What do CCW holders do when they are pulled over?

[Partsproduction]

I also want to raise the point that information about my holding a concealed weapons permit should not be accessible to anyone once I've gone through the BS hoops.

The police should be concerned equally about everyone they stop, and I shouldn't bear any extra attention because I actually obeyed the law. I was told that information would not be sent out to anyone if stopped, and now I hear otherwise. To me this is an absolutely outrageous abuse of personal information. Concealed means concealed, period.

Nope, you guys will never get me to your side about talking to anyone about my legally concealed weapon, I respect police but courtesy means saying "Yes sir", and "I respectfully request having my lawyer present before answering any more questions officer". If I've done anything that warrants arrest that won't change anything, but if I haven't there will be **** to pay if they try to browbeat or threaten me. The best advice here folks is never talk to police without your lawyer!

 

[python287]

I got news for you guys - each of you with a CWP is already in LEDS - Law Enforcement Data System - if they run you - that automatically pops up telling them you have a CWP..
So they will already know it when they walk up to your car.

 

[spider]

I situate my CHL directly behind my ODL in my wallet, so when I pull my ODL out I always take the CHL with it, its a polite thing to do, because since only a few thousand people have these in the state, its very nice to let the officer now, cause at least by having that card, it says that you're a decent citizen. On my washington county sheriff ride along, I watched as the traffic officer was looking through a persons drivers record, somewhere along the scrolling he saw that the person was a CHL holder, but the driver didn't tell him that and coulda saved (the driver) a bunch of time, he told me he lets people go w/o looking at the insurance/registration, if the CHL is presented to him from the beginning. To catch some tabs, I've gotten out of 4 - expired tag tickets from driving my 68 camaro garage queen. and 2 - tinted windows violations, everytime the officer asked me where the weapon was located on me and to sit tight, seconds go by and I'm on my way again.

 

[theLEMband]

I got news for you guys - each of you with a CWP is already in LEDS - Law Enforcement Data System - if they run you - that automatically pops up telling them you have a CWP..
So they will already know it when they walk up to your car.

They may know the vehicle owner has a CPL, they don't know who's driving .

 

[PinkhamR]

Same goes for Oklahoma ... you hand the LEO your CCW and DL and sit there with your hands on the steering wheel (Engine off) ...

 

[JAFO]

What Partsproduction said.

 

[Gunner3456]

Our vehicles are all registered to a living trust. That adds a twist. I have a ccw but my wife doesn't. Just thoughts there...

That said, I'm going to hand over the D/L and CCW. I don't see what it can hurt.

 

[RVNvet]

I'm a former LEO. I got pulled over on Scholls Ferry on July 4th. I rolled down my window and put my hands on the steering wheel. When the officer got up to me, I immediately said, "I'm carrying concealed, and I have my permit with me." He asked if it was near my gun, and when I said it wasn't he asked to see it and my drivers license. When he cut me loose, he thanked me for telling him I was carrying.

BTW...in some jurisdictions, it is required that one tell any officer one confronts that one is carrying.

Max

 

[Partsproduction]

BTW...in some jurisdictions, it is required that one tell any officer one confronts that one is carrying.

As far as I know you must be talking about some other state. The antiAmerican types tried to pull off something like you are talking about at PDX and lost out before it got to court, and it would have!

 

[el gringo loco]

I don't think that is true in Oregon.

You do not have to tell the police that you are armed. And, in turn, they do not have to take the time to ask you if you have a CHL before they point a gun at you, prone you out and handcuff you. You might get shot before they learn you have a CHL and let you go.

If a police officer learns you have a gun by seeing it and not being told about it, they will treat you as a threat. I keep my gun a few inches from my wallet and would never reach for the wallet without first making the officer aware the gun was there.

Letting the officer know you are armed is a courtesy and a wise safety choice. Despite what some believe, an officer does not often know you have a CHL when you are first contacted. Yes, he might have run the registered owner. But, then again, he might not have. Computers go down, radio traffic may be heavy, he may have only ran the car, you may not be the registered owner of the car, or he may be at the window before the results of the computer check are known.

Telling the officer makes it safer all the way around and ensures nobody's actions get taken the wrong way. You might know you are a good guy, but the cop does not.

 

[Partsproduction]

You do not have to tell the police that you are armed. And, in turn, they do not have to take the time to ask you if you have a CHL before they point a gun at you, prone you out and handcuff you. You might get shot before they learn you have a CHL and let you go.

If a police officer learns you have a gun by seeing it and not being told about it, they will treat you as a threat. I keep my gun a few inches from my wallet and would never reach for the wallet without first making the officer aware the gun was there.

Letting the officer know you are armed is a courtesy and a wise safety choice. Despite what some believe, an officer does not often know you have a CHL when you are first contacted. Yes, he might have run the registered owner. But, then again, he might not have. Computers go down, radio traffic may be heavy, he may have only ran the car, you may not be the registered owner of the car, or he may be at the window before the results of the computer check are known.

Telling the officer makes it safer all the way around and ensures nobody's actions get taken the wrong way. You might know you are a good guy, but the cop does not.

The kind of "police officer" you just described is the kind I mentioned at the first, a miserable cowardly bully with a uniform.

 

[MarkAd]

I got stopped when i was wearing sweats and had my fanny pack with my 40 in it with my wallet in the front pocket.
I told the cop, as a courtesy i an carrying conceled, He says I know in your fanny pack.
Then he says you don't plan on shooting me do you?
Being myself I said only if I hsve to.
after talking about GUNS for a bit he rells me to slow down and I of course do.
So guns got me out of a ticket. Another good reason to always carry.

 

[el gringo loco]

The kind of "police officer" you just described is the kind I mentioned at the first, a miserable cowardly bully with a uniform.

You say cowardly.
I say well trained.
And the courts will say totally justified.

You have the right to not say anything. But, in my opinion, this is not about rights. This is about communication between two armed individuals in a situation in which one party has no prior knowledge of the intentions of the second party. Whereas the second party can be 99.9% sure that the first party is there to exercise statuatory authority and will only respond to perceived threats. You are ceding nothing by telling the officer you have a weapon. You are not giving up your 5th amendment rights because you are not incriminating yourself (you are legally carrying). You are simply clearly communicating with another person so that there are no fatal misunderstandings. If nothing else, consider it the gentlemanly thing to do (not required, just good manners).

 

[Partsproduction]

It isn't required! Sheesh!

Your police officers are assuming that I'm a threat to them somehow, it's their thinking that is irrational if they whack out like that. You are describing insane over reaction to threats that do not exist!

If my having a gun is that dangerous then we should abolish the second amendment.

By your way of looking at it keeping and bearing arms is wrong, and we should confess that we are doing something wrong when we are carrying.

If I'm in a restaurant and an off duty cop is eating at the next table and is carrying concealed should he tell me I might be in danger from his carrying a gun? Do you assume that because he is a police officer he doesn't need to warn me? Then why do I need to warn him? The idea doesn't make sense.

 

[dr*pop]

Apparently I ran a red light earlier tonight in Central Oregon, although I would swear that it was yellow (OR state law actually states that you must stop at all yellow lights anyway). Here is the conversation...

Officer: Do you know why I stopped you?
Me: (VERY politely with my license in hand) I went through that yellow light back there and I think it turned red while I was going through it.
O: No. It was VERY red.
M: I am sorry. It did seem to be yellow when I went through it.
O: Can I see you license and registration?
M: Yes, sir. I would like to let you know that I do have a firearm in the vehicle.
O: OK. Where is it located.
M: It is here in the center console.
O: Is it in a container or holster?
M: No sir. It is just loose in the console.
O: Do you have a permit for it?
M: Yes sir. My registration and insurance are in the console with the firearm.
O: OK. Well just leave them there and let me see your license.... Is this your current address? Is this your vehicle? Is your insurance current and who are you insured through?
M: (All answered very politely)
O: I will be right back....
O: (after returning)... Today I am only going to issue you a written warning. That is a very dangerous intersection at night. Just be more careful.
M: Thank you sir for giving me a break. I know you did not have to do that.
O: Have a good night and drive safely.

I have learned over and over RULE #1 is BE POLITE! This was my first traffic stop with a gun in the car, and I have to say that I was more than a little nervous.

 

[RVNvet]

I also want to raise the point that information about my holding a concealed weapons permit should not be accessible to anyone once I've gone through the BS hoops.

The police should be concerned equally about everyone they stop, and I shouldn't bear any extra attention because I actually obeyed the law. I was told that information would not be sent out to anyone if stopped, and now I hear otherwise. To me this is an absolutely outrageous abuse of personal information. Concealed means concealed, period.

Nope, you guys will never get me to your side about talking to anyone about my legally concealed weapon, I respect police but courtesy means saying "Yes sir", and "I respectfully request having my lawyer present before answering any more questions officer". If I've done anything that warrants arrest that won't change anything, but if I haven't there will be **** to pay if they try to browbeat or threaten me. The best advice here folks is never talk to police without your lawyer!

From your posts, I'm going to assume you are just 'trolling' for hostile feedback, and aren't really serious. As the CEO of a business, you must have a lot of common sense and decency, which your posts indicate you lack. As I'm sure you know, one of our many basic rights as a human being/American citizen/etc., is to give up a right, if the situation dictates. I had the right to not get involved when my nasty neighbor's house caught fire, but I called 911, anyway. We have the right to not help our elderly parents, but most of us give up that one. We have the right to not help someone in need, or warn someone of an imminent danger, but, depending on the situation, most of us will. Any racist who wishes to do so has the right to wear a KKK hood and insignia in north Portland, but I doubt anyone ever has...(LOL)!

To me, common sense tells me to immediately inform any officer I am confronted with that I'm packing, to forestall any possible misunderstanding. And by doing so, it most likely makes his tough job a little easier, which I believe is just common decency.

Max
(Former LEO)

 

[RVNvet]

Quote:
Originally Posted by RVNvet View Post
BTW...in some jurisdictions, it is required that one tell any officer one confronts that one is carrying.

Max

I don't think that is true in Oregon.

I think you're right, on the state level, but how about all the county and city ordinances? Since it is a requirement in some states, I'd be willing to bet it is in some local jurisdictions in Oregon, too. But I don't have the time to check them all out, so I'll just play it safe (which is moot in my case, since I'd inform the officer, anyway).

Max

 

[RVNvet]

I do not think that there is any local authority over CCL holders.

166.170 State preemption. (1) Except as expressly authorized by state statute, the authority to regulate in any matter whatsoever the sale, acquisition, transfer, ownership, possession, storage, transportation or use of firearms or any element relating to firearms and components thereof, including ammunition, is vested solely in the Legislative Assembly.
(2) Except as expressly authorized by state statute, no county, city or other municipal corporation or district may enact civil or criminal ordinances, including but not limited to zoning ordinances, to regulate, restrict or prohibit the sale, acquisition, transfer, ownership, possession, storage, transportation or use of firearms or any element relating to firearms and components thereof, including ammunition. Ordinances that are contrary to this subsection are void.

The operational phrase is contrary to. Requiring the CCW holder to inform a LEO would be in addition to, not contrary to, the statute. Such is the same with 'open carry' ordinances, and the 'fake firearm open carry' bans. Not that important to me, though.

Max

 

[RVNvet]

I don't argue that it may be in most circumstances better overall to inform law enforcement of your carry status if and or when you get pulled over. That said, there ARE guys out there playing cop with lights, uniforms, and all that. Minority scenario for sure. In most cases (like when I know I did something) I'll make it known early in the conversation but, in no way do I make the declaration S.O.P. if and or when I get pulled over. It's decided based on what I know at the moment at that time.

Your latest post reminds me of what I feel is one of our most important rights of all: We have the right to do anything we want, as long as (a) it doesn't violate the rights of someone else, and (b) we're willing to pay the consequences.

BTW...MERRY CHRISTMAS!

Max

 

[el gringo loco]

It isn't required! Sheesh!

Your police officers are assuming that I'm a threat to them somehow, it's their thinking that is irrational if they whack out like that. You are describing insane over reaction to threats that do not exist!

It is a reaction to a potential threat. An unknown person in a vehicle who, although they have a deadly weapon within reach has chosen not to tell the officer. That person moves in such a way that the weapon is exposed. Perhaps, because they do not realize it is exposed, or because they wish to use the weapon (the police officer cannot divine this), their hand moves in the direction of the weapon. Perhaps the person in the vehicle is already displaying a little agitation because he is not happy about being pulled over.

So the police officer is presented with a situation that, while each indicator may be explained away independently, when taken as a whole (in a split second, mind you) could give the officer a reasonable belief that the person was a threat because he was: (1) trying to hide the fact that he was armed from the officer, (2) the person's hand has moved toward the weapon, (3) the person is agitated.

Police officers are trained on the action/reaction principle meaning that they are taught that when a person takes steps to do you harm (ie. draw and use a weapon), that it will take as much or more time for the officer to draw and use his weapon. in other words, the time it takes for the officer to see the threat, process it and respond will make the best outcome an officer can hope for a tie. as a result, officers are trained to respond immediately to a perceived threat and to not pause or reflect on the situation in an attempt to determine the potential threat's true intentions.

You may not agree with this training. However, this training is a major reason why law enforcement has statistically, over the last forty years, gone from one of the country's most dangerous jobs (like coal mining) to one of the statistically safer blue collar jobs. This drop occurred despite the fact that police officers face significantly more attacks from armed suspects now than forty years ago.

If my having a gun is that dangerous then we should abolish the second amendment.

This is an irrational statement and you know it. It is disingenuous to pretend that firearms are not potentially dangerous. We carry firearms for that exact reason: BECAUSE THEY WILL HURT SOMEONE IF NECESSARY.

By your way of looking at it keeping and bearing arms is wrong, and we should confess that we are doing something wrong when we are carrying.

Again, you are not confessing anything because you have done nothing wrong. You are simply communicating in order to avoid a potential armed conflict. This is something we should all do whether interacting with a police officer or not. Communicate.

If I'm in a restaurant and an off duty cop is eating at the next table and is carrying concealed should he tell me I might be in danger from his carrying a gun? Do you assume that because he is a police officer he doesn't need to warn me? Then why do I need to warn him? The idea doesn't make sense.

Apples and Oranges. Are you contacting the officer as requirement of your job? Are you a representative of the government sent out in an enforcement capacity? Does your eating in that restaurant carry with it a high probability of assault or resistance? Is that police officer likely to think that you are the only person that stands between him and freedom? How many times have you been in a violent conflict with another person doing the same thing that you are doing at the restaurant?

I get that there is a school of thought that goes something like: "it is perfectly legal to carry concealed with my CHL and therefore it should not ever be an issue or topic of discussion with law enforcement." While I understand the argument on a philosophical level, I believe that people are being purposely obtuse when they pretend as if a traffic stop presents no danger to a police officer, that there are not people with guns who do present a threat to officers, and that there are not plenty of people who carry illegally. The officer has to take what little information is available standing at that window and, in a very short period of time, determine whether you are a threat. If he sees a firearm he must, in a short period of time, determine whether or not you are a threat, if the firearm is an indication of criminal activity, if he investigates will you become a threat, and how to respond to ensure his safety while performing his sworn duty. The fact is that a police officer is probably just as likely to encounter someone who is carrying illegally as he is to encounter someone who is carrying legally.