Humans And Their Amazing Ability To Adapt.

[American123]

This was back when conservative didn't mean religious.


It's not really an argument. The reason people get charged with two murders is the same reason people get charged with "carrying a gun in a school zone" after they kill 20 people. Added charges makes the sentence longer.


He took 5 days from the death of George Floyd on May 25 to denounce violence during protests, which weren't immediately destructive. So 2 days? May 31. Then again on June 2. I'll bet you saw that fake tweet that says it was August 30, right?

So Jan. 6th doesn't count? What event caused millions of conservatives to protest anything? You can't have a protest that turns into a riot if you don't have anything to protest and just stay home.


There are no "BLM riots" or "antifa riots". BLM is a slogan and a non-profit that does not control protests. Antifa is not an organization, but a description of people that antagonize right wing protestors. I don't know who burned what or looted - individuals did that, not members of a conspiracy. What organization organized the LA riots, Jan. 6 or the Tulsa massacre? Same problem. No one group did.

And some of the damage was done by right wing folks who wanted to taint the protests. But who is ultimately to blame for every incident can only be determined by arresting people and getting confessions.

I mean, you understand what a riot is, right? If you want to blame someone for the protests, Derek Chauvin is already in prison.


Because we have a census and voter registration and social security and ID databases. US citizens are documented many ways.


Correct. It was a response to American 123. Are you ignoring his posts?

When people aren't quoted it can make it hard to know who is talking to who - anyway - remember the presidential debate when Biden claimed Antifa was just an idea and they didn't exist as a group of people causing problems?

And yet they are organized enough to have web pages state their intent and goals.

 

[VinnieBoomBah]

And some of the damage was done by right wing folks who wanted to taint the protests. But who is ultimately to blame for every incident can only be determined by arresting people and getting confessions.

Case in point

Umbrella Man: Minneapolis police link suspect to white supremacists

The man was pictured smashing the windows of an AutoZone store in the city during protests.

www.bbc.com

 

[American123]

Case in point

Umbrella Man: Minneapolis police link suspect to white supremacists

The man was pictured smashing the windows of an AutoZone store in the city during protests.

www.bbc.com

That's called a scapegoat. "A man smashed windows" so I had to burn down buildings and loot things because of him…"

Uh huh…

 

[RX-79G]

When people aren't quoted it can make it hard to know who is talking to who - anyway - remember the presidential debate when Biden claimed Antifa was just an idea and they didn't exist as a group of people causing problems?

And yet they are organized enough to have web pages state their intent and goals.

I quoted both of you. Post 394.

Antifa is just an idea. There are no Antifa club houses or membership dues. They aren't Proud Boys or Oath Keepers, or we would also be looking at their social media feeds.

 

[RX-79G]

That's called a scapegoat. "A man smashed windows" so I had to burn down buildings and loot things because of him…"

Uh huh…

You can blame the arsonist who turns a protest into a riot. You can blame the protesters for having a protest. Or you can blame the guy they are protesting. Which makes the most sense if you have a burned building?

You're attempting to make a scapegoat of protesters.

 

[American123]

You can blame the arsonist who turns a protest into a riot. You can blame the protesters for having a protest. Or you can blame the guy they are protesting. Which makes the most sense if you have a burned building?

You're attempting to make a scapegoat of protesters.

Nope - I'm not. I'm saying that everyone is responsible for their own actions and not the actions of other people. People who set fire to buildings are responsible for that. People who loot are responsible for that. People who break windows are responsible for that. People who murder other people are responsible for that.

We can go round and round on this for hours, but what cannot be denied is that there was a massive dollar cost associated with all the riots / protests - whatever you want to label them as, which were predominantly claiming to be somehow related to BLM. Who those people were that were actually causing the destruction is up for debate.

Martin Luther King Jr's Marches and demonstrations led to massive property damage, arson, and looting just like the BLM marches - oh wait, no they didn't - I wonder why?

 

[RX-79G]

Nope - I'm not. I'm saying that everyone is responsible for their own actions and not the actions of other people. People who set fire to buildings are responsible for that. People who loot are responsible for that. People who break windows are responsible for that. People who murder other people are responsible for that.

We can go round and round on this for hours, but what cannot be denied is that there was a massive dollar cost associated with all the riots / protests - whatever you want to label them as, which were predominantly claiming to be somehow related to BLM. Who those people were that were actually causing the destruction is up for debate.

Martin Luther King Jr's Marches and demonstrations led to massive property damage, arson, and looting just like the BLM marches - oh wait, no they didn't - I wonder why?

So you think that the individuals that looted are responsible, but somehow that means that anyone who came to protest is also responsible for the actions of those individual looters? Which is it?


MLKs marches were carefully planned and coordinated. Since the BLM protests were not, there you go. Same thing with most of the protesters/rioters on Jan. 6th - they didn't have a plan. Which is why some broke the law and some didn't.

 

[American123]

I quoted both of you. Post 394.

Antifa is just an idea. There are no Antifa club houses or membership dues. They aren't Proud Boys or Oath Keepers, or we would also be looking at their social media feeds.

This is 100% propaganda to claim that Antifa is simply an idea. Ideas don't coordinate themselves in all black attire and attend events to harass, intimidate or otherwise disrupt events. The possession of a "physical club house" is irrelevant to whether a group exists or not. Hitler's brown shirts didn't have social media either…

Also, why when I type in "antifa.com" does it reroute to "whitehouse.gov" and promote the Joe Biden Presidency?

 

[American123]

So you think that the individuals that looted are responsible, but somehow that means that anyone who came to protest is also responsible for the actions of those individual looters? Which is it?


MLKs marches were carefully planned and coordinated. Since the BLM protests were not, there you go. Same thing with most of the protesters/rioters on Jan. 6th - they didn't have a plan. Which is why some broke the law and some didn't.

Individuals are responsible for their own actions, but the facts remain that in correlation with those events, regardless of their intentions, tremendous property damage, some loss of life, and violence took place. This is not a black or white situation you are trying to paint it as. If quite often that I marched down the street there was a lot of arson and property damage, even if I wasn't the person physically doing that, it would garner attention that my actions were relevant to the outcomes that followed.

Trying to equate January 6th to the other BLM focused riots is another false equivalency. There's video of the capitol police opening the doors for people to walk orderly, and rather calmly into the capitol building. The video of inside the capitol building is also extremely benign. How many fires were set inside the capitol building?

 

[Xaevian]

I'm so confused.

Finally, something people can agree on!

 

[RX-79G]

This is 100% propaganda to claim that Antifa is simply an idea. Ideas don't coordinate themselves in all black attire and attend events to harass, intimidate or otherwise disrupt events. The possession of a "physical club house" is irrelevant to whether a group exists or not. Hitler's brown shirts didn't have social media either…

Also, why when I type in "antifa.com" does it reroute to "whitehouse.gov" and promote the Joe Biden Presidency?

Well, if you want to call observing what other people did last time and imitating them, then yes, they are a highly coordinated. But really, they are aping the tactical gear of riot police and the right wing groups.

antifa.com is owned by someone, and that person redirected to a number of different places recently. Why don't you ask the owner? It doesn't seem like a very useful website for people actually interested in joining, does it? Looks a lot more like someone on the right bought it.

Fact check: Antifa.com redirects to Joe Biden's website, but Biden campaign not involved

Antifa.com is not connected to presidential candidate Joe Biden, though it started redirecting users to the campaign's website in August.

www.usatoday.com

BTW, why is it that conservatives love to talk about "individual responsibility", but then always talk about their opponents as hive minded groups? "The blacks". "BLM". "Libtards." Is it because they see themselves as having uniform opinions so they assume everyone else is like them?

 

[RX-79G]

Individuals are responsible for their own actions, but the facts remain that in correlation with those events, regardless of their intentions, tremendous property damage, some loss of life, and violence took place. This is not a black or white situation you are trying to paint it as. If quite often that I marched down the street there was a lot of arson and property damage, even if I wasn't the person physically doing that, it would garner attention that my actions were relevant to the outcomes that followed.

Trying to equate January 6th to the other BLM focused riots is another false equivalency. There's video of the capitol police opening the doors for people to walk orderly, and rather calmly into the capitol building. The video of inside the capitol building is also extremely benign. How many fires were set inside the capitol building?

"Their intentions". Who's? Who is this singular coordinated entity? You're the one trying to make a mess seem like black and white. Millions of people didn't show up to protest black deaths by police because they hoped property damage would occur.

I didn't make a false equivalence - I pointed out how they were equally the result of uncontrolled rioting, not planning. Or did Trump plan it all?

 

[American123]

Well, if you want to call observing what other people did last time and imitating them, then yes, they are a highly coordinated. But really, they are aping the tactical gear of riot police and the right wing groups.

antifa.com is owned by someone, and that person redirected to a number of different places recently. Why don't you ask the owner? It doesn't seem like a very useful website for people actually interested in joining, does it? Looks a lot more like someone on the right bought it.

Fact check: Antifa.com redirects to Joe Biden's website, but Biden campaign not involved

Antifa.com is not connected to presidential candidate Joe Biden, though it started redirecting users to the campaign's website in August.

www.usatoday.com

BTW, why is it that conservatives love to talk about "individual responsibility", but then always talk about their opponents as hive minded groups? "The blacks". "BLM". "Libtards." Is it because they see themselves as having uniform opinions so they assume everyone else is like them?

You have a lot of excuses for people who self proclaim as Antifa for a group that "is just an idea."

I've referenced Antifa and BLM - both represent themselves as groups. I haven't referred to "the blacks" or "libtards" in any of our exchanges so you'd have to take that up with whoever talks like that. (We are individuals you know)

BTW - why do many democrats think Black people have to vote democrat?

If this video is being censored you can just look up Biden saying "you ain't black"

 

[American123]

"Their intentions". Who's? Who is this singular coordinated entity? You're the one trying to make a mess seem like black and white. Millions of people didn't show up to protest black deaths by police because they hoped property damage would occur.

I didn't make a false equivalence - I pointed out how they were equally the result of uncontrolled rioting, not planning. Or did Trump plan it all?

"Their" - the people showing up to "protest peacefully" as you claim, regardless of their intentions, tremendous property damage, arson, and violence seemed to coincide with their (those who may have intended to demonstrate peacefully) demonstrations.

 

[RX-79G]

You have a lot of excuses for people who self proclaim as Antifa for a group that "is just an idea."

What excuse did I make? I live in downtown Seattle and have friends in all walks of life. If I put on black and went out on May 1 would I have "joined Antifa"? Because that's the only way I know of. (It's not through the Whitehouse.)

I've referenced Antifa and BLM - both represent themselves as groups.

Who has referenced them as groups, and who are they speaking for? I can declare myself the representative of white people, it doesn't make that true. I can buy a web domain and set it up to redirect to the Kremlin. Am I a Russian agent? You seem to really buy people's BS - if it confirms your bias.

BTW - why do many democrats think Black people have to vote democrat?

Mainly because some leaders of the Republicans hob knob with white supremists, talk about fine people on both sides of a white power rally, pass laws that make black votes less impactful or make them unable to vote? It sure looks like many Republicans think very little of black citizens, are comfortable making that clear with their public actions and want to insure that black votes don't sway elections. Why is it that Republicans behave this way?

 

[RX-79G]

"Their" - the people showing up to "protest peacefully" as you claim, regardless of their intentions, tremendous property damage, arson, and violence seemed to coincide with their (those who may have intended to demonstrate peacefully) demonstrations.

I went to some of the protests, and "they" didn't break or burn anything. Did I get the wrong "they" that day? Do the good "they" and the bad "they" have a schedule worked out?

 

[American123]

What excuse did I make? I live in downtown Seattle and have friends in all walks of life. If I put on black and went out on May 1 would I have "joined Antifa"? Because that's the only way I know of. (It's not through the Whitehouse.)

Who has referenced them as groups, and who are they speaking for? I can declare myself the representative of white people, it doesn't make that true. I can buy a web domain and set it up to redirect to the Kremlin. Am I a Russian agent? You seem to really buy people's BS - if it confirms your bias.


Mainly because some leaders of the Republicans hob knob with white supremists, talk about fine people on both sides of a white power rally, pass laws that make black votes less impactful or make them unable to vote? It sure looks like many Republicans think very little of black citizens, are comfortable making that clear with their public actions and want to insure that black votes don't sway elections. Why is it that Republicans behave this way?

This conversation is going 3 different ways simultaneously.

I asked a question about a website listed as antifa.com it was nothing more. I made no claims otherwise, that was you assuming. Which you seem to do often. You're assertion of confirmation bias is laughable considering you're still trying to argue that Antifa and BLM are not groups. "BLM" is most definitely an organization or how else do you explain the money that has been funneled to it and the subsequent mansions that have been bought with those funds by those managing those funds. Antifa does not have to have a top down command structure, with meeting minutes, and a headquarters to exist as a group. The fact that people organize in all black with "antifa patches" to exert force on others who are demonstrating or speaking is evidence of their existence as a group. Because it is a coordinated effort to disrupt those with opposing views.

Uniform - check
Coordinated goals - check
Working together against others - check

If you're incapable of understanding how that codifies them as a group - I can't help you overcome what appears to be a desired state of ignorance.

When you talk about politicians hob nob with white power people, are you still talking about Biden and the klan?

Democrats often assuming black people must vote democrat and must think a certain way that aligns with democrats. It really seems to irritate them when tribalism no longer works to keep them in a box and continue voting democrat.

 

[American123]

I went to some of the protests, and "they" didn't break or burn anything. Did I get the wrong "they" that day? Do the good "they" and the bad "they" have a schedule worked out?

Who is "they?" That you are talking about.

 

[American123]

RX-79G

RX-79G is a member of Northwest Firearms

www.northwestfirearms.com

I'm going to bed, chat more later?

 

[RX-79G]

I asked a question about a website listed as antifa.com it was nothing more. I made no claims otherwise, that was you assuming. Which you seem to do often. You're assertion of confirmation bias is laughable considering you're still trying to argue that Antifa and BLM are not groups. "BLM" is most definitely an organization or how else do you explain the money that has been funneled to it and the subsequent mansions that have been bought with those funds by those managing those funds. Antifa does not have to have a top down command structure, with meeting minutes, and a headquarters to exist as a group. The fact that people organize in all black with "antifa patches" to exert force on others who are demonstrating or speaking is evidence of their existence as a group. Because it is a coordinated effort to disrupt those with opposing views.

This is, quite frankly, stupid. "BLM" is ALSO the name of a registered non-profit that was created by three people. It doesn't control all the people that put BLM in their windows or on sign. No one owns a copywrite on the name. It is slogan.

Black is the uniform of antifa like stretchy pants are the uniform of yoga. Yoga is never accused of having a central command network.

Antifa is not coordinated. They aren't the Weatherman. They just go where they know there are rightists to annoy or riot police. Then they do heavily coordinated activities like throwing stuff or arguing.


Tell you what - prove that "white supremacists" aren't a single, coordinated group. They all say the same stuff. They all have light colored skin and guns. How could that not be a top down movement?

Who is "they?" That you are talking about.

Who is the They you keep talking about? Because you keep saying "they did this with their whatever and they are responsible for what they did". You're the one that keeps assembling coherent groups out of nothing.

Democrats often assuming black people must vote democrat and must think a certain way that aligns with democrats. It really seems to irritate them when tribalism no longer works to keep them in a box and continue voting democrat.

No, it is simply that Republican leaders are so unapologetically insulting to blacks that it is hard to imagine joining their ranks. But everyone gets to make their own choices: it is just a head scratcher what would attract minorities to the Jewish Space Laser party. And since there are really only two useful parties...