Portland Ordinance

[unklekippy]

I have a question. Assume that no one, not a single person, applied for a carry permit and, thus, none were, of course, issued.

How does that hurt the anti gun Liberals? It seems to me that they would be delighted. The only people hurt, it appears, would be us, who could not carry loaded guns in Portland, and it would probably encourage other communities to pass similar laws.

But you see, I can carry a gun anywhere I want in this great country. I have no interest in "hurting" anti-gun Liberals, only in showing nothing but contempt for their fascism.

I have never been hurt by not paying money, taking a class, and asking permission for a right that was mine since birth. There is no way in hell that anyone can tell me that I am breaking the law. The states, counties, cities or feds are breaking the law. It's the law of the land and it reads "Shall Not Be Infringed".

Isn't it amazing that you have been brainwashed into believing that people following The Constitution are the criminals? How can that happen? You have one side firmly rooted in The Constitution and the other side that is firmly rooted in wanting to completely strip you of your rights and you are arguing for the guys that are on the side of stripping your rights. These people routinely state out loud what their illegal agenda is for removing the guns from free Americans hands and you believe that is the side you must appease? Do you see the problem here?

Stop pretending that ANY law trumps The Constitution. In any other argument against the BoR, no one in their right mind would wage war on the First, would they? No, that would be illegal to silence the people. It is just as illegal to disarm us and we are required to stand for America. If we don't, who will? A bunch of "educated" Socialist's that want nothing more than you in chains? It's your and my responsibility to stop people trampling the American dream, not hold the door for them as they illegally shove their hand down your wifes pants.

 

[unklekippy]

Father of Four, I think that you misread my post. I agree with everything you wrote. I am, in no way, defending laws that restrict our right to carry a gun, loaded or not.

My only point is that if we all rebelled and did not get a CPL, the collateral consequence would be less of us with the ability to defend ourselves and our families, and maybe even others, from random acts of violence, to the delight of the gun control groups.

I simply don't see the point of that. Now, if you, and others, want to carry loaded guns where not permitted and risk the consequences, I applaud you. That is, of course, an individual decision, which I suspect most of us, including myself, would be unwilling to take. We would not only be potentially harming ourselves, but our families, as well.

Others obviosly disagree, but makes no sense to me.

I will not be afraid of illegal laws and I will spit in their face. By all means, try me.

What you keep saying is "without illegal permission, I can't defend my family". I can. I can and I will until I die. You know that whole "...when they pry it from my cold, dead hands" bit? That's not just a romantic turn of phrase. You are dead wrong when you state that any patriot denying laws that The Constitution was put in place to stop in the first place is "hurting" anyone by showing contempt for illegal bullbubblegum.

The only ones hurting the 2A are the ones that voluntarily line up to have their rights removed from them. Like it or not, you did that the day you paid your hard earned money to have an illegal police force issue you an illegal "permit".

I wonder how many "Americans" will line up to get their permit to possess more than 5 gallons of gas, 25 lbs. of food(maybe we will be weighing things in kilo's, like that "European standard" we keep hearing about? The one that keeps the Euro's so safe.) or 10 gallons of potable water.

After all, you wouldn't want to be one of the "have's", when our dear O has made it clear that only the "have not's" make the rules, would you?

 

[LProf]

As I said, there will be those who disagree, and I respect those views. But, please, let's not let this get to be personal. Let's just politely agree to disagree.

 

[BillB1960]

I probably shouldn't bit on this, but I can't permit such an outrageous statement to stand. Surely you can't be serious. Are you really suggesting that the Nazis permitted Jews to own guns? The Nazis would have been beyond stupid to have done so. Cruel, vicious, inhuman, yes all of these, but not that stupid. You are attempting to rewrite history. It is not a question of what we want to be true, but, rather, what is, in, fact,true.

And yet as much as you don't want it to be it's true. You're just as wrong as good ol' unk here. He's resorted to insults and name calling and then can't understand why I'd never see 'eye to eye' with someone whose vision is limited to black and white. Apparently the only thing more limited than his vision is his intelligence.

 

[U201491]

I am not quite sure, isntwhat everyone saying kind of the same thing. No one likes these laws and each has the choice ultimately to obey them or disobey them?
Personally I hate all these anti gun laws and the people that forced them on us.
I didn't see anyone vote on any of them except for a bunch of city and or county hypocrites.
Frankly I do not think any law should be put on the books at city or county level without a vote of the people. That has always been my opinion. They aren't' legislators in any sense of the word.
This is a good topic, and it could be used as a place to figure out how to nullify the gestapo laws they put in. What I see with Portland is it will eventually go the way of Chicago & Detroit if more conservatives dont get a foothold there.
We personally, wont even go there or especially buy anything there with the mentality that exists there.
Its not much more than a liberal control zone. (zombie land) so to say.
Just thinking out loud here, maybe some misunderstanding on what was being said ?? I have read and re read, but still am not quite sure what set it off.
Maybe I better go back and read all again ?
What I do see is that Portland , Eugene, Bend liberals have far too much influence on the rest of the state, and that needs to be changed somehow before we end up like Colorado or Californicatia.

_______________________________
At my age I shoot forward a lot better than I run backward.
Rearward movement is only used for a forward Advantage and better sight alignment !

 

[NoOne]

I have been carrying concealed for well over 25 years, and have NEVER been asked to show identification, CCW, or any other type of authorization. Concealed means concealed, but for those wishing to make a point with open carry, knock yourself out. If someone chooses to disobey laws, and gets arrested, I usually wonder "What did they think was going to happen?"

My guess is that they wanted to have it happen, and the police are usually more than willing to help them out.

Whether I agree with the law or not isn't the point. There are plenty of laws I disagree with, and I choose to obey some, and ignore others. And I'm ready to pay the consequences for those I choose to ignore. Everyone else is free to choose whether or not they want to obey the "no loaded weapons" law.

 

[Father of four]

I am not promoting that we go out and disobey the laws. I am saying that by you for instant NoOne, going out and getting that CHL/CCW permission every four years, you are oking your rights away. I bet you disagree with having to get the darn CHL/CCW. I bet you think the CHL/CCW is unconstitutional. But when will you NoOne put your own foot down and say no more? When the government takes away your ammo from your concealed firearm? Would that do it?

 

[Father of four]

I am also not calling for a revolution, but just accepting the CHL, and possibly more infringements?

 

[Father of four]

If Portland and Multnomah County can take away my right to open carry my firearm loaded, why not the whole state? And yes, I could just cave in and ask for permission by getting a CHL.

Cant you guys see what I am saying or am I like totally off?


An awesome post!!!.........http://www.northwestfirearms.com/le...-playing-chicken-american-men.html#post944436

 

[U201491]

N

If Portland and Multnomah County can take away my right to open carry my firearm loaded, why not the whole state? And yes, I could just cave in and ask for permission by getting a CHL.

Cant you guys see what I am saying or am I like totally off?

No one likes having to have that chl, but we fought hard to get it enacted. At least people can be armed without confrontation.
There is one way to nullify Portlands absurd laws. 10, 20, 30 thousand people were to march on the city in defiance of it, it would nullify it, as they have no response that could stop that. Thinking out loud again. I would, personally rather carry concealed, if only to watch a perps eyes pop out when it appears to end his criminal episode
I have actually carried for 46 years now. Began back when they issued the old paper card when it was gun specific.
I Have not had to use it since then.
Avoiding trouble has much to do with the way you carry yourself and where and when you go.
Confidence in the fact you can and will defend yourself projects and most perps pick up on that and look for easier targets. Attitude is the bigger deterrent, the gun is only the backup if needed.
The best weapon is grey matter.
I actually dislike hsving to get permission to carry, but unless 10,000 of you would all join me for a walk, Ill just be glad for what I can do.
That is survival instinct
But try and come take my guns, I Will fight you to the death.
I will never live in a world that removes freedom comfort level we are entitled to. If you try to do that, bring a lunch. It will be a long day.
_______________________________
At my age I shoot forward a lot better than I run backward.
Rearward movement is only used for a forward Advantage and better sight alignment !

 

[Father of four]

I like your posts Taku but.."I will never live in a world that removes freedom comfort level we are entitled to. If you try to do that, bring a lunch. It will be a long day." You are and have been.
You are in your comfort level (able to exercise your 2nd amendment right) because you have opted for the permission (the CHL).

 

[Father of four]

I think...

People think that the CHL is unconstitutional and refuse to get it. (Me! I am not a felon, I have taken the concealed carry course and have the certification, I can pass the background check.)
People think that the CHL is constitutional and willingly get it.
People think the CHL is unconstitutional but get it anyways against their better judgement.

 

[Father of four]

Declaration of Independence

"...and accordingly all experience hath shown that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. ..."

 

[U201491]

I think...

People think that the CHL is unconstitutional and refuse to get it. (Me! I am not a felon, I have taken the concealed carry course and have the certification, I can pass the background check.)
People think that the CHL is constitutional and willingly get it.
People think the CHL is unconstitutional but get it anyways against their better judgement.

That is pretty close.
I really would rather we did not have to have any of that, but as individuals or even small groups they have us ove a barrel until that changes. We do not stand much of a chance taking on the JA's alone, so we beat them with their own tools and use that as our tool til we get backed into a corner. Then all bets are off, but until enough stand and do it right, it is a catch 22.
When people decide to take our country back, I'll be right there.
I have a cleaner record than most cops do, and not about to let them take that from me until forced to.
Screw with my guns and it suddenly comes to that !
I wasn't saying your belief was anywhere near wrong, as I feel the same. We just do it differently.

 

[U201491]

Cant you guys see what I am saying or am I like totally off?


An awesome post!!!.........http://www.northwestfirearms.com/le...-playing-chicken-american-men.html#post944436

No, you are on, but just different tactics.
And yes that was a great article.

 

[Father of four]

Its nice to have at least one of the thousands of members here to agree with me. Thanks.

We must be both totally wrong though. If we were right more people would surely speak up, right?

 

[Darknight]

This is a big loss and a stupid law. The judge clearly didn't have a handle on the facts if he thought that the number of loaded firearms carried by law abiding citizens on the streets of Portland was in any way correlated to the number of crimes.

On the bright side, and in no way do I mean this is to take away from the severity of this bubblegum, it looks like you can still carry concealed if I read this correctly:

166.173 Authority of city or county to regulate possession of loaded firearms in public places. (1) A city or county may adopt ordinances to regulate, restrict or prohibit the possession of loaded firearms in public places as defined in ORS 161.015.

(2) Ordinances adopted under subsection (1) of this section do not apply to or affect:

(a) A law enforcement officer in the performance of official duty.

(b) A member of the military in the performance of official duty.

(c) A person licensed to carry a concealed handgun.

(d) A person authorized to possess a loaded firearm while in or on a public building or court facility under ORS 166.370.

(e) An employee of the United States Department of Agriculture, acting within the scope of employment, who possesses a loaded firearm in the course of the lawful taking of wildlife. [1995 s.s. c.1 §4; 1999 c.782 §8; 2009 c.556 §3]

And open carry loaded.