finding ammo post SHTF. What store won't already be picked over? Whose stash will you find? Are you going to be a raider?
I just want to know where all the easy to find ammo I keep seeing mentioned is going to be.
So, my scenario could have been better stated but I was trying to draw a comparison to the Great Depression.

It's likely a finite SHTF timeline. But, in my scenario, you are the one who winds up on the road and probably in some squatter camp. How many rounds would you need to last you 5 years? Could you reasonably pack that much into a truck, and then a backpack (assuming the truck broke down and you had to leave it on foot)?

Many people here posting just about the rifles. I'm glad you're looking at the scenario a tad deeper (that's where the fun is!).
 

DeanMk

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Seems like most people that buy a gun get an itch...to buy more guns. Eventually we all have multiple.

But, for the sake of argument, let's assume a fairly bad SHTF scenario:
- Economic collapse a-la Great Depression
- You're out of work and about to be homeless
- You're not alone and have others to care for
- What you have with you needs to fit in the back of a pickup
- You need to plan for not having the cash to buy gas anymore (no mobility / extremely limited mobility)

You've already sold off most of the gun collection for the cash for necessities. But, which rifle(s) do you keep?

For me, I don't have the luxury of choice right now. So, it'd be the 10/22 that I've got built up and the precision .308 that's in the works, assuming I get it finished before the above.

Reasons are simple: I can pack thousands of rounds of .22lr in a small space. The .308 would be for hunting, though I don't currently hunt and have no illusions of suddenly being good at it. But, if you don't have the weapon, that makes things just that much harder. Likewise, ammo is aplenty for the .308 meaning I can get it now, stock some, and maybe even trade for it after the SHTF. And a final point, my wife handles both calibers with ease - so we are both very capable.

I'm curious what your choices are and why you would pick them?
I've got an old Mosssberg 142A with a 4X scope. That's what I would use.
Works for small game, but with judicious shot placement, you could bag something of a decent size, too.
This brings up another point.....it's a gun I can shoot well.
You can have the Magnum from hell, but it won't do you any good if you can't shoot it proficiently.
Your best bet is to use the gun you can shoot the best.
I would preferably use Velocitor ammo or plain ol' Mini Mag hollow points, but I've also got something like a 250 round mix of CCI and older Remington ammo already here, so even though they're 40 grain sold points, I would likely use those first.

Dean
 
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A few thoughts on the bugging out premise
  • If you are bugging out, do you know to where you are bugging out?
  • If your destination is "the woods" where you will "live off the land" you should try this out for a week or two this winter.
  • If you plan on driving do you have a plan for washed out bridges, blocked roads, road blocks and highwaymen? Have at east three routes that especially take bridges into consideration. Make practice runs.
  • What if your truck breaks down? Do you have packs already set if you need to hoof it? Note: these should be the last things you load so you can access them quickly and not have to dig through the rest of your stuff. You do have really good well broken in boots, right?
  • Consider a plan that uses two vehicles so you have mobility in case one breaks down. Also one can cover the other through a dicey area. Bicycles are a great resource.
  • When is the last time you used a map and compass?
  • When you get to your destination will you be expected and welcome? Consider advance agreements with relatives and CLOSE friends. You might be their bug out destination and not the other way around.
  • What if your destination is gone when you get there?
  • What is your communications plan? Hint - your cell phone and the Internet is not it.
  • Do you already have provisions there? Guns and ammo?
  • What skills do you bring?
  • How else will you contribute?
Once you bug out from a known to the unknown, you put your self into immediate high risk to the point there is a very good chance the further your travel, the odds you will not arrive in your planned destination of safety get very low. Conditions that may may seemed very good can turn into impossible. The best plan if at all possible is survive in place in an area of low population density that has those things that will have necessary needs nearby or at the area. Maybe like minded people with a plan and resources. There are such places without going totally off the grid.
 

3MTA3

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I'm always curious about finding ammo post SHTF. What store won't already be picked over? Whose stash will you find? Are you going to be a raider?
I just want to know where all the easy to find ammo I keep seeing mentioned is going to be.
The easy to find ammo is right now not later when everybody realizes they need it. PSA has been selling 1,000 rounds of XM193 for <$300 shipped and GI mags for $8.00 each for months. They aren't always on sale, but are on sale frequently/weekly. This will go away if things flip in the Senate and Oval office next year.

Get it now while you can at these prices.

Think about this - if you do decide to bug out it will be surely after you have bugged in during the initial stages. It's almost certain you will bug out after an incident that tells you that you are no longer safe and need to leave, so defending your castle or neighborhood still has to be in your plans..

A bulk case of 5.56 is not very big though it definitely has weight. It doesn't take up a lot of space in the back of the OP's truck. It woud take several of them to make a real difference in payload. You need enough mags so you don't have to reload them during a firefight. Don't forget a couple of maglula's.

Think guns and ammo from four scenarios:
  • Defending your home or neighborhood (limited only by money)
  • What you can bring bugging out (rifle and pistol + ammo for each person including older children plus anything else you pack)
  • What you can bring riding a bicycle or on foot after you ditch your vehicle
  • What do you already have stored at your bug out destination - is it secure and accessable?
 
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I'm surprised no one has mentioned 120mm smooth bore mounted on a M1A1 Abrams. You could save alot of ammo by driving forward at top speed. And if you need gas, take it. I doubt anyone would say no.
 

DeanMk

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Once you bug out from a known to the unknown, you put your self into immediate high risk to the point there is a very good chance the further your travel, the odds you will not arrive in your planned destination of safety get very low. Conditions that may may seemed very good can turn into impossible. The best plan if at all possible is survive in place in an area of low population density that has those things that will have necessary needs nearby or at the area. Maybe like minded people with a plan and resources. There are such places without going totally off the grid.
Interesting concept....don't "bug out" to someplace else. Rather, live and thrive in a sort of "Bug Out Community".....Interesting indeed.

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"A bulk case of 5.56 is not very big though it definitely has weight. It doesn't take up a lot of space in the back of the OP's truck. It woud take several of them to make a real difference in payload. You need enough mags so you don't have to reload them during a firefight. "

More interesting comments.
Personally, I'm not too worried about "fire fights", but it is good to be prepared, just in case.
I also like the idea of the 5.56 ammo.
Light weapon, lightweight but effective ammo.
It might be worth your while to biuy a boat load of ex-Mili ammo and swap out the bullets for the heaviest "hunting type" bullet you can get.
That way, you'd at least have some extra bullet mass on your side for the thicker skinned animals.
If I had a Mini-14 (or a CZ-527 Carbine), I might go that route, but I don't, so (as of the present moment) I will stick with the ol' Mossberg.

Dean
 
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I didn’t read the whole thread, but voting for a 10-22 to me is silly. A caliber and firearm that don’t really do anything particularly well seems like a strange vote.
Agreed. I get the cost factor and the ability to have lotsa ammo. But if it is insufficient to cleanly bring down deer-sized game or two-legged vermin, eh, I think I look elsewhere. To each their own. :s0155:
 

Catherine1

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CZ 455 Lux bolt action 22lr rifle.


(I have extra CZ magazines for this rifle.)

I have NEVER planned to bug out when I lived super rural back east in farm/lake country (Great Lakes region.) with my late husband, way up in the Sapphire Mountains out here (MT) butt up to wilderness, or where I live for now in this MT town. (We may be moving but that is here nor there in this reply.)

I remember the MASS civil unrest - riots in the 1960's. My late parents and I bugged in. My late Mom was in the medical field and did report to work. She returned home and we did not bug out. They did have police, troopers and the National Guard help and/or GUARD people who HAD to report to work due to their job description. Cities and counties in my former state on the East Coast (RURAL and WITHIN city limits.) and ALL around the country had security issues and some threats. Rural areas were 'on guard' on the East Coast and even in the boonies in the Great Lakes region according to my late husband, his late Aunts and friends in tiny villages and in farm/lake country.

RIOT times...

My older brother was out of the Army and working for the Federal Government. My older sister had already moved out.

Back to the present time...

The only way that I would leave is if I was in the middle of a forest fire, in the middle of any fire, or in the middle of a flood. And once the fire was out - I would return and stay on my land or lot.

I have two sources of water here even in this college town. Water filters and a few types of equipment.

I have supplies.

(My late parents were 1909 - Father and 1920 - Mother babies.
They taught me many things. Too much to type now.)

My MT husband has reloaded since the early 70's. He has his supplies. He has extra 22lr on hand. He casts bullets too.

I rarely shoot any longer other than to keep up my basic skills due to my arthritis. I keep a few bulk boxes of quality 22lr ammo on hand for myself. Brand name, clean shooting, straight shooting ammunition that I have used for a long time and it works well for his/her firearms. Past and present.

(I used to keep a bare minimum of 10,000 rounds of ammunition for myself - past tense. I no longer do that. I am no longer a high volume shooter.)

If the poop really hits the fan in ANY type of a natural or man made disaster, including a HUGE financial collapse, NO ammunition or very LITTLE ammunition will be on hand. That goes for reloading STOCK, reloading equipment, casting supplies and so forth.

People may Barter or Sell what they have in some items. But some people may not have the money to buy it or anything to barter. (Theft is another concern for some people and not for other people. It depends on the person, couple, entire situation or group if there is one.)

I believe that other SURVIVAL or EMERGENCY supplies will be more important than TONS of firearms. A few quality made firearms. RF, CF and shotgun shells if you still own or shoot shotguns would be good to have on hand.

I DO believe that black powder firearms and bp supplies are an outstanding idea too. I have said that in the past.

I know or KNEW a few people from some long gone gun/political/survival boards that were so called 'preppers' and when they LOST IT ALL or almost all of it due to fires, floods and tornadoes - they basically had JACK SQUAT left. They did survive but some of them were injured and some of them lost their dogs and 'farm stock' too. And from what I read, those people were not fake posters and other people knew them. They had pictures, stories and their friends or families posted their horror stories. Fire departments and some police/sheriff departments RAN some of their stories ONLINE and volunteers came down to help them not just volunteer fire/emt departments.

I think planning ahead is a good idea. I think that if you shoot CF firearms a LOT - reloading is a good idea but if you do NOT want to DO THIS - stock up your ammunition in the caliber that you shoot or use the most whether it is in a handgun, rifle or shotgun.

Your BASIC self defense firearm for YOU or your family if you have one - have the ammunition to feed it.

Make your primary goal even if you are a Newbie shooter or if you have a limited budget having a good stock on hand or a growing stock on hand for your PRIMARY self defense firearm.

I personally BELIEVE that 'they' will go AFTER all ammunition, reloading supplies and casting supplies. So whether you have a natural or man made disaster happen - THEY will get you on the other end when it comes to gun politics - bans, restrictions, fake or real shortages, confiscation, more bs laws and tons more.

ALL people should have a few good knives, axes and 'hawks on hand in my NOT so humble opinion. They should know how to use them safely and keep their skills up to date at ANY AGE and with any type of physical condition!

Baseball bats, golf clubs, brooms, rakes, shovels, pitchforks, hammers, screw drivers, wrenches, etc. are ordinary household supplies and sporting goods to have on hand whether you live in town, in the suburbs, in the mountains, in the boonies - farm/ranch/small or large rural homestead, etc.

^^^
Any port in a storm when it comes to a tool or object to use for self defense. So if a person CHOOSES to NOT own/shoot a gun or they only use a knife for kitchen use - they still could have a few tools on hand for self defense.

Cate
Typos!
 
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DeanMk

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"if a person CHOOSES to NOT own/shoot a gun or they only use a knife for kitchen use - they still could have a few tools on hand for self defense. "

2" combination wrench comes to mind....https://www.amazon.com/TEKTON-2-Inch-Combination-Wrench-WCB23050/dp/B06XTP4VQZ
Says it weighs 6 lbs., but that seems excessive.
I've got a 2" combo wrench and it weighs about a pound and a half, maybe a little more.
24" Crescent wrench or pipe wrench would work, too! ;)
 
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3MTA3

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"if a person CHOOSES to NOT own/shoot a gun or they only use a knife for kitchen use - they still could have a few tools on hand for self defense. "

2" combination wrench comes to mind....https://www.amazon.com/TEKTON-2-Inch-Combination-Wrench-WCB23050/dp/B06XTP4VQZ
Says it weighs 6 lbs., but that seems excessive.
I've got a 2" combo wrench and it weighs about a pound and a half, maybe a little more.
24" Crescent wrench or pipe wrench would work, too! ;)
Especially if you used it to wrench his pipe...
 
Fort Rock sez: Plan on chaos; no or damaged roads; no EMS; low or no water supplies in urban areas; roving bands of dangerous humans; contamination; out-of-control or over-reactive LE and National Guard. Avoid road-blocks. Carry binoculars. Flashlights; batteries; bic-type lighters, life-straws;
I sez: All good points for a BOB.. no matter where you are or what the emergency may be... good knives and of course your AR15, shottie, pistol... "Be ready to die" at any moment!
 
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Out of my two American Rifles (AR's) I'd bring my S&W M&P15 Sport I that I've had since 2012. Got plenty of ammo and spare parts too. Though really I can still carry my pack, Mossberg 500 and Glock27 on me. Train how you play >:0
 
But, for the sake of argument, let's assume a fairly bad SHTF scenario:
- Economic collapse a-la Great Depression
- You're out of work and about to be homeless
- You're not alone and have others to care for
I think this scenario speaks more to having one's housing situation figured out and financial house in order, which includes a great deal of attention to monetary reserves. Having said reserves and workable contingency plans would be more important than a rifle selection in an economic collapse. But, I suppose that is the topic of another thread.
 
I think this scenario speaks more to having one's housing situation figured out and financial house in order, which includes a great deal of attention to monetary reserves. Having said reserves and workable contingency plans would be more important than a rifle selection in an economic collapse. But, I suppose that is the topic of another thread.
Our military uses a zombie apocalypse as an exercise training tool for strategists.

The idea of planning for a scenario is to plan for that scenario. You’re not Captain Kirk, this isn’t the Kobayashi Maru...so why not play the game?
 

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