Planning for societal collapse. Guns or gold?

[SSG]

In the Book of Eli/The Road...gold is useless..it's about what you can grab, defend, ect...guns are where it's at...

But an economic collapse doesn't mean societal meltdown, or Nukes...it means that conventional investments and money are basically worthless...and even in those times, there is always something worth something...oil, water, timber, ect...whatever people need...find a need, fill it.

I am going to invest in ***** bars...

 

[EZLivin]

In WWII Germany those who owned desirable foreign currencies, gold, silver, and stock certificates were able to get out of Dodge and start a new life elsewhere. The rest stayed there and bartered with each other until there was nothing left to barter. Seems like a compelling reason to not sell all one's investments in order to hoard dehydrated cheese.

 

[slingshot1943]

I just hope you can't have too much ammo

 

[pogi]

In the Book of Eli/The Road...gold is useless..it's about what you can grab, defend, ect...guns are where it's at...

But an economic collapse doesn't mean societal meltdown, or Nukes...it means that conventional investments and money are basically worthless...and even in those times, there is always something worth something...oil, water, timber, ect...whatever people need...find a need, fill it.

I am going to invest in ***** bars...

Stack of ones please.

 

[Father of four]

Gold or guns? Answer= Gold Platted Guns.

 

[zeezee]

Gold or guns? Answer= Gold Platted Guns.

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Ammo, mags, food, safe water source, medical supplies, survival clothing, field gear and location are your primaries. Nice to have some gold/silver after you secure the above, to pay property taxes, etc when things get worse, which they surely will

 

[onearmedswordsman]

SHTF/TEOTWAWKI currency will be ATFE, as in alcohol, tobacco, firearms, and explosives (ammo included).

It is no coincidence that's BATFE's reason for being.

 

[djm68]

Interesting discussion...

In 2006 my wife and I came to the realization that the US economy was really in bad shape. We really feared not a total, over night, collapse but rather a steepening slide resulting in hyperinflation and in some cases, periods of absence of law and order.

What did we do? We sold off a good chunk of our stock portfolio and bought quite some gold/silver, food+water, and two 308 rifles, two 9mm pistols, a 12 gauge shotgun and plenty of ammo.

Since that time our remaining stock portfolio shrank some 45% while the gold we bought has risen roughly 25%; the silver has dropped roughly 10%; and the guns have essentially held their value.

I do not think gold will be useful in a full SHTF scenario -- like "The Road", but if that comes only a few things will matter...guns and ammo likely to be quite important.

Personally, I see gold as our hedge against hyperinflation -- if it comes, we have something to barter with. We have many friends and family across the Atlantic and if, for some reason, we need to leave North America and can not access US dollars, or US dollars are worthless, then I figure the kruggerands should get us passage on a ship to Europe.

If I were on a limited budget, I'd get stick with buying guns + ammo, food stuffs, medical supplies. When I see good deals on surplus wool blankets (and the like) I buy 10 of them; I use a few around the house and stow the rest in the basement; I try to make one "survival" purchase/month even is that is just some extra bottled water to store.

If you feel the need to get some sort of precious metal I'd go for silver as, currently, gold is awfully expensive.

Cheers,
DJM

 

[Gunner3456]

I believe that gold is good for at least two things:

1. A hedge against hyperinflation which is not accompanied by societal collapse.

2. A way to store a lot of money in a small space in case you actually make it to the other side of a real bad and long societal collapse.

During a real collapse, it might not do you much good.

Silver I like for "cash" use in bad times because it comes in small denominations. People might accept or might not, depending on how bad things get. It's also good for storing a smaller amount of wealth and a hedge against inflation.

I sure wouldn't put everything into precious metals though. That's for what's left over after I have what I believe I need for survival and daily life.

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Interesting discussion...

In 2006 my wife and I came to the realization that the US economy was really in bad shape. We really feared not a total, over night, collapse but rather a steepening slide resulting in hyperinflation and in some cases, periods of absence of law and order.

What did we do? We sold off a good chunk of our stock portfolio and bought quite some gold/silver, food+water, and two 308 rifles, two 9mm pistols, a 12 gauge shotgun and plenty of ammo.

Since that time our remaining stock portfolio shrank some 45% while the gold we bought has risen roughly 25%; the silver has dropped roughly 10%; and the guns have essentially held their value.

I do not think gold will be useful in a full SHTF scenario -- like "The Road", but if that comes only a few things will matter...guns and ammo likely to be quite important.

Personally, I see gold as our hedge against hyperinflation -- if it comes, we have something to barter with. We have many friends and family across the Atlantic and if, for some reason, we need to leave North America and can not access US dollars, or US dollars are worthless, then I figure the kruggerands should get us passage on a ship to Europe.

If I were on a limited budget, I'd get stick with buying guns + ammo, food stuffs, medical supplies. When I see good deals on surplus wool blankets (and the like) I buy 10 of them; I use a few around the house and stow the rest in the basement; I try to make one "survival" purchase/month even is that is just some extra bottled water to store.

If you feel the need to get some sort of precious metal I'd go for silver as, currently, gold is awfully expensive.

Cheers,
DJM

Get some

Body armor

Professional communications radios (not cheap FRS stuff)

Medical supplies, look into vet supplies

 

[Blitzkrieg]

SHTF/TEOTWAWKI currency will be ATFE, as in alcohol, tobacco, firearms, and explosives (ammo included).

It is no coincidence that's BATFE's reason for being.

 

[zeezee]

Interesting discussion...

In 2006 my wife and I came to the realization that the US economy was really in bad shape. We really feared not a total, over night, collapse but rather a steepening slide resulting in hyperinflation and in some cases, periods of absence of law and order.

What did we do? We sold off a good chunk of our stock portfolio and bought quite some gold/silver, food+water, and two 308 rifles, two 9mm pistols, a 12 gauge shotgun and plenty of ammo.

Since that time our remaining stock portfolio shrank some 45% while the gold we bought has risen roughly 25%; the silver has dropped roughly 10%; and the guns have essentially held their value.

I do not think gold will be useful in a full SHTF scenario -- like "The Road", but if that comes only a few things will matter...guns and ammo likely to be quite important.

Personally, I see gold as our hedge against hyperinflation -- if it comes, we have something to barter with. We have many friends and family across the Atlantic and if, for some reason, we need to leave North America and can not access US dollars, or US dollars are worthless, then I figure the kruggerands should get us passage on a ship to Europe.

If I were on a limited budget, I'd get stick with buying guns + ammo, food stuffs, medical supplies. When I see good deals on surplus wool blankets (and the like) I buy 10 of them; I use a few around the house and stow the rest in the basement; I try to make one "survival" purchase/month even is that is just some extra bottled water to store.

If you feel the need to get some sort of precious metal I'd go for silver as, currently, gold is awfully expensive.

Cheers,
DJM

Good advice, thanks.

 

[Just Jim]

So ya got this all figured out huh?

http://www.zerohedge.com/article/whistleblower-exposes-jp-morgans-silver-manipulation-scheme

Read it all guys

jj

 

[Gunner3456]

So ya got this all figured out huh?

http://www.zerohedge.com/article/whistleblower-exposes-jp-morgans-silver-manipulation-scheme

Read it all guys

jj

If anyone doesn't believe that commodity and stock prices are manipulated, he's blind.

World governments actually adjust the public supply of gold and silver, De Beers has the monopoly on and controls the price of diamonds, and big traders can "legally" manipulate stock prices simply by deciding whether to buy or sell. "Legally" if the international community doesn't get caught. Our gov't has jurisdiction only over our citizens, and only over what happens in the US.

We are just along for the ride. Still, gold and silver are the only way we can store (hide) a lot of surplus wealth over a long period of time especially if the SHTF.

If we have a complete meltdown which lasts for any significant time, regardless of the price of the metals coming out the other side, we will still have something of significant value if we stashed them. (If we survive.)

I don't buy metals in anything larger than (approx) one ounce, and only coins. It's too hard to make change for a bar of gold, and too hard to prove it's genuine if the SHTF and dealers are robbed and out of biz.

I believe that if we continue on the road we're on, that we will lose our homes to socialism. If they can confiscate my hard earned money for health care for losers for "the public good" and to be "fair" and for "social justice" then they can take anything else I have.

$.02

PS The only way I know to hide precious metals is to dig a hole 12' deep with an excavator. I happen to own one but if I didn't I'd rent one for a day. Put the metals in the bottom, and as the hole is refilled continuously add old rusty scrap iron of significant size all the way to the top. A metal detector will pick it up, but you could hope that someone would get tired of finding junk, and decide it was all junk before he got down 12'.

I would never bury any monetary survival item on my own property. That's too easy. I would bury tools and guns and ammo to protect it from casual burglars, robbers and fire on my property to keep it handy. I wouldn't dig the hole nearly as deep in case I had to dig it up by hand.

$.02

 

[Ranb]

Gold is worthless when the SHTF. I can't even melt it down and cast it into bullets. Water, guns/ammo, food and shelter are what you need. Anyone trying to sell gold is trying to rip you off.

Ranb

 

[Just Jim]

A long time ago the manipulation of the silver market by Bunker Hunt cause silver to go up to $40 an ounce. Once they found out the manipulation it dropped like a rock.

jj

 

[Gunner3456]

Gold is worthless when the SHTF. I can't even melt it down and cast it into bullets. Water, guns/ammo, food and shelter are what you need. Anyone trying to sell gold is trying to rip you off.

Ranb

Suppose you had $10 million in the bank but truly believed we were going into a complete economic meltdown and societal collapse which would last for years. You truly believed that the dollar would become worthless and that banks would collapse and that the only means of buying and selling would be barter for skills, labor, or whatever items you had.

What would you do to get that $10 million physically into your grubby little mitts and try to preserve as much of it as you could in case you survived and made it to the other side of the collapse when things stabilized to a reasonable extent?

I'm talking about a meltdown where the "brown shirts" believed they had a right to confiscate all you have for the "common good" and for "fairness and justice."

Please don't tell me guns, ammo, food, water, etc. You can't buy, haul, hide, protect or store $10 million worth of any or all of that. Please don't tell me real estate unless you believe that the government would never confiscate property.

How many things can you think of that you could do with the $10 million that's in a bank which you believe would collapse, and in dollars which you believe would become worthless, today? Right now?

Please list them.

 

[Gunner3456]

A long time ago the manipulation of the silver market by Bunker Hunt cause silver to go up to $40 an ounce. Once they found out the manipulation it dropped like a rock.

jj

It sure did. I knew two retired doctors who put almost everything they had in silver because it was going up so fast. They got wiped out of a life of hard work.

That notwithstanding, I'd rather pay $40 an ounce (I was thinking it went up to more like $50 but I'm too lazy to look it up, lol) for silver today, and have it lose 90 percent of it's value during and after a societal meltdown, than to have nothing after the meltdown.

I simply can't think of anything other than gold and silver which for thousands of years has always been accepted as valuable, which I could hide "for reaching the other side" today - right now - after I have already bought everything reasonable that I can think of for use during the crash.

 

[Ranb]

Suppose you had $10 million in the bank .....

I'm talking about a meltdown where the "brown shirts" believed they had a right to confiscate all you have for the "common good" and for "fairness and justice."

Please list them.

You might recall that nothing I said in my post said anything about money in the bank. Confiscation? If gold is $1000 per ounce, then 10 million in gold is about 625 pounds. Your brown shirts are not going to confiscate it? I think probably not as gold will be worthless if the scenario you suggest happens.

I am talking about planning ahead. Stockpile the goods you need in a secure place. Do not call attention to them. If the SHTF for real, then gold or any other monetary unit will be worthless to me. Barter will be the new medium of exchange as far as I am concerned. I can do this as I do not live in a city and can survive on my own and protect my family for a while given decent odds in a fight.

Ranb