Nazi terrorism on MAX

[Flymph]

Where is all the protests to ban knives. Every one of those evil objects of death should be destroyed. Nobody needs a knife. Knives cause violence and people who own them are insane for wanting one. All in sarcasm mimicking what they say about guns. The one thing I find interesting is that I looked at my granddaughters school notebook this weekend and it is decorated with very good drawings of various swords and knives well detailed to actual knives and swords. And nobody complains about this, what a crock this double standard is in regards to kids getting expelled for even thinking about guns.

I remember I had a good parent teacher talk for drawing the devil throwing away his pitchfork to reach for an m16... I was like 10... I told them he was reaching for the gun because it was more efficient. I just thought it was a cool drawing. They let me go when I laughed at them for having a bigger problem with the gun than the concept of the devil.

They just learned to accept that I liked to draw guns, tanks and battleships.

Sorry to derail things again, but it brought up a funny memory.

 

[Flymph]

So my well informed GF just told me that there is going to be two rallies over this... one in support of scumbag, and another against the scumbag rally which is also in support of the victims and relatives affected...

 

[Goosebrown]

So my well informed GF just told me that there is going to be two rallies over this... one in support of scumbag, and another against the scumbag rally which is also in support of the victims and relatives affected...

Oh goody....

 

[clearconscience]

Instead of keep portland weird
They may change the moniker to protest everything, then we'll protest your protest

 

[clearconscience]

I just wonder how ever police officer that shoots a BM do they immediately want federal hate crime charges when it isn't and this POS blatently should be charged with a federal hate crime and they are taking their sweet time considering it

 

[Goosebrown]

It always takes time for the Feds to decide and that is good. Regardless of who is accused. Once you claim something it is VERY HARD to walk back.

Remember all these people that get charged with murder but can't actually be successfully prosecuted for it when manslaughter would have convicted.

Once a charge is made you're locked in.

 

[jsparks747]

Just think what could have happened IF a good guy with a gun had stopped the knife attack?

The DA, the mayor, the gov and the senator's heads would have EXPLODED!!!!
Could you imagine how they would try to spin that one???????????

I somewhat agree with you, but disagree that the DA would have exploded. My dad is a DA of 32 years and I have talked to him about the situation and what he would have done if a good guy pulled a gun to deescalate the situation and he said that he would be perfectly fine with it. He used to supervise the unit that is handling the case and they have handled MANY cases involving the use of a firearm, They know their stuff. Also, DAs in that unit are not allowed to take a case if they have any relations within or are against any form of defense used by the victim.

 

[ma96782]

To me, the incident....

Reinforced the NEED for a 50 states carry law.

Aloha, Mark

 

[Flymph]

I recently heard of a guy walking free from murder charges because they charged him with murder with use of a deadly weapon. It was a pocket knife that is legally considered a tool and not a deadly weapon. The guy's defense was just that, and he was let go... free to kill again.

I know I'm never taking the max naked... F'that!

At least people are holding this vigil of sorts. Seems weird you would hold a rally to support the suspect tho. Maybe that's just me.
I have to say, it makes for interesting TV and is about the only time I watch the news.

Peace be with the victims and their families.

 

[JimmyS1985]

I just want to set the record straight, that the guy wasn't a big fan of liberals either. In the immediate aftermath of the knifing, he was talking in the squad car about the killing and said this "That's what liberalism gets you,".

My political leanings are Egalitarianism. I believe I am no better than most other humans on the planet, and they're no better than me. That said, in my youth, I use to experiment with racism/homophobia/misogyny, but eventually gave it up as I matured.

If this guy is shouting racial/religious/misogynist epithets, and then killing people who intervene who call him out for acting unhinged, #1 he's an extremist, and #2, he's very Anti-Egalitarian, or hostile to the concept of Egalitarianism.


My condolences to my fellow countrymen in the Northwest, these are tough times that we have to wait til these people commit a violent double almost triple homicide, before we can separate them from society.

 

[etrain16]

Such a sad incident, and one that didn't have to happen. This, in some ways, reminds me of the recent story of the guy back east that attempted to disarm a pistol-wielding bad guy. In both cases, people made decisions that, I think, shouldn't have been made, and in both cases, people ended up dead.

First, I will say the actions of the men who intervened and were injured and died, were heroic. Unfortunately, I think they were ill advised. I don't say that to in any way besmirch their actions as they did what they thought was right, and from a moral point of view, it was. From a practical point of view, it was a bad decision.

Look at the video of the rant he was making before this went down. He made threats to kill people on that train - he threatened to stab the Max driver in the neck. This wasn't just someone spouting offensive language, this was someone having a mental health crisis and making verbal threats of physical harm. At this point, it's time to GET THE F'CK OUT of the area and get the cops on the way. This wasn't an issue of hateful speech, this was a bonafide potential physical threat. Stay the hell away from the guy and try to get others away too.

I don't ride Max, never have and hopefully never will. So I don't know if you can move between cars? I assume you can. So, get your azz out of your seat and move to another car. If he stays where he is, great. How many folks with cell phones on that train at the time? Rather than just recording a rant, did anyone call the police to report his behavior? Once he made the threats, that should be a 911 call right there, period. Let the police sort out whether it's just talk or not. If you can't leave the car, can you stop the train? Is there an emergency stop? Maybe it's a good time to use it and get off the train. Sure it may inconvenience some folks, but what's inconvenience over murder??

If I had been on this train, I would have gotten away from a nutbag like this, as far as I could and I would have been on the phone with the police ASAP. Since I would be carrying, that gun would stay put up until I believe I'm in immediate danger such as being backed into a place with no escape. There is a difference between countering a loudmouth with negative ideas and recognizing that this POS is a true blue threat. But, folks were so upset over WORDS, that they failed to see the real threat, the threat of physical harm. Damn people, words don't kill, f&cking psychotic morons do. Geeze, why are so many folks so upset over the angry rants of the crazy people in our world? Let it go.

Last Saturday I was sitting outside my local Fred Meyer just before they opened. A guy showed up in the parking lot and was acting all kinds of crazy, kind of like this guy, only with more flair. He was running around, grabbing shopping carts and riding them through the lot while shouting all sorts of stuff at the top of his lungs. The store wasn't opened yet, but he tried to get in by ramming a cart into the doors. I didn't wait, I called the police non-emergency number to report him (I didn't call 911 because he hadn't directly made any threat to anyone at this point). Unfortunately, the store opened before the police got there, so he ended up in the store, causing problems for the staff and other customers. They eventually got him out of the store, at which point he did start making threats to the employees. I stayed far away from him as the store employees were now directly confronting him and calling the police themselves. Ultimately he left before the police got there (damn slow response that day), but no one got hurt. Point is that I wasn't going to engage this kook in any way. He wasn't a threat to me (or to anyone else, yet), so I just kept my distance and stayed very aware of where he was and what he was doing. As this wasn't really a confined area, I just maintained a safe distance so I could disappear if needed.

Think twice before you try to go all social justice hero over someone's words. Learn to recognize the difference between a potential deadly threat and a person with offensive views. Leave mentally ill people to the police and other professionals. And learn to let it go and leave the area if someone's words make your sensitive little ears burn too much.

Again, no offense meant to the men or their families. But please, people, make better choices so you can stay alive.

 

[mkwerx]

Cannot move cars on the MAX. They are two independent cars linked together. Sadly folks are trapped if things break bad in one car.

Always carry, everywhere. Always have at least one knife too - as a gun is not always the best tool for the task. Inside a train loaded with people a firearm is the last weapon I would be deploying - far too high of a chance of injuring or killing an innocent. Brute force and a blade are the best for that job.

Outside on the platform? I am much more comfortable using a gun if need be as innocents have plenty of room to GTFO and get to safety.

 

[etrain16]

Cannot move cars on the MAX. They are two independent cars linked together. Sadly folks are trapped if things break bad in one car.

Always carry, everywhere. Always have at least one knife too - as a gun is not always the best tool for the task. Inside a train loaded with people a firearm is the last weapon I would be deploying - far too high of a chance of injuring or killing an innocent. Brute force and a blade are the best for that job.

Outside on the platform? I am much more comfortable using a gun if need be as innocents have plenty of room to GTFO and get to safety.

Ah, I was wondering about that. I've ridden other trains, such as the ones in Chicago, and have moved into other cars when things didn't seem right in another car. Sucks that people end up getting stuck in those damn tin cans with little option to get out. I carry a knife too as an alternate/backup should that be necessary. In this case though, sounds like he easily overwhelmed 3 people with his knife, I don't know if getting close enough to stop him with another knife would have been possible.

I have a friend who is no longer in the area, that was an LE with Portland. He frequently worked transit detail. He said Max was about the worst of the worst, especially on the east side of PDX. He recommended avoiding riding Max if at all possible. He said they never had a boring night working transit detail.

 

[clearconscience]

I'm still curious as to how this went down.
How do you slash three people almost perfectly in the neck.
I always learned when a knife comes out you protect your neck and vitals at all costs.
Did he surprise attack them, were they already in a scuffle.

 

[Camelfilter]

Sad.

Wondering if a less than lethal tool being deployed would have been legal prior to him drawing his knife? Given his death threats, and acting mentally unstable.

I've taken to carrying pepper gel on occasion now, along with concealed handgun. Depends if I have room with what I'm wearing, or not though.

Once the knife is displayed, if I recall correctly 7 yards is too close for trained professionals.

So for your average concealed carry citizen tack on at least another half or more & it puts distance of a knife wielding do bad out better than 10 yards.

Add in innocents into the scrum, whom no one would ever want to shoot...

 

[Goosebrown]

I wasn't there but I doubt I would have drawn. Everyone who sees stuff like this should call cops instantly and avoid the guy. Real sad.

 

[Core]

Memorial Day week end:

MAX stabbing victim was Portland employee, Army veteran

Too bad he didn't have a gun considering he was an upstanding law-abiding member of the community, and an Army veteran, and a hero. I wonder how friendly the city is to concealed carry?
This is why I avoid gun free zones, that and the fact that I'm always carrying on or off body.

 

[Nick Burkhardt]

Too bad he didn't have a gun considering he was an upstanding law-abiding member of the community, and an Army veteran, and a hero. I wonder how friendly the city is to concealed carry?
This is why I avoid gun free zones, that and the fact that I'm always carrying on or off body.

The Army vet was also a City of Portland employee, so he was disarmed by the no carry policy.

 

[BillyJean]

Nope, I'm not letting that one go.

So don't peddle that fascist horse-pucky Heretic.
It doesn't fly.
Is Trump an American nationalist?
Yup, pretty much. But then again a lot of us are.

That doesn't make us nazis, or even remotely fascist.

I hate to jump in on a thread to point out something that I imagine will put me in pretty lonely company here, but I'll go ahead and take the opportunity to point out that fascism by definition is right-leaning, authoritian nationalism.

I don't say that to accuse any Trump supporter of being fascist—far from it—but many of Trump's actions since taking office are clearly authoritian, nationalistic, and one would be hard-pressed to find a more clear example of fascistic action.

Certainly American history has many examples of abuse of power, authoritianism, and so on—always at the cost of individual citizens' rights. In spite of (mostly liberal) personal attacks conflating distain and fascism, it is a real thing with a real definition, and Trump and some of his cohort are not coy about fitting its definition.

 

[clearconscience]

I would disagree. His actions have been to displace horrible over reaching policies from the previous admin