When society collapses...

[Hueco]

Playing the game rather than being a curmudgeon, the absolute best (and hence most dangerous if people know you have it) things to trade are drugs. Small and light, easily stored/hidden, useful when needed like little else in the modern world.

Pain killers, antibiotics, antihistamines, benzodiazepines, etc.

In collapse they'll be most missed. We don't know how good we have it.

One of my greatest fears of collapse are the percentage of the population on psychotropics. You think people act crazy now? lol

This. Go look up "krokodil" if you want to see just how far people will go for a fix.

If the world is so messed up that you are considering barter of ammo, then that means people have given up hope on currency. Just think about how many dollars (in whatever denomination) or bullion and coinage is out there...and you mean to tell me that it is *worthless* in this future of yours? This would mean that, not only has the national government completely collapsed, there's no future in sight.

General survival will be the name of the game and you'll find that people form communities. No one will be trading for the first few months/years as people stabilize in this new environment. IF you happen to survive and IF you happen to have neighboring communities whom you don't fight with for resources and IF you choose to trade with them...then the goods of highest value will be the things that can no longer be made, especially the consumable things. Antibiotics. Insulin. Pain management. Then weapons and tools.

To be honest, if things get that bad, trading is so far down the priority list that I'm not spending any time thinking about it in any great detail.

 

[po18guy]

What's better "currency" for bartering?
Ammo or silver?

Both.

 

[Andy54Hawken]

"We deal in lead friend..."

All items or skills will have value at certain times and places.
What that value is , will be dependent on the need for that item or skill , much the same can be said for that item's or skill's cost.
Andy

 

[oremike]

If trading goods and services isn't part of who you are already, you are way behind the 8 ball. I don't mean as a sole way to conduct commerce in your life but more like offering you buddy a six pack to help with a project. Look at it this way, will you get more help out of the six pack or if you offer up a $10.00 bill which I assume is the approximate cost of a six pack?

 

[American123]

Think about it, it will be just like when Eve realized she was sitting on a gold mine. "Gimme that here apple, and you can have THIS!"

Except without rule of law, or at least rule of "I have gun and can kill you" a lot of that will be taken for free.

 

[The Heretic]

Trade goods can be stolen or attract thugs and need to be stored and protected, usually can't be easily moved. If you got ammo to trade you got ammo to be killed for.
.... A person with a skill has trade value and if it's a skill like first-aid, or fixing generators, booze production, food production, ietc.... it'll go a long way towards keeping you alive. Golf pro.... not so much.... but a medict?...you're golden!

The only skill I can use now for any length of time, is software dev.

I can maybe fix something mechanical (including hydraulic, pneumatic, etc.) that is simple, but it has been 35+ years since I did that and many mechanical things are now controlled electronically - e.g., I could replace the pads on disc brakes, but resetting the ABS? Nope. I don't have the tools to turn a caliper or a drum. I could replace wheel bearings, but I could not fix a spindle that has the bearing welded to it without parts. I can't even fix a flat tire without a new tire and a tire changer. I can usually diagnose and fix a vehicle's charging system (usually simple electrical), if there isn't something electronic wrong (who knows what other system is tied into the charging systems on cars today?).

I know all too well how complicated today's cars are - my car just last week or two decided everything is wrong at the same time; the ABS, the chassis stabilizing, the TPM, the gas cap is loose, and the front brake pads are worn down (they are not) - I suddenly got warnings on all of these systems one day. In short, the computer in my car is now very confused - runs and drives fine, but it isn't sure what the problem is or why. Time to take it to a specialist.

While I have a EE degree, it has been 30 years since I fixed anything electronic or electrical, I can barely remember Ohm's law. Plus it can take months to get up to speed on a given system, especially without a tech manual and schematics. I used to be able to do a little welding and some metal work, but again, been decades.

I want to have a shop with the tools and get back up to speed on some of these things, maybe get past where I used to be. Get a multi-process welder and learn TIG (never did do that, but I was decent with oxy-acetylene). Get a lathe and a multi-axis mill, and take some classes. Build/buy a heat treatment oven.

All I have right now are a shop, a small genset, a cheap drill press, hand tools, a hydraulic press, a small air compressor, some other odds and ends, and an a-frame hoist.

But I can't do any manual work for very long due my bad back and heart/lung condition.

 

[The Heretic]

Except without rule of law, or at least rule of "I have gun and can kill you" a lot of that will be taken for free.

And Eve will find someone who will protect her and in return for her "favors". Or she will be really smart and trade whatever for a gun and ammo. Or be really wise and have that ahead of time and instead barter for/with other things or services.

 

[TTSX]

All addictive substances will be worth everything to addicts. Nicotine, alcohol, caffeine are the most common and cheapest. If the stores were pillaged and winter was about to set in, ammo goes wayyy up in price. Shooting a squirrel with a .22 could mean living or dying. Silver.... In small enough quantities, not kilo bars, it could be established as money but so could anything what with perceived scarcity and value. "Fallout" sort of addressed this idea with bottle caps

 

[fstdraw]

I kind of agree with the takers. If you can't get what you want or need, don't ask and don't give a choice. Just my take on it.

 

[The Heretic]

All addictive substances will be worth everything to addicts. Nicotine, alcohol, caffeine are the most common and cheapest.

And each actually has a valid medicinal value/usage. Nicotene can be had in a number of different forms without the use of tobacco.

If the stores were pillaged and winter was about to set in, ammo goes wayyy up in price. Shooting a squirrel with a .22 could mean living or dying.

This is why I have as much .22 rimfire ammo as all the other calibers combined - or close to it.

 

[The Heretic]

I kind of agree with the takers. If you can't get what you want or need, don't ask and don't give a choice.

And get shot, or at least beaten real bad. WROL, that will be what many people resort to, and ROL is what keeps most people from doing that now. A "taker" may get away with it for a while, but eventually will try taking something from someone who would just as soon shoot them as look at them.

 

[P7M13]

A copy of Henny Penny. When people look at you like you're nuts, just choot 'em.
"The sky fell."

 

[Cosmoline]

Seeds, water and long shelf life food.

I'd take ammo over silver, but it wouldn't necessarily be for bartering... Can't kill a deer with a silver coin. Unless it's a weredeer, then I think we have a solution

 

[Longwalkhome]

Grave digger could make a good living in the times folks fear.

 

[CRBMoA]

More like a Back Hoe Operator!

 

[No_Regerts]

Grave digger could make a good living in the times folks fear.

And at these temps, things would get ripe, real quick!

 

[Longwalkhome]

And at these temps, things would get ripe, real quick!

Hopefully it doesn't ever get that bad.

 

[The Heretic]

Seeds, water and long shelf life food.

I'd take ammo over silver, but it wouldn't necessarily be for bartering... Can't kill a deer with a silver coin. Unless it's a weredeer, then I think we have a solution

Seeds - I need to order heirloom seeds in vacuum packaging/etc.

 

[The Heretic]

And at these temps, things would get ripe, real quick!

Backhoe or excavator, or if the dirt is loose, maybe a dozer. If nothing else, then an FEL if there is really loose dirt. Doesn't have to be real deep actually.

If nothing else, then pile them up, pour some diesel on them, some branches/etc. and light it off. But stay upwind and preferably do it in a depression so any liquids stay in that one place.

 

[bearingman]

At my age, a real shtf situation means I'm probably gonna die. What I collect silver for is the collapse of the dollar, which I see as a real possibility. In that case the silver will have more value than the money it took to purchase. Remember the purpose of money is to make uneven trades possible. Would you trade a warm coat for 1 asprin? what if the other party didn't have anything else to trade? that is where money comes into the picture, and silver has been money for thousands of years.