50 killed in Orlando Florida nightclub shooting, shooter pledged ISIS allegiance

[erudne]

Via Injo:

One thing I kept thinking over and over after Orlando was, what if one person in that bathroom had had a gun other than the killer? Would the killer have been gunned down, allowing for others to escape harm or death?

A week after the horrific massacre, you'd think some would finally come to their senses on allowing people to be able to defend themselves with a gun in a place of business in the event it comes under attack. Sadly, they haven't. President Obama visited family members of some of the victims on Thursday, who urged him to fight for more gun control in hopes of stopping future massacres. Bill Clinton said in an interview last week that club-goers shooting back at the gunman would not have been a good idea:

"Did you see how dark it was?" Clinton said. "It's likely that more people would have been killed."

But Mark Bando, father of Christopher Andrew Leinonen, 32, who was killed in the Pulse attack, shared a different take in a letter to the Detroit News:

If we'd spent the last 2 decades living in close proximity to each other, I have little doubt I'd have trained him to use a gun. After seeing the Paris massacre last year, I thought, "If only one of the intended victims in that large crowd had been armed, many lives could have been saved." I also thought, this couldn't happen in America, because surely, somebody in a large crowd like that would be armed, in the U.S. Wrong, history has repeated itself right here in the USA and my son and 51 others were slaughtered like helpless cattle, precisely because nobody in that club had a weapon to shoot back with.

Keep reading…

 

[PaulB47]

Good article.

Anyone who advocates disarming people, ought to be reminded that he is in agreement with the terrorist on that point.

 

[RicInOR]

Letter: Father of Christopher Leinonen speaks out (http://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/detroit-city/2016/06/13/letter-father-christopher-leinonen-speaks/85850766/)

 

[Ralgha]

A particular line jumped out at me from his letter:

When the shooting started Saturday night, I'll bet there wasn't a person in the club who wouldn't have traded everything he owned in the world, for a loaded gun.

The problem with many people is that they don't want to face the fact that there are some people in the world who are simply evil. They can't allow themselves to think about what they would do if their life were being threatened because it would upset their world view and they can't handle that. The reality is, though, that it's a very rare person who wouldn't wish for a loaded gun in their hand when a violent death is approaching them.

 

[Ralgha]

Bill Clinton said in an interview last week that club-goers shooting back at the gunman would not have been a good idea:

"Did you see how dark it was?" Clinton said. "It's likely that more people would have been killed."

If Clinton had been in that club, his bodyguards would have blasted the holy bubblegum out of the gunman, to hell with any innocent bystanders. Until he puts his money where his cake hole is, he can keep it shut.

 

[ma96782]

This guy was a closeted homosexual. They have found him on a handful of gay hook up sights. This guy easy could went down this path from following any of the major three Abraham religions "Judaism, Christianity, and Islam."
If you follow his story it's clear because of the teaching of those three religions his guilt lead him to this.

LOL.....we need a background check system before anyone is allowed to go to church.

Aloha, Mark

 

[ma96782]

The prospect of an "assault weapons" ban is not the most threatening among the Democrats' gun control bills. That would be the bill authorizing use of the terror watch lists to ban purchases of firearms. Such a bill would authorize the Attorney General (a non-elected political appointee) the right to deprive US citizens and legal US residents a constitutional right based solely on the use of a classified list, created through classified process, without any legal due process or recourse. In fact, currently the fact that your name is on that list may also be classified and can not be disclosed to you. The only way to get off the list (assuming that one could prove they are on it) is to file a lawsuit against the federal government and prove that you should not be on that list. In that lawsuit the government has the right to withhold information they deem is protected because of national security. Once the government has this power, what is to prevent the federal government from using this same process for other "restrictions"?

You're right.

LOL....OBAMA and Hillary (and some in Congress) would like nothing better than to put the entire membership of the NRA on a terro/hate watch list.

Oh yes.....it could happen.

You don't have to get the entire animal under the tent, on the first try. The nose can go in first. Yup, for some of us, we know the rest is coming. Some might say that it could never happen in America. And, some would say that America would be better off if ALL guns were prohibited (except for the Govt's guns).

Right? So, for right now.....it's the "assault weapons." What's next? The sniper bolt action weapons? How about those shotguns that can kill many people with just one trigger pull, due to the multiple projectiles? How about handguns because, they are concealable?

News Flash: Even the Nazis started off slowly.

Aloha, Mark

 

[nwslopoke]

I direct my anger at the police for engaging, then backing away for 3 hours and contributing to the deaths of how many?

Police don't have a duty to respond. If the scene is not safe they will wait for more back up. Too bad for you if you are getting face punched, stabbed, shot, ect...

 

[dwaineshort]

LOL.....we need a background check system before anyone is allowed to go to church.

Aloha, Mark

No just people that follow religion need to read , and be honest in what is written in their Holy books.

 

[RicInOR]

2 follow up items from today.
Could be speculative.

found on the Woodpile report:
"
It's reported there were seven armed police officers inside the Orlando club while the shootings were going on:

"After hearing reports of shots fired, Cornwell was at the nightclub only 38 seconds later... Within only two minutes, Cornwell and approximately six other officers had broken a large window and entered the club."

If the facts are as reported, they were ordered to stop, stand down and wait for SWAT. And they did. This was bravery without conscience. They hid and did nothing but draw their pay while listening to the screams and cries for help and the gunshots, protecting and defending only themselves. SWAT finally acted many hours later, long after some who could have been saved had bled out, abandoned and alone.

If true, Orlando's police department has earned and deserves unalloyed contempt. When it mattered most they betrayed an elemental duty and a public trust to do the right thing. It's reasonable to expect they would betray that trust again. I've put the full news item on top, below the old ad."
<broken link removed>

'I grabbed my assault rifle and ran': An officer's account of the critical early minutes in Orlando (http://www.charlotteobserver.com/latest-news/article85231782.html)

Police told not to pursue Orlando shooter for '15 or 20 minutes' -- maybe longer (http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/slf-orlando-shooting-first-minutes-20160621-story.html)

<broken link removed>


------------------

2nd item

Almost all those who died, did so after the SWAT team began it's operation.
The club was taken over at 2am, deaths were after 5am.

Judge: FBI Transcript Shows Nobody Died in Orlando Shooting Until SWAT Teams entered the Building - Freedom Outpost (http://freedomoutpost.com/judge-fbi-transcript-shows-nobody-died-in-orlando-shooting-until-swat-teams-entered-the-building/)

 

[Ura-Ki]

And that makes my blood run cold Proof that Law enforcement is unwilling, and unable to protect and serve, for which they swore and oath!

 

[Doc In UPlace]

Boy I highly doubt this. The clown fires a couple 5.56 magazines into a crowd of 300 and none of them die for four hours? That sounds like a barnload of straw after the horse has digested it, to me. Where are these "FBI Transcripts?" That press release says nothing about fatalities.
Better, I would like to see the medical examiner's reports indicating time of death on these victims.
Could be digested straw!

 

[Doc In UPlace]

Here is a story reporting what it was like for one of the responding officers:


ORLANDO — A scene keeps flashing through Officer Omar Delgado's mind, sneaking into his slumber every time he closes his eyes to sleep.

It is of his first look inside the Pulse nightclub. Dozens of people were motionless on the blood-soaked dance floor, and the Eatonville police officer had just burst through the club's patio door for a rescue.

"I yelled: 'Hey, come on, get up! Let's go! We have cover for you. Police! We're here,'" Officer Delgado said.

Nobody budged.

It took a moment for Officer Delgado, 44, to realize that the "signal 43" he had responded to — Orange County police code for "Rush! Officer needs help" — was not an officer down, but a massacre of civilians.

Officer Delgado, who had been working the night shift in a small town eight miles north of Orlando, was in the second wave of officers who responded after the initial shooting. He wound up spending hours inside, saving a few people and watching over the many dead.

"I thought they were playing dead so they would not get hit," he said. "It wasn't until I got my flashlight and scanned the room and saw so much blood from where all these bodies were lying. I looked to my left, to a guy who I guess got the worst end of it, and that's when it hit me: 'Wow, these people are all dead.'"

He arrived at the beginning of a three-hour standoff. Officer Delgado dragged some of the wounded to safety and took cover behind a wall.

Officer Delgado recounted a harrowing night of watching club patrons trip over corpses and writhe in agony as their bullet-ridden bodies were pulled across broken glass. The image of Brenda Lee Marquez McCool, with her shock of cropped white hair and tattoos, haunts him. He is among the group of responders who are likely to require counseling to find the will to return to work.

Officer James Hyland of the Orlando police is another. Officer Hyland, who did two tours in Afghanistan, said what he saw at Pulse was worse. "It makes me forget about a lot of the stuff that happened in the military," he said. "The situation was worse than being in a war zone."

Officer Delgado, a native of Puerto Rico who moved to Florida in the late 1990s, was responding to a disturbance in Eatonville when the first call for help went out.

He arrived to the sound of gunfire. He and two other officers ran into the club, fighting through the rush of survivors who were running for their lives. After a few minutes, some of the bodies started to twitch.

"They didn't want to give up," Officer Delgado said.

The floor was slick with blood and officers said it was too difficult to keep balance while carrying a person.

"Imagine being low, trying to grab somebody and drag them out," he said.

Angel Colon remembers.

"He grabs my hand and says, 'This is the only way I can take you out,'" Mr. Colon, one of the three people Officer Delgado saved, recalled at a news conference last week.

"I'm grateful to him, but the floor is just covered with glass. He's dragging me out while I was getting cut."

Officer Delgado flashed his light in a woman's face to temporarily blind her, so she would not look down and see that those were bodies she was tripping over. Ms. McCool, a mother of 11, was already dead, but he stayed by her side; some victims were shot in disfiguring ways, and he did not want that to happen to her.

"She was kind of my baby, per se, I was watching her," Officer Delgado said. "I knew she was gone."

He sent an "I love you" text to his three children, in case it would be his last. He eventually left at 9 a.m., and sat in his driveway in silence for 10 minutes, trying to remember how he got home.

 

[nammac]

And that makes my blood run cold Proof that Law enforcement is unwilling, and unable to protect and serve, for which they swore and oath!

Constitutional Sheriff's are our only hope... There's some of them out there... I honestly believe when push comes to shove, those constitutional sheriff's will draw the battle lines...

Back to the reloading bench...

 

[PaulB47]

The thing is to not depend on others for your safety. You are just a number, to them.

 

[RicInOR]

Follow up:

'They took too damn long': Inside the police response to the Orlando shooting
'They took too damn long': Inside the police response to the Orlando shooting

" Police fired at Mateen when he popped his head out of one of the bathrooms. The shooter was outgunned and outnumbered.

But then, police decided not to pursue him."


Jon Wayne Taylor: What Went Wrong With the Police Response to the Orlando Pulse Nightclub Massacre
Jon Wayne Taylor: What Went Wrong With the Police Response to the Orlando Pulse Nightclub Massacre - The Truth About Guns

"Instead, they allowed the enemy to reload and reposition. That was the critical error that resulted in an additional lose of life. People bled to death while they waited, and then the shooter killed more."






Police action in Orlando

<broken link removed>

 

[aikikenjitsu]

I heard and read that most of the people being killed just ran around or sat against the wall, many on phones, contacting friends and telling them they're going to die. Where was the fighting attitude that America was once famous for?! there was fifty or more people there, they could have thrown all kinds of things at him. They could have, as a group, picked up tables and rushed him and then grabbed him. From what I know, there was zero fight in those people.
As for the police, that will always be the case "When seconds count, police are only minutes away." That saying is truth, that's why it was created. Therefore people have to learn to take care of themselves. That's why more of this will happen, especially in states where they have taken the right to carry handguns when in public. If I couldn't carry a handgun, I would move to another state. Criminals and killers have no restrictions on carrying guns nor on how many they can carry on their person. They are so lucky.

 

[Member 5605]

I heard and read that most of the people being killed just ran around or sat against the wall, many on phones, contacting friends and telling them they're going to die. Where was the fighting attitude that America was once famous for?! there was fifty or more people there, they could have thrown all kinds of things at him. They could have, as a group, picked up tables and rushed him and then grabbed him. From what I know, there was zero fight in those people.
As for the police, that will always be the case "When seconds count, police are only minutes away." That saying is truth, that's why it was created. Therefore people have to learn to take care of themselves. That's why more of this will happen, especially in states where they have taken the right to carry handguns when in public. If I couldn't carry a handgun, I would move to another state. Criminals and killers have no restrictions on carrying guns nor on how many they can carry on their person. They are so lucky.

The 'pass'ification of the American male. That's what. Replace the A with U and google that.

 

[Nick Burkhardt]

Father of Orlando shooter attends Clinton rally, touts candidate | Fox News

 

[Member 5605]

Father of Orlando shooter attends Clinton rally, touts candidate | Fox News

What's interesting about this is that the media relations team selects who is going to be in the background. They do their best to pander to whatever audience the speech will cover. They want a cornucopia of colors and genders. Looks like they vetted him just like they vetted the information on Benghazi.



If you want some more information..
Google "Mateen visits [State Department] [Congress] [White House] [Hillary Clintons office] " and see the suggested search results.