Burger flippers strike?

[scarlo]

I find it interesting that some posters have commented on discomfort or not feeling well after consuming fast food. I have been experiencing this too, but when I prepare my own burger, no problems. It is also a better burger!

 

[mkwerx]

I've noticed the same thing. And I've wondered how this came about, just as I've wondered why so many of the manicure salons are run by Vietnamese.

When I was a youngster, driving a hack was kind of a job of last resort if you were an otherwise upstanding person. Meaning, you were together enough to have a decent driving record and could hold a job but couldn't find anything else. Most people didn't look upon it as desirable work. So maybe there was a time when it was difficult for operators to find drivers and it became something that immigrants could easily get into. From there, they kinda took it over.

BUT: The taxi drivers are truly professional drivers, that's what they do. Very many of the Uber drivers are part-time dilettantes. Also, the taxi industry in most locales is a regulated one with certain standards. Including licensing authority. And the taxi license usually has a fairly high value that makes it something that drivers don't want to put at risk. On-going issues with Uber and other so-called ride-sharing services are lack of standards and regulation.

Some misconceptions there, at least as far as Uber / Lyft is concerned.

The people that drive for those services, many do it full time, thus they are indeed professional drivers.

Regulations depend on location, but Uber and Lyft both have baseline standards, which are at least equal to, if not higher than most taxis. The Taxi industry clings to outdated, protectionist driven methodology that is at its heart anti-consumer - such as limited license or "token" or "medallion" availability, artificially inflating costs.

A good example of the standards - the average cab is a retired police or government service vehicle. 100-200+ thousand miles on it before it ever enters service as a taxi, and they're typically older. Uber and Lyft, for example have a hard 10 year age limit on your vehicle, and they do require periodic inspections, and the vehicles are required to carry a fire extinguisher and first aid kit on board.

Drivers are background checked, and being 100% app based - drivers are required to have a photo of them AND their vehicle, as well as the vehicle's license plate and description in the driver's profile. The passengers know who is coming for them, and exactly what the vehicle looks like. The stories of people getting into the wrong car, or with the wrong driver are because the passengers were idiots and not paying attention to the information at their fingertips. Unfortunately, the rideshare companies don't require pictures of the person requesting the ride - they have the option, but it's not a requirement. Further - both apps periodically make the drivers take a photo of themselves to match up to the on-file photo using facial recognition software. Literally you get a notification and you cannot take more rides until you stop and take a current photo. No taxi company does that.

Regulation in most markets is very similar to taxis - except that Uber / Lyft drivers cannot just stop and pick up random fairs, they HAVE to request rides through the app, and at least in the US and most westernized nations, riders cannot pay cash - the transaction HAS to go through the app. Additionally, unlike taxis, in markets that have restrictions on how long a driver can drive - this is enforced through the apps, not self reported or honor system based.

Most markets also have a government agency that oversees operation, driver training etc. In the Portland market, even if you're not driving IN the city limits of Portland, you are subject to Portland regulations and requirements, because that's where the TNC (Transportation Network Contractors) companies offices are. Portland, for example, makes Uber and Lyft drivers take the exact same city mandated training as those who drive a taxi cab. You must show "trade dress" which are the logos, with your individual business license number on the vehicle, just as taxis must display their taxi license.

A TNC driver must carry copies of their business license, insurance certificates, and inspection paperwork in their vehicle at all times while driving for Uber / Lyft and present them to authorities upon request. Like other commercial vehicles you are subject to being stopped and inspected randomly.

And like any other commercial / professional driver, you'll have a mix of good drivers, bad drivers, azzholes, and lost idiots. I've been a professional driver in varied capacities since I was 19 years old, and just being a "professional driver" doesn't mean you are a good one. Taxi drivers are as terrible as any, lots of semi drivers are terrifyingly inept, and God help you if you're within the turning radius of a municipal bus - your life is probably more in danger at that moment than if you're within arms reach of a crackhead needing a fix.

 

[Provincial]

The reason Vietnamese are so strongly associated with nail salons is because actress Tippi Hedren took an interest in resettling refugees after the Vietnam war. She advocated for teaching the women how to do Beverly Hills-level manicures, and they were able to price the service within the reach of most women. Here is an article from NPR on the subject: How Vietnamese Americans Took Over The Nails Business: A Documentary

Search "Vietnamese Nail Salon History" on the internet to see many other references. It is a real American success story.

 

[CountryGent]

But this gets back to what is now commonly called "income inequality." Which will NEVER go away. It's been that way forever and not even commie countries could change it permanently. Boo-hoo, Warren Buffett will always have more money that I will. Eliminating income inequality in the contemporary US is a pipe dream.

The phrase "income inequality" has always irked me. There is also "effort inequality". I work insanely long hours and am on call 24/7 in case an issue gets to the point I need to be brought in. I would hope my income would be higher than, say, the guy that doesn't hold a job, spends his day blowing dope, and lives off the system.

 

[bbbass]

I find it interesting that some posters have commented on discomfort or not feeling well after consuming fast food. I have been experiencing this too, but when I prepare my own burger, no problems. It is also a better burger!

Buy any of the plastic tube wrapped burger at Walmart or Grocery Outlet and you will observe the same effect. It's tough, has grissle in it, and tastes like I'd expect horse meat to taste.

IMO the "discomfort" is more an effect of the additives and crap in the sauces, on the lettuce, tomato, or in the prepacked patties, taco meat, etc, things like: "A whole host of preservatives fall into these categories: sulfites, propionates, benzoates, nitrates, chelates.... These have all been approved for use by the FDA, and are generally considered to be safe. Still, calcium disodium ethylenediaminetetraacetic acid isn't exactly the most appetizing-sounding addition to your diet."

 

[Rickenbacher39]

The only thing worse I can think of than burger flippers going on strike
would be if all the WalMart greeters unionized and walked out.
I'd absolutely be lost.

 

[awshoot]

It is kind of odd the notion that a burger joint job is supposed to provide a wage that one can live on and/or support a family. That has never been the case; it is for young people still living at home, those that need a little side income, or whatever.

...

I think this was more valid in the past than the present. I was in HS and college before NAFTA and GATT and the jobs I had were for beer money, clothes, gas, and the experience of working. Over the last couple decades though, many good jobs have just disappeared leaving people trying to make do with these "starter jobs" because that's what they could get. And it is not just high school grads who have felt this, though they've certainly taken the brunt of it -- highly technical positions are subject to offshoring (accounting, reading MRIs or other medical imaging, and of course all of the technology jobs have been hit by that trend, or where offshoring impossible, importing cheap labor via H-1B visas).

I don't look down my nose at people working fast food for a number of reasons, but primarily, the person could simply be someone who's job was exported and instead of giving up, the person is out there doing what her or she can, which is worthy of praise. The person might be working the job while learning more marketable skills in college or tech school. The person might just be there for some extra money and flexible hours but is otherwise part of a financially stable family.

 

[CountryGent]

I don't look down my nose at people working fast food for a number of reasons, but primarily, the person could simply be someone who's job was exported and instead of giving up, the person is out there doing what her or she can, which is worthy of praise. The person might be working the job while learning more marketable skills in college or tech school. The person might just be there for some extra money and flexible hours but is otherwise part of a financially stable family.

I don't look down at the folks that work those jobs either. Any man or woman who gets up every day and contributes something, and is trying to take care of business, is doing right. Those that are of able body and mind that refuse to do anything, but expect the taxpayer to support them, however, I take a much dimmer view.

 

[gmerkt]

The phrase "income inequality" has always irked me. There is also "effort inequality". I work insanely long hours and am on call 24/7 in case an issue gets to the point I need to be brought in. I would hope my income would be higher than, say, the guy that doesn't hold a job, spends his day blowing dope, and lives off the system.

The "other side" refuses to acknowledge this basic truth.

Buy any of the plastic tube wrapped burger at Walmart or Grocery Outlet and you will observe the same effect. It's tough, has grissle in it, and tastes like I'd expect horse meat to taste.

IMO the "discomfort" is more an effect of the additives and crap in the sauces, on the lettuce, tomato, or in the prepacked patties, taco meat, etc, things like: "A whole host of preservatives fall into these categories: sulfites, propionates, benzoates, nitrates, chelates.... These have all been approved for use by the FDA, and are generally considered to be safe. Still, calcium disodium ethylenediaminetetraacetic acid isn't exactly the most appetizing-sounding addition to your diet."

This is all true. The "tube meat" ground beef should be avoided if locally ground may be had. The tube meat is packed in the big plants where the number of carcasses blended together is many. The more beeves involved, the more opportunities for bacteria to be present and contaminate the entire lot. The locally ground beef tends to consist of content from fewer beeves.

I know preservatives are bad for me. When I eat food out, afterward I have to pee more. Home cooked food doesn't cause this reaction. Cruise ship food has the same effect. As soon as I get home and start eating home-prepared food, my urinary frequency decreases. This is the body trying to purge the salts and chemicals.

I don't look down my nose at people working fast food for a number of reasons, but primarily, the person could simply be someone who's job was exported and instead of giving up, the person is out there doing what her or she can, which is worthy of praise. The person might be working the job while learning more marketable skills in college or tech school. The person might just be there for some extra money and flexible hours but is otherwise part of a financially stable family.

Yes, you're right. I apologize for any of my comments that may have had that tone and which were unintended. "There go I ..." situation.

Oooo, I didn't know people were reading our MRI's offshore. I don't like that idea.

 

[gmerkt]

Some misconceptions there, at least as far as Uber / Lyft is concerned.

Thanks for the update. I'll be watching for some of this next time I request Uber.

 

[mkwerx]

Thanks for the update. I'll be watching for some of this next time I request Uber.

Each market is going to be a bit different in the requirements, but its the same core requirements. A lot of drivers are 3/4 or full time drivers - and even the part timers will wind up doing it 20-30 hrs a week. Taxi companies badmouth "ride share" because it made them obsolete, and they have to compete.

A common complaint I heard from passengers when doing Uber and Lyft about taxis - they take forever to get there, you don't know *when* they will get there, you don't know who your driver is going to be, how they are likely to behave, and the price is higher unless you're dealing with surges.

The thing with both Uber and Lyft specifically is the driver and passenger rating system. You don't get that with taxi cabs. Drivers live and die by their rating - if you fall below a 4.75 rating for too long, you get "deactivated" which is the elegant way of saying fired. They give you a chance to fix it, but its really hard to up your numbers, and really easy to fall off. You would think that on a 5-star system, that 3 is "average" - nothing special, nothing terrible - but both platforms essentially require 5 stars to be average or better. Thats why some over-achievers do things like giving out candy, water, providing charging cables, or letting passengers hook their phone to the stereo via AUX or bluetooth. The most I would do was let someone borrow a USB charger - I didn't buy iPhone cables, and I damn sure wasn't going to let passengers control the radio, link to my car, or pipe thru an Aux. I met a few drivers who let passengers do this, and wound up with blown out speakers.

Because of the 5 star system and essentially a 5 star mandate, you're more likely to encounter a clean, fresh smelling car with a fresh smelling driver than in a taxi cab to boot.

The taxi industry fights ride share hard, using the false notion that people aren't professional, they're not background checked (which is hilarious, because driving taxis or tow trucks used to be what ex-cons did because they were the jobs no one else wanted)

Cities have had to adapt their regulations a bit because of ride share, a lot of them still have slightly different rules for taxi cabs vs ride share cars, but a lot of the regulations overlap. The city, for example, has a say in the base rates for the ride shares, just like with taxis. In Portland, Uber & Lyft have identical basic rates, tho surge pricing will often make them different. Taxis wish they could do surge pricing.

If the cities would modernize and allow for dynamic rates, and the taxi fleets were not limited to the number of vehicles it would be a lot more free-market. I'm all for safety regulations, but fixed prices set by the city, or by a board made up of business owners is antithetical to free markets and does the consumer no good.

 

[CountryGent]

I find it interesting that some posters have commented on discomfort or not feeling well after consuming fast food. I have been experiencing this too, but when I prepare my own burger, no problems. It is also a better burger!

I hear your. My family, close and extended, likes the burgers I make very much. There is a running joke that if I ever get tired of the technical world, I will open a restaurant called Daddy-Os Burgers.

I remember one time my father-in-law, who's probably the biggest burger aficionado alive, was over to help me work on the land one summer. I was making burgers and asked him what he wanted (e.g., cheese, onions, tomatoes, etc.). He said "the works, put it all on". I then say "how about jalapeños, I am putting them on mine." For the first time ever he said, "yah, I'm going to pass on that one."

 

[gmerkt]

If the cities would modernize and allow for dynamic rates, and the taxi fleets were not limited to the number of vehicles it would be a lot more free-market. I'm all for safety regulations, but fixed prices set by the city, or by a board made up of business owners is antithetical to free markets and does the consumer no good.

The organized taxi association, the medallions, what looks like price fixing, that's all in the nature of protecting the rice bowl. Like what trade unionism is about. Which results in what appear to be artificially high prices. Uber, et al are about laissez faire/"free market," which some might consider a race to the bottom in wages. After all, presumably workers are also consumers. The part about limiting drivers, that works both ways. If there is no limit placed on the number of Uber drivers, doesn't it potentially reduce the take for each one?

I don't like paying via an app for a service that hasn't yet been rendered. I caved and installed Uber on my smart phone, which I don't use often. But if you want to play their game ... What I like is to pay AFTER the service has been rendered. If I pay in advance, it's before I've even seen the driver. I've wondered, what happens to my payment if the driver never shows? Or for some reason we just can't connect due to unforeseen circumstances? Stuff happens. I hope never to have to find out how difficult it is to get reimbursed by the controllers whom you never see. I do Uber once in a while when I'm in far-away places that don't have reliable service or to be honest, if taxi fare is just too high. Like the ride from IAH in Houston to Galveston. But the good thing about a fixed, pre-arranged price is that it can't be jacked. Like the Uber ride I had from downtown Newark to the pier in Bayonne, which should've been a 20 minute ride. Instead, we got a two hour tour around northern New Jersey all for the same pre-paid price. Good thing we weren't in a hurry. That driver was part-time for sure, clueless, no room for luggage in the trunk due to her baby stroller, didn't know how to read the GPS, etc.

Again as to payment. When I take a cab, I always pay with cash in any country. I won't give my credit card over to an individual cab driver, plain and simple. So you don't have this issue with Uber. Now, I'm not gonna go into any conspiracy theories. But one little detail I don't like about using Uber is the electronic trail you leave behind you. I'm an honest person, don't have any reason to fear leaving a trail. But I'm no more comfortable with it that some people are with gun registration.

One more comment. Rating systems. They aren't always to be trusted. You said yourself, five star system is basically a five star mandate. Kinda like the officer evaluation system was in the army. Evaluation systems can be just a form of eyewash, there for the public to think that someone cares. Honestly, I don't think I even knew there was such. I don't remember leaving ratings for the Uber trips I've taken and it's a good thing for the drivers I've had.

Those dynamic rates, would you believe they use that on Amtrak??

 

[bbbass]

The "tube meat" ground beef should be avoided if locally ground may be had. The tube meat is packed in the big plants where the number of carcasses blended together is many. The more beeves involved, the more opportunities for bacteria to be present and contaminate the entire lot. The locally ground beef tends to consist of content from fewer beeves.

When I can afford it, I buy the entire chuck portion of a beef as a whole at Safeway and have them do a custom grind for me... they even ask how much fat content I want. It's pretty tasty burg!

 

[Mikej]

The people that drive for those services, many do it full time, thus they are indeed professional drivers.

I'm sorry, but the term "Professional Driver" can not be attached to a driver that does not know and follow basic rules of the road such as, using the turn signal at the proper time, slower traffic to the right, right-of-way situations at left turns, four way stops etc...you get the idea.

 

[MannyGlocks]

Those defending uber and lyft: What's your connection to them?

Are you drivers?

Stockholders?

Ratings, ppppfff!

Yeah, they're absolutely trustworthy, right?

Plus, the idea that someone is going to rate me as a passenger is wildly annoying! Are you phucking kidding me?

This rating concept is extortionate, not to mention bizarrely capricious.

What next?

Grocery cashiers going to rate me when I don't get the groceries out of the cart fast enough to please them?

This sort of thing annoys the crap out of me.

Those of you that tolerate this buffoonery need to set your self respect sights way higher...

 

[Caveman Jim]

Yes, but only two stations. We still have one counter person, so after one try I never use the touch screen ordering. And I refuse to go to McD places that have only the touch screens and no counter help. Their loss!

Have you used the app ordering? We have a couple parking spaces for those that use the app. I don't know if I could do it. I wonder if they bring it out or the cust has to go inside to get the order?

I refuse to go to any McD's ever again....

 

[Caveman Jim]

Some misconceptions there, at least as far as Uber / Lyft is concerned.

The people that drive for those services, many do it full time, thus they are indeed professional drivers.

Regulations depend on location, but Uber and Lyft both have baseline standards, which are at least equal to, if not higher than most taxis. The Taxi industry clings to outdated, protectionist driven methodology that is at its heart anti-consumer - such as limited license or "token" or "medallion" availability, artificially inflating costs.

A good example of the standards - the average cab is a retired police or government service vehicle. 100-200+ thousand miles on it before it ever enters service as a taxi, and they're typically older. Uber and Lyft, for example have a hard 10 year age limit on your vehicle, and they do require periodic inspections, and the vehicles are required to carry a fire extinguisher and first aid kit on board.

Drivers are background checked, and being 100% app based - drivers are required to have a photo of them AND their vehicle, as well as the vehicle's license plate and description in the driver's profile. The passengers know who is coming for them, and exactly what the vehicle looks like. The stories of people getting into the wrong car, or with the wrong driver are because the passengers were idiots and not paying attention to the information at their fingertips. Unfortunately, the rideshare companies don't require pictures of the person requesting the ride - they have the option, but it's not a requirement. Further - both apps periodically make the drivers take a photo of themselves to match up to the on-file photo using facial recognition software. Literally you get a notification and you cannot take more rides until you stop and take a current photo. No taxi company does that.

Regulation in most markets is very similar to taxis - except that Uber / Lyft drivers cannot just stop and pick up random fairs, they HAVE to request rides through the app, and at least in the US and most westernized nations, riders cannot pay cash - the transaction HAS to go through the app. Additionally, unlike taxis, in markets that have restrictions on how long a driver can drive - this is enforced through the apps, not self reported or honor system based.

Most markets also have a government agency that oversees operation, driver training etc. In the Portland market, even if you're not driving IN the city limits of Portland, you are subject to Portland regulations and requirements, because that's where the TNC (Transportation Network Contractors) companies offices are. Portland, for example, makes Uber and Lyft drivers take the exact same city mandated training as those who drive a taxi cab. You must show "trade dress" which are the logos, with your individual business license number on the vehicle, just as taxis must display their taxi license.

A TNC driver must carry copies of their business license, insurance certificates, and inspection paperwork in their vehicle at all times while driving for Uber / Lyft and present them to authorities upon request. Like other commercial vehicles you are subject to being stopped and inspected randomly.

And like any other commercial / professional driver, you'll have a mix of good drivers, bad drivers, azzholes, and lost idiots. I've been a professional driver in varied capacities since I was 19 years old, and just being a "professional driver" doesn't mean you are a good one. Taxi drivers are as terrible as any, lots of semi drivers are terrifyingly inept, and God help you if you're within the turning radius of a municipal bus - your life is probably more in danger at that moment than if you're within arms reach of a crackhead needing a fix.

Based on that thorough depiction of what is required and my being retired, no way in HE II would I partake this job as a 2nd retirement income...

 

[MannyGlocks]

Anyone recall the China Social Credit Rating Score Sytem?

So uber and lyft wishes to emulate it?

Say WHAT?

Am I alone in thinking, this is something I wouldn't partake in if the stinking ride was free?

What's wrong with this picture or are you uber-doobers forgetting you still live in the U.S.?

 

[strick]

So I Drive for uber(mostly on the weekends in Portland, and out here in wine country in the evenings during summer) Some of the assumptions are simply amazing, 1, the rating system maters, uber will fire me if I drop below 4.6 and some people expect so much from a cheap uber ride and if they do not give it they will give the driver a 1-star. And yes the rider also has a rating too, and as a driver I would not want a rider who has anything under 4.5 stars, luckily that has not been an issue, however I drove last night and had this stupid college girl puck in my car near the end of the night, guess what I gave her, a 1-star, took pictures of the mess, reported it to uber and got a $150 fee(which I am sure she has to pay), I know uber has said they will be doing more to remove bad riders. While I enjoy driving part time for uber, I would never drive for them full time, and there is a simple reason why, not enough pay and to many drivers, and that is exactly why the medalion system came into existence, it was to insure that taxi drivers could make an actual good living(not great, but good) and yes, the old taxi drivers were in the place uber and lyft drivers are now.