Washington the public safety and semiautomatic assault rifle act

[shibbershabber]

Whatever it takes, however we can do it...

This has to die before it hits the ballot... If it's on the ballot, it will pass.

Gun owners are stupid. Conservatives are stupid.
We can't rely on our fellow like-minded citizens to defeat this.
We all know they don't vote and are too divided.

I've even seen people on this site defend the idea of raising the age to 21. You know they aren't alone.... they may not vote for it but cannot be counted on to vote against it.
Then the Fudds who don't believe in anything besides a Blackhawk and a Remington 700... They can't be counted on either...

There aren't enough 2A purists out there to kill this on election day.

Seems like gun stops are clueless or dont care. Gun show promoters don't seem to be proactive on it.
They should offer free tablespace at the entrance for volunteers to hand out fliers, etc

Once again, we will be out own worst enemy... Mark my words. It dies now, or it passes in Nov.

 

[arakboss]

Whatever it takes, however we can do it...

This has to die before it hits the ballot... If it's on the ballot, it will pass.

Gun owners are stupid. Conservatives are stupid.
We can't rely on our fellow like-minded citizens to defeat this.
We all know they don't vote and are too divided.

I've even seen people on this site defend the idea of raising the age to 21. You know they aren't alone.... they may not vote for it but cannot be counted on to vote against it.
Then the Fudds who don't believe in anything besides a Blackhawk and a Remington 700... They can't be counted on either...

There aren't enough 2A purists out there to kill this on election day.

Seems like gun stops are clueless or dont care. Gun show promoters don't seem to be proactive on it.
They should offer free tablespace at the entrance for volunteers to hand out fliers, etc

Once again, we will be out own worst enemy... Mark my words. It dies now, or it passes in Nov.

Oregonian here, how do you propose you are going to defeat this based on your voter insights (which I concur with)?

 

[shibbershabber]

A campaign of complaints calls to the businesses that are allowing signature gatherers... complaining about them being there hassling people, not about this particular issue of course.

Maybe they are being aggressive and making you uncomfortable, etc... something like that


Have free time? Go make them uncomfortable, without interfering of course, by 'monitoring' them to ensure theyre following the law.

Make a sign that says "11 people killed with rifles in Washington" or "A 19yr old can fight and risk his life defending the country but cant buy a rifle when he comes home" , etc. to point out how unnecessary the bill is.

Because we don't have a problem with 18-21 year olds killing people with rifles and shotguns. We don't have a problem with 'assault weapons' being used either. I think WA had only a couple hundred murders statewide last year... I digress.

I think legal challenges to the petition have been exhausted. All we can do is hinder the signature collecting.


Is putting a fake name on a petition (as a signer) illegal?
If not, doesn't a bad signature invalidate an entire page?

Im definitely calling any business where I see them gathering signatures... whether I actually shop there or not. You know, because I dont like being pressured to do sign my name to things when Im just trying to buy groceries.


Then, of course, the second its validated we need to campaign against it non stop.

writing editorials, calling radio shows, signs up anywhere that sells guns, get a table at local gun shows and pound the message home... hold signs outside of the gun show venue if you cant get a table.

I welcome Oregonians to come across the border and help too... because you know youre next.

We have to fight for this lifestyle, or it WILL BE GONE... we all know that once a law is on the books it doesnt come off.
Its clear that the NRA is only focused on spending resources on the national level... some smaller groups are on this... send them money and volunteer.

Maybe we can organize some kind of fund through Northwest Firearms to mount a campaign against this (and the petitions in OR)
Seriously. We will be lucky to have muzzleloaders when they are finished with us if we dont stop them.

I know we all vowed to do better next time after we lost I594... well here is our chance.

If youre not willing to fight for it now, save us the whining later... and save the blustering about having a shootout when they try to arrest you for your now-illegal guns.



well, you all get the point.

 

[Boss]

Greetings,

With the gunshops, I wonder if there is something like licensing, taxes, or other issues going on. The 'Keep our heads down/mouths shut, and we'll be able to renew our business license' or something like that? I could see it with ranges. 'Don't make a fuss, and they'll leave our range/US alone.' I dunno, but I'd certainly like to see something like one of the big associations reaching out to them and help motivate them to all 'get on board' ASAP. If even if it were just a flyers on the counter(s) or shooting benches.

The 'traditionalist' are definitely not helping if they won't take the time to vote against it. Worse is when they start flapping their keyboards claiming they're a gun owner and they support the legislation because it doesn't effect them personally. Because they think(or more correctly, have forgotten) that no one will look to enact legislation on their good ol' trap shotty or bolt action deer rifle. They're too dimwitted to think about the correlation of what they have now and what will be further labelled a 'weapon of war' and thus not suitable for 'average citizens' down the road. They probably have more in their safe that could be put into this category, or is at least 'close enough,' than they want to think about. If you bury your head in the sand, sooner or later your a$$ is probably gonna get run over.

However, many gun owners do often 'rise to the occasion'. If they did not, a lot more legislation would have passed earlier this year. They may not be posting or particularly vocal about it, but those voting gun owners are out there, and legislator know it.

But as previously stated and learned from 594, best way is to keep it off the books, cuz getting it off the books/overturned, has an up-mountain battle ahead of it.

Spread the word...

BOSS

 

[Diamondback]

The 'traditionalist' are definitely not helping if they won't take the time to vote against it. Worse is when they start flapping their keyboards claiming they're a gun owner and they support the legislation because it doesn't effect them personally. Because they think(or more correctly, have forgotten) that no one will look to enact legislation on their good ol' trap shotty or bolt action deer rifle. They're too dimwitted to think about the correlation of what they have now and what will be further labelled a 'weapon of war' and thus not suitable for 'average citizens' down the road.

This is why they're called Fuddtards.

 

[Dave Workman]

DONATE - Save Our Security | No on I-1639

I'll say something that may get me in a lot of trouble, but truth sometimes does that.

One thing I've observed over the years, at gun shows especially, is that a lot of people are big on rhetoric but last in line when it comes to donating a dollar, five dollars or maybe even a $20, to any kind of fight. People who think nothing of spending several hundred dollars on a gun or ammunition are suddenly tapped out. "Gee, I don't got a dollar."

Talk is a start, but action is the key. People can talk your ear off, and then expect YOU to do the rest, with YOUR vote and someone else's financial support.

For the past couple of years, your opponents have been constantly raising money. $5 here, $10 there from supporters. They send beg emails a couple of times a week to potential donors. "Won't you help by donating $5 to fight the gun lobby?" "Can you do your share by donating $10 to stop the NRA?"

I was at the WAC show over the weekend. At the SAF table is the "BUCKET OF BUCKS." A few thousand people came through the gate. If each one of them had tossed a dollar into that bucket to protect their rights, that bucket would have been full. The proceeds could help pay for yard signs, or for legal representation to fight the fight, or for a mailing to voters, or to help fund a voter registration campaign....or for advertising.


You're way behind the herd if you haven't donated to your favorite gun rights group. Well, now's your chance. Click on that link above and get in the game.

 

[Elf]

DONATE - Save Our Security | No on I-1639
[...]
One thing I've observed over the years, at gun shows especially, is that a lot of people are big on rhetoric but last in line when it comes to donating a dollar, five dollars or maybe even a $20, to any kind of fight.

Well, I just donated $20. Thanks for the link!

 

[shibbershabber]

Well, I just donated $20. Thanks for the link!

Same here.

 

[Boss]

DONATE - Save Our Security | No on I-1639

One thing I've observed over the years, at gun shows especially, is that a lot of people are big on rhetoric but last in line when it comes to donating a dollar, five dollars or maybe even a $20, to any kind of fight.

Put another way...'talk's cheap!'

If gun control advocates can't win on merit, they know they can continue with frivolous effort after effort after effort, sucking people into legislative actions and thus draining their wallets at the same time, hoping sooner or later, they'll win because no one can afford to stop them. And that's just fine with them.

There's no substitute for financial support.

BOSS

 

[MDL]

I am hopeful that our Pro 2A groups can deal a blow to I-1639 as was done to IP-43-44 in OR!

 

[shibbershabber]

I am hopeful that our Pro 2A groups can deal a blow to I-1639 as was done to IP-43-44 in OR!

It would be nice.

But if history offers any lessons here, they'll be at It again every two years or at it in the legislature... The is no double jeopardy rule in place here.

Disarmament is central to the left's goals and their vision of their ideal America.


What does it cost to start a ballot petition?

Could gun owners get together to put forward their own measures and stick it out there?

If anti gunners have proven anything it's that persistence works. Keep throwing it out there and something will eventually stick.
We should be switching from defense now to offense in the 2020 election.

 

[Diamondback]

We should be switching from defense now to offense in the 2020 election2019 initiative season.

FIFY!

 

[4whatitsworth]

It would be nice.

But if history offers any lessons here, they'll be at It again every two years or at it in the legislature... The is no double jeopardy rule in place here.

Disarmament is central to the left's goals and their vision of their ideal America.


What does it cost to start a ballot petition?

Could gun owners get together to put forward their own measures and stick it out there?

If anti gunners have proven anything it's that persistence works. Keep throwing it out there and something will eventually stick.
We should be switching from defense now to offense in the 2020 election.

You really have to pick the right year to do this. Both 2019 and 2020 are going to have massive amounts of Seattle liberals voting, 2020 because they all hate Trump and 2019 because 7 of their city council members are up for reelection. Even though they have come to hate the communist council, they still won't vote for anything pro-2A. It must be done when no one is looking, if you get what I mean.

 

[Diamondback]

And that's a problem, because we know they're gonna try this again next ballot cycle, and again in '20... if I were Bloomer I'd be shotgunning so many initiatives every election cycle (i.e., at least one every possible election of the year) there'd be no way we could stop 'em all, though I'd "Progressively" scale back. Start with something completely outrageous then come back with something that looks "reasonable compromise from previous"to the Uninformed Urban Masses and gets through while we sit back and rest after our "big win". Trump has a long history of using similar tricks in "The Art of the Deal." Then keep tightening the screws a little at a time, one small step each cycle...

 

[ozmosis]

Having a readable copy of it and stand next to the signature gather person. Every time they say " you can read it online later after you sign here" you can kindly offer your copy for there review. Highlight the part about liability, storage or the need for a Concealed carry licence to buy etc.
When they say it's just about safety and you don't care about kids you can say "two people donated 2 million dollars for this, that's a lot of Cancer treatment at Dornbeckers....."
Overall be informative, polite and truth will guide if shown.

 

[nwslopoke]

Those who don't study history are doomed to repeat it.

Boss

Ever see a refugee with a gun? I didn't think so.

 

[Boss]

What does it cost to start a ballot petition?

Could gun owners get together to put forward their own measures and stick it out there?

If anti gunners have proven anything it's that persistence works. Keep throwing it out there and something will eventually stick.
We should be switching from defense now to offense in the 2020 election.

Good question. That may well be the best way to engage/educate/reach a large 'middle of the road' audience. Those who aren't gun control extremists, but will sign 'just this one little safety measure to get rid of the bad/scary/icky/fully semi-automatic 'assault weapons of war' that 'nobody needs.'

The Lawful Gun Owner Safety and Protection Act (LGOSAPA) or something along those lines to promote 'safety, education, fun, and community involvement.' Fight fire with fire. An organized, lawful cause to rally around might be a good thing.

Also, just a thought: how about developing a list of emails of all the shooting/outdoorsman/pro-2A related stores, clubs, ranges, etc. in the state so emails could be sent out in mass saying 'Ummm, hey, have you heard of X, Y, Z...go to website 123 and please take the time to educate your members and customers. Here's an example flyer you can distribute' or something along those lines.

BOSS ​

 

[shibbershabber]

Good question. That may well be the best way to engage/educate/reach a large 'middle of the road' audience. Those who aren't gun control extremists, but will sign 'just this one little safety measure to get rid of the bad/scary/icky/fully semi-automatic 'assault weapons of war' that 'nobody needs.'

The Lawful Gun Owner Safety and Protection Act (LGOSAPA) or something along those lines to promote 'safety, education, fun, and community involvement.' Fight fire with fire. An organized, lawful cause to rally around might be a good thing.

Also, just a thought: how about developing a list of emails of all the shooting/outdoorsman/pro-2A related stores, clubs, ranges, etc. in the state so emails could be sent out in mass saying 'Ummm, hey, have you heard of X, Y, Z...go to website 123 and please take the time to educate your members and customers. Here's an example flyer you can distribute' or something along those lines.

BOSS ​

Definitely.

I feel like firearm businesses have been too silent over the years.
Maybe looking at short term gains over long term security... like the prospect of increased traffic via xfers because of 594?

Even manufacturers should get more involved. Like Barrett cutting off CA, Magpul leaving CO, someone else pulled out of sales to NY.
They have to know that the civilian market is important and they can't survive on govt contracts alone. Why so many manufacturers remain in CT and IL, etc I can't imagine.
States may change their tune of Glock, S&W, etc refused to sell to departments, ammo mfrs refused to sell... Until they relaxed draconian regs on civilian sales.

 

[Dave Workman]

Definitely.

I feel like firearm businesses have been too silent over the years.
Maybe looking at short term gains over long term security... like the prospect of increased traffic via xfers because of 594?

Even manufacturers should get more involved. Like Barrett cutting off CA, Magpul leaving CO, someone else pulled out of sales to NY.
They have to know that the civilian market is important and they can't survive on govt contracts alone. Why so many manufacturers remain in CT and IL, etc I can't imagine.
States may change their tune of Glock, S&W, etc refused to sell to departments, ammo mfrs refused to sell... Until they relaxed draconian regs on civilian sales.

This is all just swell, for someone who likes to sit around and talk about the way things oughta be.

This is the way things are: Gun owners are facing an initiative backed by billionaires. You can sit around and pontificate on the internet, or you can roll up your sleeves, help raise money for the political battle, and then help get people registered to vote, educate them what's at stake and make sure they vote.

I speak to a lot of people. It is appalling how many don't even know the names of their elected representatives. Some don't even know what legislative district they live in. Some don't vote because "I don't want my name on a list" or "My vote never counts."

Question: Just how stupid is that? I want to know. There must be some degree of stupidity involved here.

------------------
Here's a challenge.

Everybody who reads this has 24 hours to learn the names of his/her representatives, which party they belong to, and how to contact them. And make sure you can correctly spell their names.

Now, don't buy that pack of cigarettes for the weekend. Forget the cigar. Don't buy the sixpack or the 12 pack for the Friday night chill.

INSTEAD:
DONATE - Save Our Security | No on I-1639

The people you're up against are in the game. They are fanatics about it.They don't like you or your guns.

If you knew someone was coming next week to break into your home, take your property, hurt your family, would you do something now to prevent it....oooorrrrrrrrrr, would you just sit back, crack a Bud, and wait for divine intervention?


(Oh, and BTW: The firearms industry has been a busy bunch, fighting lawsuits, trying to work with Congress to prevent a lot of stuff. Don't wait for someone else to do something. YOU do it. Make it happen.

There are 3 kinds of people. Those who make things happen. Those who watch things happen. Those who wonder what happened.

Which are you?)

 

[shibbershabber]

This is all just swell, for someone who likes to sit around and talk about the way things oughta be.

This is the way things are: Gun owners are facing an initiative backed by billionaires. You can sit around and pontificate on the internet, or you can roll up your sleeves, help raise money for the political battle, and then help get people registered to vote, educate them what's at stake and make sure they vote.

I speak to a lot of people. It is appalling how many don't even know the names of their elected representatives. Some don't even know what legislative district they live in. Some don't vote because "I don't want my name on a list" or "My vote never counts."

Question: Just how stupid is that? I want to know. There must be some degree of stupidity involved here.

------------------
Here's a challenge.

Everybody who reads this has 24 hours to learn the names of his/her representatives, which party they belong to, and how to contact them. And make sure you can correctly spell their names.

Now, don't buy that pack of cigarettes for the weekend. Forget the cigar. Don't buy the sixpack or the 12 pack for the Friday night chill.

INSTEAD:
DONATE - Save Our Security | No on I-1639

The people you're up against are in the game. They are fanatics about it.They don't like you or your guns.

If you knew someone was coming next week to break into your home, take your property, hurt your family, would you do something now to prevent it....oooorrrrrrrrrr, would you just sit back, crack a Bud, and wait for divine intervention?


(Oh, and BTW: The firearms industry has been a busy bunch, fighting lawsuits, trying to work with Congress to prevent a lot of stuff. Don't wait for someone else to do something. YOU do it. Make it happen.

There are 3 kinds of people. Those who make things happen. Those who watch things happen. Those who wonder what happened.

Which are you?)

Don't know if that was directed at me specifically...

But I do my part. I donate to NRA, GOA and once you posted the link, I gave to SOS.

I know who my elected officials are and write them, despite the futility.

I take new shooters out whenever possible, etc

So yeah, I do more than pontificate on the internet... but there is a limit to one man's effectiveness.
It would be nice to see those with more power kick it up a notch