shooting down the road from me at the west medford albertsons

[itchyfinger]

I'm confused... How come everyone that is involved on here just signed up to the forum right after the accident?

me too

Support? We are all concerned about and support our 2nd Amendment rights and this is a public forum The comments here could possibly be used later during a trial for one purpose or another? Perhaps?

 

[sad papa]

Well as for me, the next day after the shooting I Googled Shooting at Albertson's, and This site was the first link below 3 0r 4 Local news links. So thats how I got here. And being a Shooter myself, reloading and such, I decided to sign up and join the forum. Every time I hear or read that It was justified, I get angry. If my friend hadn't told me how it all went down then I wouldn't be here. I just felt the need to let everyone know what really happened. It seems that everyone is still drinking the media koolaid. My Grandson is still crying alot and struggling with this. I know Jimmy was a bad Boy with a long rap sheet but I'm just having a problem with the way the marshall's handled the situation. Very unprofessional in my opinion and many others. Blatant disregard for the safety of all who were within range. My friend said the marshal's were shooting 9mm. I can't hardly believe they use 9mm.

 

[FarmerTed1971]

Fair enough. Welcome to the forum. So sorry it's under these circumstances.
Hopefully this can get ironed out. Get a good lawyer and get access to a copy of the video ASAP.

 

[tashworth1]

Well as for me, the next day after the shooting I Googled Shooting at Albertson's, and This site was the first link below 3 0r 4 Local news links. So thats how I got here. And being a Shooter myself, reloading and such, I decided to sign up and join the forum. Every time I hear or read that It was justified, I get angry. If my friend hadn't told me how it all went down then I wouldn't be here. I just felt the need to let everyone know what really happened. It seems that everyone is still drinking the media koolaid. My Grandson is still crying alot and struggling with this. I know Jimmy was a bad Boy with a long rap sheet but I'm just having a problem with the way the marshall's handled the situation. Very unprofessional in my opinion and many others. Blatant disregard for the safety of all who were within range. My friend said the marshal's were shooting 9mm. I can't hardly believe they use 9mm.

fair enough as well, welcome, you will find many great people on this site.

 

[sad papa]

Up date, Coroners report, Homicide. So out of 38 shots fired, they got 18 confirmed hits to the deceased. 2 were fatal, one to the face,and one in the chest-heart. I keep trying to put myself behind the drivers seat where my grandson was and I'm convinced the Lord protected those two boys in the back. I heard that the video didn't capture the event. Not sure yet. Also heard that one witness is pissed because one round missed his baby in a car seat by a mere 2" in the car. We will be seeing more and more as it unfolds. If you people don't want me posting here just say so. I know it's not your battle. But thanks to all for the support. If any of you believe in God, we accept all Prayers. Terry

 

[itchyfinger]

I heard that the video didn't capture the event.

What a HUGE surprise....

 

[PaulZ]

Well, Where else can you get a hearing on a matter like this, or find kindred souls to talk about it. Welcome all the new members and stick with it.

I'm confused... How come everyone that is involved on here just signed up to the forum right after the accident?

 

[PaulZ]

By the way: it is no doubt too late for the people involved but all of us should see this video:
Dont Talk to Police - YouTube

 

[WhyteCheddar]

Respect to those who lost a loved one, and I am not blowing smoke, I mean it in complete sincerity.
IF the Marshals acted recklessly it was in response to recklessness.
It was not the Marshals who put the passengers at risk. It was the Driver who's actions had the potentiality to be lethal to not just the LEOs but also bystanders and passengers. If he had simply turned off the engine and put his hands out the window he would still be here today.
It is tragic when a life is lost too soon. I am sure there were years of issues leading up to this event that had any one of them turned the other way than which it did we would not be here talking about this sad event.
Prayers for those that grieve.

 

[PaulZ]

It was not the Marshals who put the passengers at risk. It was the Driver who's actions had the potentiality to be lethal to not just the LEOs but also bystanders and passengers. If he had simply turned off the engine and put his hands out the window he would still be here today.
It is tragic when a life is lost too soon. I am sure there were years of issues leading up to this event that had any one of them turned the other way than which it did we would not be here talking about this sad event.
Prayers for those that grieve.

You read a list of posts and come to that conclusion? If you were not on the scene, belay that bilge and don't make excuses for the fascists before they need them.

 

[mkwerx]

You read a list of posts and come to that conclusion? If you were not on the scene, belay that bilge and don't make excuses for the fascists before they need them.

When it comes down to it - you have three choices when a cop, soldier, or anyone with a gun pointed at you gives you an order:

Comply, fight, or flee. The later two jack the chances of getting shot much closer to 100% than complying. In this case - the deceased knew he had a warrant. When the US Marshalls attempted to stop him - he decided to flee. At that point - HE put his passengers at risk for their lives. HE made the decision to run. Why he chose doesn't matter - he made the decision to flee with a vehicle full of innocent people.

I'm sorry that things got out of hand to the point where this kid was shot - but lets not make excuses for a convicted felon who has shown a history of poor judgement - the Marshalls didn't make him run. Grieving families almost never admit that their dead loved one did anything wrong, even if said dead loved one is a felon. How many stories have we all read where some "good kid" gets shot and killed attempting to victimize someone, and the dead kid's mother or grandmother gets on TV and swears her baby wouldn't hurt a flea and never did a bad thing in their life? It's always the police' fault, or the fault of the real crime victim. There's just no way for them to be impartial. Same with the passengers here - I'm sure their story will be that their friend hadn't done anything wrong (despite the fact that attempting to elude in a vehicle is itself a felony, and their friend was a convicted felon with a warrant out for his arrest.) They're young and full of emotion and have just gone through the most traumatic event of their lives.

I won't excuse abuse of power by authorities, but I won't jump on the "poor victim" bandwagon either - there's plenty of bad judgement and blame to be spread in this incident - but the lion's share has to be placed on the deceased. All he had to do was follow the marshall's orders and surrender. He'd be alive and sitting in a jail cell, instead of in the morgue, and his friends wouldn't have been gone through such an incident.

 

[WhyteCheddar]

You read a list of posts and come to that conclusion? If you were not on the scene, belay that bilge and don't make excuses for the fascists before they need them.

I have read every account I could find on the web including the comments from the folks here.
If you have found any accound that states he stopped and followed instructions from the Marshals I would love to read it and then modify my statement appropriately.
'Fascists'? Really?
Wow.

 

[Gunner3456]

In court, the police are almost always right. Almost.

Imagine you're in court and an officer says you were speeding, but you weren't. Who wins? Stupid question.

They can be beaten.

I'd highly recommend Carini and Francis, and see if one of them would take this on a contingency. They are the best but expensive as heck so... Maybe one of them (Peter or Bill) would see some dollar signs here.

I'm telling you, they are the best and unlike some lawyers, they like to take on the police. Unlike 90% of lawyers, they really know their business. Most lawyers don't specialize, so they aren't experts at anything, but these guys specialize in taking on police in criminal and civil cases. They are the guys other lawyers go to if they are in trouble.

Been there, done that, and was very happy to say the least. While they are very expensive, here's how much they dislike the pollice:

"If you want to handle your criminal or DUI case on your own, we will prepare you for your next court appearance. This service is free." And,

"Believe in the collective widom of the jury and the inherent goodness of ordinary Americans."

LINK

 

[Gunner3456]

I have read every account I could find on the web including the comments from the folks here.
If you have found any accound that states he stopped and followed instructions from the Marshals I would love to read it and then modify my statement appropriately.
'Fascists'? Really?
Wow.

There is a legal term called a "Jury Question." This will be the case here. Only a jury can weigh the evidence and determine what the facts are.

Or, sometimes cases settle out of court and we never know what the facts are, but at least each side had a chance to settle. If in the settlement someone paid someone a lot of money, you get a hint what the facts are. The government's settlements are public.

 

[mambo]

I'm confused... How come everyone that is involved on here just signed up to the forum right after the accident?

First, this was not an "accident."
Second, most but not all posters on this thread did sign up after the shooting. I think that speaks to the high value this forum holds for people.

 

[WhyteCheddar]

There is a legal term called a "Jury Question." This will be the case here. Only a jury can weigh the evidence and determine what the facts are.

Or, sometimes cases settle out of court and we never know what the facts are, but at least each side had a chance to settle. If in the settlement someone paid someone a lot of money, you get a hint what the facts are. The government's settlements are public.

I am familiar with this term and do not argue your point.
But this is a forum were issues and events are discussed an opinions are floated. I am not trying the case, but giving my two cents worth based on the information I have been able to gather. I believe my perspective is based on logic and a reasonable assesment of the information provided by all those (on both sides) who have reported their opinions and the supposed second hand witness accounts.

I also find it a little unusual for someone who is seeking legal counsel to be discussing events on a public forum. What are your thoughts on that?

 

[Gunner3456]

I am familiar with this term and do not argue your point.

I didn't say you were.

But this is a forum were issues and events are discussed an opinions are floated.

Agreed.

I am not trying the case, but giving my two cents worth based on the information I have been able to gather.

That would be called gossip, rumor, or hearsay. Take your pick.

I believe my perspective is based on logic and a reasonable assesment of the information provided by all those (on both sides) who have reported their opinions and the supposed second hand witness accounts.

That would be called gossip, rumor, or hearsay. Take your pick.

I also find it a little unusual for someone who is seeking legal counsel to be discussing events on a public forum. What are your thoughts on that?

I thought they were asking for possible witnesses which is good.

Since they weren't there, they are not testifying nor could they be corrupting testimony. Their statements would be hearsay and not allowed into the courtroom.

When we are in shock and grief, we tend to want to let it out.

Can't you feel their pain?

I am sorry to hear that they let kids talk to the police at all without a lawyer present. Those statements from those who were there, and therefore have admissible testimony will be twisted if at all possible.

The only reason I can think of for the police grilling the kids is for the police to CYA.

 

[derrickrf]

My deepest sympathies to all involved. I have a question to the adults close to the two 16 year olds in the vehicle, "Why were they in a vehicle with a felon who had a warrant out for his arrest?" I believe that is a decided lack of good judgement if ever there was one. If they had adult permission to be there or hanging around with a fugitive then some need to rethink what they are setting their children up for.

 

[WhyteCheddar]

My deepest sympathies to all involved. I have a question to the adults close to the two 16 year olds in the vehicle, "Why were they in a vehicle with a felon who had a warrant out for his arrest?" I believe that is a decided lack of good judgement if ever there was one. If they had adult permission to be there or hanging around with a fugitive then some need to rethink what they are setting their children up for.

In addition, anyone who knew he had a warrant and knew his location could be in trouble for not turning him in.

 

[WhyteCheddar]

I am sorry to hear that they let kids talk to the police at all without a lawyer present. Those statements from those who were there, and therefore have admissible testimony will be twisted if at all possible.

The only reason I can think of for the police grilling the kids is for the police to CYA.

You can call it what you like I guess but the intent of a forum like this is the exchange of ideas (opinions etc....)
There are clearly going to be two sides to this. If you believe my perspective is not legitimate then you seem to have made up your mind without having been there either.
We simply know (based on second hand witness info and US Marshall info, he did not turn off his car and surrender.
It is my perspective that what transpired after that is a result of his decision.
Like I have said before, if any evidence comes to light that shows otherwise I will be all too glad to modify my comments. I have no dog in this fight.