Preventing break-ins and squatters at addressed off grid cabin property

[arakboss]

This thread got me to thinkin' (which generally leads to stuff I shouldn't be doing) but....

Say, as mentioned earlier, I go on a 2-3 month business trip, because you know, I'm pretty much a world traveler, and a group squats in my house. When I come home and walk in, I find these arse clowns in my living room, eating my food, watching my NetFlix, crapping in my chitter and not flushing the toilet, and sitting on my Barcalounger with their shoes on....As can be imagined, I am not a happy camper, especially since my flight was an all-nighter from Bankok (not for the same reason @Stomper goes to Bankok) so a scuffle ensues. There's four of them. All really big, mean, tough dudes with chains, brass knuckles and man-buns so it's pretty much a fair fight at that point. Then one pulls out num-chuks (now, I've watched a bunch of Bruce Lee movies and I know what's coming) so I draw my CC and shoot all of them (just in the legs cuz that's what they want us to do). Police show up.....

My question......Who get's hooked up and goes to jail? Did I just protect myself in my own home, or...since these guys have started getting mail there, did I just break/enter and shoot a bunch of dudes in their home?

In Mult Co, remember don't drop the soap.

 

[American123]

What did you end up deciding for your preventative measures?

We have a similar situation in our family, but thankfully it's out of the way enough that people just aren't walking or driving in the area unless they already have a purpose to be there.

Seems like a camera hooked up to internet would be the best bet because it provides options to look around remotely, but then there is a cost factor that would run probably into the thousands territory because satellite internet is not cheap as I understand it.

 

[arakboss]

What did you end up deciding for your preventative measures?

We have a similar situation in our family, but thankfully it's out of the way enough that people just aren't walking or driving in the area unless they already have a purpose to be there.

Seems like a camera hooked up to internet would be the best bet because it provides options to look around remotely, but then there is a cost factor that would run probably into the thousands territory because satellite internet is not cheap as I understand it.

Not much has changed I have two trail cams now. I have cleaned up the front yard area a bit and have spent more time there recently. I replaced an old crappy window with a new one which is visible from the road. Doesn't help with security except that people driving by on a regular basis will notice that the place is being maintained even if they didn't see me when I was there. It makes it easier for me to see who is driving by. If Elan's internet gets cheap, remote cameras might be an option. For now I will have to rely on trail cameras.

With cameras I see two or three main reasons for them. Either hidden so you can catch image of people who trespass and or break in. Or not hidden to act as a deterrent so people don't enter in the first place. Or a combo of hidden and not hidden so you can do both. I think a combo of hidden and not hidden is probably the best bet. That was the point of a warning sign on the cabin itself, to make people who ignore the no tresspassing signs to worry that they are on cameras and that they have no idea how many there are or where they are.

 

[American123]

Not much has changed I have two trail cams now. I have cleaned up the front yard area a bit and have spent more time there recently. I replaced an old crappy window with a new one which is visible from the road. Doesn't help with security except that people driving by on a regular basis will notice that the place is being maintained even if they didn't see me when I was there. It makes it easier for me to see who is driving by. If Elan's internet gets cheap, remote cameras might be an option. For now I will have to rely on trail cameras.

With cameras I see two or three main reasons for them. Either hidden so you can catch image of people who trespass and or break in. Or not hidden to act as a deterrent so people don't enter in the first place. Or a combo of hidden and not hidden so you can do both. I think a combo of hidden and not hidden is probably the best bet. That was the point of a warning sign on the cabin itself, to make people who ignore the no tresspassing signs to worry that they are on cameras and that they have no idea how many there are or where they are.

I don't know if cameras are that much of a deterrent for riff raff this days, but if it was real time, it would allow me to know if I needed to make a trip out to the cabin to plant a tree.

 

[arakboss]

I don't know if cameras are that much of a deterrent for riff raff this days, but if it was real time, it would allow me to know if I needed to make a trip out to the cabin to plant a tree.

I have no idea what level of deterrence they might provide. I know if I was wanting to shoot a "forbidden" firearm at forest shooting area, I wouldn't pick one that was being monitored with cameras. I have to believe they will provide some level of deterrence.

 

[JohnnyMac]

I think a combo of hidden and not hidden is probably the best bet.

I agree. Make the cheapo visible and save the good cameras with better resolution hidden.

 

[arakboss]

I don't know if cameras are that much of a deterrent for riff raff this days, but if it was real time, it would allow me to know if I needed to make a trip out to the cabin to plant a tree.

Somebody (likely local) dumped a good size pile of ashes with garabage (twice) in the forest behind my cabin. On my Labor Day trip I plan on putting one of these types of signs at the dumpsite with a note on it saying to contact the Chiloquin Ranger District to report any illegal dumping activity.

 

[OldBroad44]

Put up a sign on the door and road gate, and throw a few of these in the front yard.View attachment 671731View attachment 671730

I suspect it is illegal to use boil hazard or radiation warning signs where there is no biohazard or radiation. Suspect neighbors would also report signs resulting in unnecessary very expensive inspection you would be charged for.

 

[Camelfilter]

Not much has changed I have two trail cams now. I have cleaned up the front yard area a bit and have spent more time there recently. I replaced an old crappy window with a new one which is visible from the road. Doesn't help with security except that people driving by on a regular basis will notice that the place is being maintained even if they didn't see me when I was there. It makes it easier for me to see who is driving by. If Elan's internet gets cheap, remote cameras might be an option. For now I will have to rely on trail cameras.

With cameras I see two or three main reasons for them. Either hidden so you can catch image of people who trespass and or break in. Or not hidden to act as a deterrent so people don't enter in the first place. Or a combo of hidden and not hidden so you can do both. I think a combo of hidden and not hidden is probably the best bet. That was the point of a warning sign on the cabin itself, to make people who ignore the no tresspassing signs to worry that they are on cameras and that they have no idea how many there are or where they are.

Wonder if you could rig up a TV simulator to work on 12V and a timer?

Would give a simulated visual of an occupied cabin at night.

Kind of like the radio idea.

Used in tandem perhaps?

Dunno if already suggested...

 

[titsonritz]

Wonder if you could rig up a TV simulator to work on 12V and a timer?

Would give a simulated visual of an occupied cabin at night.

Kind of like the radio idea.

Used in tandem perhaps?

Dunno if already suggested...

Use a loud recording of a couples Rottweilers going ballistic followed by "What's up boys, want to go outside? OK, OK, gimme a minute let me put on my pants and grab my gun."

 

[The Heretic]

Use a loud recording of a couples Rottweilers going ballistic followed by "What's up boys, want to go outside? OK, OK, gimme a minute let me put on my pants and grab my gun."

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[Tony617]

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Looks like that dog alarm is wired for 120v A/C. I suppose you can make your own adapter but be sure you read the inputs correctly and also A/C or D/C as well.

 

[Flopsweat]

This thread got me to thinkin' (which generally leads to stuff I shouldn't be doing) but....

Say, as mentioned earlier, I go on a 2-3 month business trip, because you know, I'm pretty much a world traveler, and a group squats in my house. When I come home and walk in, I find these arse clowns in my living room, eating my food, watching my NetFlix, crapping in my chitter and not flushing the toilet, and sitting on my Barcalounger with their shoes on....As can be imagined, I am not a happy camper, especially since my flight was an all-nighter from Bankok (not for the same reason @Stomper goes to Bankok) so a scuffle ensues. There's four of them. All really big, mean, tough dudes with chains, brass knuckles and man-buns so it's pretty much a fair fight at that point. Then one pulls out num-chuks (now, I've watched a bunch of Bruce Lee movies and I know what's coming) so I draw my CC and shoot all of them (just in the legs cuz that's what they want us to do). Police show up.....

My question......Who get's hooked up and goes to jail? Did I just protect myself in my own home, or...since these guys have started getting mail there, did I just break/enter and shoot a bunch of dudes in their home?

I wouldn't worry about it. If they're professionals your key won't work in the door anyway.

 

[wjv]

Leave a rodent proof box with some food in it. . . Like ex-lax re-wrapped as Hershey candies.

 

[OldBroad44]

There are pepper spray bombs which can be set to go on movement or a trip wire. They can be deactivated with a remote. Or timed to go off with a delay which alows you to deactivate them.

Problem. I think anybody you catch with a pepper spray trap is likely to burn the place to the ground or otherwise destroy it before leaving or return to do so. Or worst. Like poisoning any food in the place , setting up shotgun booby traps, salting the garden, poisoning the well, removing sections of the roof, etc. When you leave a place empty much of the time, you are depending on the good will of everyone to leave the place alone when you're gone. The problem is not how to prevent or stop squatters. Its how to do that without engendering their bad will or desire for vengeance. And that's a much trickier problem.

 

[arakboss]

I am going down to my property this weekend and I am going to park in the very back of my property and leave the chain up while I am there. By parking in front like I normally do, people driving by associate me being there with a car being there. If they see me around with no car they may think somebody could be home when no car is present. That could also make people think that more than one person is visiting the property.

 

[gmerkt]

The story that was liked above:

Outlaw Country - The Atavist Magazine

Klamath County, Oregon, is the perfect place to go if you don't want to be found—and the worst place to be if someone threatens your life.

magazine.atavist.com

This is a good case history story of conditions that exist out in the badlands. In the past, I had fantasies of buying a second property in a remote area. Physical security of the property was always a lingering problem. Over 30 years ago, I looked at desert property. Weekend or vacation property was always subject to predation by vandals and thieves. I wish I could find a few pictures I took of one place that I looked at. It was along a major highway, about 10 acres with the small house in the middle. The land had been completely cleared of all brush and vegitation and was surrouned by a chain link fence. Get this, the house was entirely covered with steel bars. Like burglar bars on windows, but in this case, the ENTIRE BUILDING was covered, including the roof.

One of my uncles (who is now dead) built a cabin in this same area. In the 1980's, I was asked to investigate a report of squatters living in it. When I got out there, the report was true but the squatters had moved on after trashing the place. Eventually, off-roaders and other vandals stripped the wooden siding off of it for firewood.

About 20 years ago, I was interested in some kind of remote property east of the Cascades. I looked at places out east of Okanogan, Wash. Just driving through some of these areas to get to these properties was like something from the movie Deliverance. You'd drive by, the many people lounging around their trailer dwellings would stare as you passed. And now I will come to the point.

When you as a "regular citizen," working a job in the city, "normal" law-abiding type, go way out somewhere in the boondocks, you may be leaving your "normal" world and entering an completely different one. You are the outsider and are buying into a place already populated by locals who live there full-time. They know every time you arrive and every time you leave. They have all the time in the world to do what they want with your property.

I'm not saying all remote places are like this. There are places some ways out, like Winthrop, Wash., which have become areas where a lot of well-heeled Boeing retirees have come to roost, in neighborhood concentrations of their own. So security isn't much of an issue there. But there are a lot more wild and wooly places just such as Tableland near Klamath Falls, as mentioned in the linked article.

It's a generalization to say that remote places are often populated by misfits, outcasts, various abusers, and other assorted weirdos who live there because they can't get along in normal social settings. Like cities and suburbs. And people who want to live cheap without working. So they go to remote places to get by. It is a generalization that is often a truism.

I've got other stories about my experiences in this arena but they would just be repetitious of what I've already written.

Always arrive armed and in daylight and never alone

Very good advice.

They told him it was a civil matter and refused to show up.

Yes, and eviction can be a long process because the laws in the PNW always favor the down-trodden, real or perceived.

The #1 deterrent they listed was a car parked in the driveway.

This is a very good idea, but be sure to keep it washed.

 

[The Heretic]

Cavedweller said:
The #1 deterrent they listed was a car parked in the driveway

This is a very good idea, but be sure to keep it washed.

This lasts about one day where I live. The road to my private road is gravel/mud. Then I park under a tree. Even if I wash it after coming home, in a day or two the car is covered with leaves/etc., not to mention pollen and dust in the air. You have to get up close to tell which vehicles are driven regularly and which are not - hint, the one that is usually by the house is my "daily driver" (which I drive maybe twice a month).

The best way to know if I occupy my house is to note whether I am actually there by seeing me - however, you have to trespass to see my house.

 

[dangerranger60]

I am guessing the cameras will deter most of the locals from breaking in. Keeping the property maintained and having the neighbors watching my place will hopefully keep squatters from making it an easy target to take up shop. That leaves the not so local locals who come by the place while visiting other locals or the ones that are just out for an opportunistic drive.

My Grandparents had an off grid cabin in an area with very few people around. They always kept it looking like at any min someone could be back. They kept the yard and driveway raked clean and the porch swept. There was always a clean ashtray and chairs on the porch.
They had a few uninvited guests over the years, but none that stayed.
They thought by making it look like someone would be there at any moment, Squatters would move on quickly. and by raking everything it was very obvious if someone had been there!
My cousin still has the cabin, but the area is built up with cabins everywhere, Power, Phone, and the county is pressuring him to put in a septic system. It's always just had an outhouse.
These days the cousin keeps trail cams around. some very obvious, and some hidden. Maybe this year I'll buy him some of the WiFi cameras as a thanks for letting us stay! DR

 

[arakboss]

My Grandparents had an off grid cabin in an area with very few people around. They always kept it looking like at any min someone could be back. They kept the yard and driveway raked clean and the porch swept. There was always a clean ashtray and chairs on the porch.
They had a few uninvited guests over the years, but none that stayed.
They thought by making it look like someone would be there at any moment, Squatters would move on quickly. and by raking everything it was very obvious if someone had been there!
My cousin still has the cabin, but the area is built up with cabins everywhere, Power, Phone, and the county is pressuring him to put in a septic system. It's always just had an outhouse.
These days the cousin keeps trail cams around. some very obvious, and some hidden. Maybe this year I'll buy him some of the WiFi cameras as a thanks for letting us stay! DR

Good advice. I plan on doing a little more work on the front yard this weekend. I need to do some painting too before winter hits.