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Practical Carbine/Pistol Combos SHTF

Discussion in 'Preparedness & Survival' started by stratbastard, Dec 23, 2013.

  1. stratbastard

    stratbastard eugene oregon Active Member

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    LOTS and LOTS of videos and blogs out there, both in forums such as here and YouTube. Like to hear the thoughts of others here, and feel free to "school" me gently if you wish... I sure don't know every dang thing and am ready to learn more from my betters in this arena. Here's some of my thoughts (and actual choices made) on the subject:
    A) Budget is a big concern for many obviously.
    B) Practicality i.e. effectiveness
    C) Ammo availability.
    First off, my comments on the Glock pistol of choice, because there are so many arguments for the 19 & 17 in 9mm, the 22 and 23 in .40, and so on. I maintain that the only choices of these four is the 22&23 Because: if you purchase a 22 (my favorite) you can also purchase a SECOND BARREL which will allow you to shoot either 9mm or .40 from the very same gun. This can be vital if and when ammo becomes scarce, and looking for TWO available calibers sure beats being limited to ONE.
    Matching up Carbine & pistols can be a practical idea as well. I, for example, have a .357 lever carbine coupled with a .357 revolver. I can not only utilize and carry the same ammo for both, but again can have a choice between using .357 or .38 special. There is a better chance of obtaining ammo from those two choices when it becomes rare. Ditto of course for the .44 carbine and revolver, although I prefer the .357/.38 due to the monster amount of .38 revolvers made over the last century... and I feel there will be MUCH more .38 around than .44.
    One can match up a Kel Tec Sub 2000 with that Glock, utilizing the same ammo AND Glock clips. You WILL have to choose between 9mm and .40... I went with the 9mm because I think there is going to be more of that caliber around for longer.
    There are TONS of super cool rifles and pistols out there which I never consider. Do I like 10mm for example? Yes, a very cool caliber... but I just don't imagine being able to find any after my supply runs out. Ditto calibers like .44 special, .50AE, or .22 WMR. I either stick to the common NATO rounds, or stuff you are likely to find in every other grandpa's drawer like the .30-.30.
    And yes, I have an AR (also a NATO round) which is my first choice. These are ideas for other interesting and practical COMBOS when ammo is hard to come by.
    Anyone got any favs?
     
  2. Burt Gummer

    Burt Gummer Portland Completely Out of Ammo

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    FN PS-90 carbine/sbr + 5.7 pistol. (50 rounds + 30 rounds; extremely reliable; same ammo, different mags). MPA 5.7 carbine w/ folding stock as substitute for PS-90, then carbine and pistol share mags; 30 + 30.

    Kriss carbine/SBR + Glock 21.

    Just Right Carbine/Keltec + Glock 19/17.

    HTA 22lr Bullpup or 10/22 modded variant + Ruger Charger modded variant (same mags). BXx2 molded = 50 rounds for both.

    MechTech 45acp + 1911.

    Would say concealable pistol a big deal, so .223/5.56 combo iffy at best. Never liked AR pistols anyway, just personal choice.
     
  3. cookie

    cookie THE SOCIALIST STATE OF KALI - FORNIA Well-Known Member

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    IMHO too much emphasis is put on gun choice opinions on the survival and preparedness postings.
     
  4. Burt Gummer

    Burt Gummer Portland Completely Out of Ammo

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    Yes, you are correct. Training is so much more important. Just for fun though.

    Kind of like me showing up at the golf course for the first time with a bag of Callaways(?) I got as a gift LOL. All that nice hardware and not a clue what to do with it except make an idiot out of myself.

    Skills over gadgets anytime.
     
  5. westcoastal

    westcoastal north coast of oregon Active Member

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    Hi-point carbine. And Bersa UC Pro both in 9mm is what I've got for match ammo firearms.
     
  6. Salps

    Salps Down by the river…. Well-Known Member

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    Marlin Camp 45 and Colt 1911 45 with high cap mags
     
  7. Mark W.

    Mark W. Silverton, OR Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Winchester model 73 in 44-40 and a Colt SAA in 44-40 the ultimate carbine handgun combo.
     
    user, justsaymo, 2506 and 6 others like this.
  8. Doc In UPlace

    Doc In UPlace Tacoma-ish Well-Known Member

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    I can only tell you my choices; Colt 6920 in 5.56 and Glock-21 in .45. Very common calibers and effective.
     
  9. AMProducts

    AMProducts Maple Valley, WA Jerk, Ammo Manufacturer Silver Supporter

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    Ah yes, the "cowboy combo" a legend that traces back all the way to billy the kid. Interestingly enough, billy the kid made his living by stealing, not by hunting.

    So this means you're either shooting a handgun that's several orders of magnitude heavier and more powerful than you need, or you're shooting a rifle that's way underpowered. Also, this means you're stuck with only one caliber, thus unless the ammo is what you find is that caliber, you're SOL. So would you want a BFR and a guide gun (.45-70) or a ruger mk2 and 10-22? Now imagine you're in bear country.

    I think I might be open to the PS-90 (SBR) and a FiveSeveN as the "cowboy combo" but I don't really think there's any advantage to this over a glock 19 and an AK.

    Also, stay away from the JRC's, those things break constantly and never seem to run right.
    Read this: Gun Review: JR Carbine | The Truth About Guns and then also factor in the bolt handles breaking off.

    My go to is the M4gery in .223, a 9mm pistol, and a .22LR drop in conversion for the AR. This means I can duke it out with everyone in the US for more ammo, and I essentially have 3 guns for the weight of 2. With a cowboy, you have 1.5 guns for the weight of 2.

    The cowboy combo has been done to death, all it really gives you is ammo commonality, which is probably the least important factor when the world turns upside-down. Having fewer guns with more capabilities is a much better way to go.
     
  10. rdt

    rdt SW Portland Active Member

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    +1 to training (& food & Rx & shelter & fuel & community) probably being a better investment of pre-shtf resources than *the perfect weapon(s)* for 90%? of the time during 90%? pf shtf scenarios. heresy, I know but still.

    I am reminded of the thing about a pistol, how it is decidedly NOT the perfect weapon on every count but availability. so the perfect weapon is the one you have when you need it. if I could only have one it would probably be a 12ga shotgun, though I would do whatever I could to make sure I didn't find myself only having one weapon.

    also I think you have to account for your expected environment when answering this question. imho, on the west side of the cascades: generally shorter typical combat distances with urban and/orheavily forested/hilly areas - a carbine with an intermediate powered cartridge would be most appropriate (223 or 762x39, pistol caliber of choice-see recent thread on 9v40v45). on the east side ( and maybe in the maritime centered Sound?) longer combat distances seem likelier, so a battle rifle would be best and again, pistol caliber of choice.

    IMO, trying to put a pistol round in a rifle just leaves you with a semi-only & cumbersome submachinegun. same for an intermediate round in a pistol: to big a pistol to be handy (which is the whole point of a pistol) and no chance to take advantage of the ballistics of the cartridge (which is the whole point of a certain cartridge).

    the exception to what I'm saying about this might be the pdw rounds (sub-intermediate) : 30carbine ( M2 carbine + 30carb AMT Automag) badA but poor ammo availability; or 5.7 (PS90 + FN57) badA but high cost.
     
  11. rdt

    rdt SW Portland Active Member

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    to answer the question though I'll be packing a 1911 and an SKS, my wife a 9mm Sig and a mini14.

    cause it's what I have.
     
    Sgt Nambu and (deleted member) like this.
  12. Hook686

    Hook686 Northern California Active Member

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    I have three sets:

    Marlin 1894c & S&W 627PC (.357 magnum)

    Marlin 1894SS & S&W 629C (.44 magnum)

    USGI M1 Carbine & Ruger Blackhawk (.30 carbine)

    While I like all three pairings, the .357 magnum would be the last I'd get rid of. I've actually considered using a Desert Eagle XIX in .357 magnum with a 10" barrel in lieu of the S&W 627PC. The DE brings the .357 magnum handgun ballistics closer to that of the carbine, but at the expense of the use of .38 Special in the handgun.
     
  13. JohnnyD

    JohnnyD Vancouver Bang Bang

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    Ar in 5.56 and m&p 9mm. If bubblegum hits the fan the military will be the first in the bubblegum and I can pick up their left overs if need be.
     
  14. clearconscience

    clearconscience Vancouver, WA Well-Known Member

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    Well if you plan right you shouldn't run into too many people.
    You would be better off planning an escape plan. Have plenty of mobile supplies for survival.
    Fire making, food prep, hunting, ie. snares, .22lr, etc, shelter, meds, etc.

    And then plan trips to the woods for a few days and lives off only what you pack in. No MRaes, mountains house meals, etc. because that stuff will last about 5 days or so. Then what?!

    But I would go with a Glock and the TNW Aero survival rifle.
    Same mags, get in 9mm, .40, or .45. The carbine breaks down without tools.
     
  15. The Heretic

    The Heretic Oregon Well-Known Member

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    With a few exceptions (5.7x28, .22 rimfire, maybe .454 Casull), I am not a big fan of the concept.

    Using the same ammo for both handgun and rifle sounds good on the surface, but I don't see a big advantage to it. If you are going to carry something the size and weight of a rifle, then carry a rifle that uses rifle ammo instead of handgun ammo. Handgun ammo in a rifle is usually limited in power and range, even though you get some more of both with the longer barrel, it isn't enough to make up for it.

    I like the idea of the interchangeability, but you give up too much to get that IMO.

    I wish there was a rifle that could chamber both a handgun cartridge and a rifle cartridge - something like a lever action that chambered .454 Casull and a longer version of that same cartridge on about the power level of .45-70. I don't believe it is feasible though; I don't think a lever action could feed both the .454 and something twice as long.

    So as much as it appeals to me, I just go with rifle cartridges in rifles and handgun cartridges in handguns. In a SHTF scenario, if I have to shoot anything, 99% of the time it will be with the rifle, the handgun being something that is either a last resort defensive weapon, or something that I use to fight my way to my rifle when I don't have my rifle slung or in my hands. Therefore I don't anticipate that I will be using a lot of handgun ammo or the handgun a lot.

    As I said, there are exceptions - one of them being the .22 rimfire - where it makes a lot of sense to have both rifle and handgun for this cartridge.

    The .454 Casull can approach the power level of mild .45-70 ammo, but it is not that common and handguns for it are heavy. My preference is a lightweight .44 mag (S&W 329PD) and a Marlin .45-70 cut down and slicked up - not as a defensive combo, but as a hunting combo. That said, in a SHTF situation where I had to worry about humans, I would be hunting with a military rifle and handgun instead.
     
  16. CamoDeafie

    CamoDeafie Albany Well-Known Member

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    there WAS something similar to that I believe....

    but instead of a rifle or pistol cartridge, it was shotgun and break open......? 12 gauge over .308, or 12 over 45-70, among others?


    would be nice if someone developed a carbine that combined say, a .45ACP or 9mm Glock magazined blow-back carbine lower with a Bullpup .223 or 308 system.... but it would be something heavier than a dedicated carbine and a handgun on your belt....

    for me, it would be what I already have; an SKS and a ruger P85. both are heavy, dead reliable and I've got a lot of ammo for both :) realistically, one would be better off to get as much training and skills in as possible...
     
  17. Major Payne

    Major Payne PNW Active Member

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    Ar15 in hand keltec sub 2000 on my back and g17 on my hip
     
  18. The Heretic

    The Heretic Oregon Well-Known Member

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    There are over under combos - I have several; an M6 in .410/22LR (I would like one in .22 Hornet too) and a 24C in .223/20 ga. - but they are single shot and not suitable for self-defense.

    There is that ZiP .22 rimfire handgun thing that you can attach to a rifle, but I have read they are not well made, and I have to wonder about the legality of attaching a handgun to a rifle.

    The Crossfire was a 12 ga/.223 pump, but I think at least the early ones had functioning problems, they were a bit heavy, and never really caught on.

    Combo firearms like these are a different beast from a rifle/handgun combo that shoots the same ammo. As I said I have a couple, whereas the only rifles I have that shoot handgun ammo are rimfire.
     
  19. pokerace

    pokerace Newberg Well-Known Member

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    I'm set up with 2-3 diff. combo's..

    marlin camp carbine 9mm several handguns same cal.

    us GI carbine 30 carbine Ruger black hawk same cal.

    22 rifles and several hand guns.
     
  20. Fisher Bill

    Fisher Bill Tigard Member

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    [QUOTE
    I, for example, have a .357 lever carbine coupled with a .357 revolver. I can not only utilize and carry the same ammo for both, but again can have a choice between using .357 or .38 special. There is a better chance of obtaining ammo from those two choices when it becomes rare. Ditto of course for the .44 carbine and revolver, although I prefer the .357/.38 due to the monster amount of .38 revolvers made over the last century... and I feel there will be MUCH more .38 around than .44.[/QUOTE]

    This is what I have set up, even when the lowest amounts of ammo were available I was still able to keep adding to the pile...