OSP - Very PO'd !!! that I did not disclose my CHL

[RB87]

MountainBear, I'd love to agree with you but when I see a protest of 100+ NYPD's finest protesting felony arrests/charges against their fellow officers over ticket fixing, calling it "professional courtesy", well its hard to think highly of the profession.

 

[Tangent123123]

I feel sorry for the LEOs that come here to relax and socialize like the rest of us. You can't vilify an entire occupation based on a few bad apples. They share their information and insights with us and a lot of you guys treat them like garbage just because they are cops. Sure, they are in a position of authority and there are those who abuse that authority, but I think a lot of resentment stems from the fact that they have the authority in the first place. Americans don't seem to like anyone who may have any power over us, even if it's just the power to make us drive the posted speed limit.

So lets bet adults and resist the temptation to jump on the hate train every time someone brings up the topic of LEO's. It demeans NWF as a whole.

 

[The B]

Americans don't seem to like anyone who may have any power over us, even if it's just the power to make us drive the posted speed limit.

you're DAM right. so how the hel did we get to a point where a select class DOES somehow how the "authority" to make us peons toe-the-line??

 

[dmancornell]

Americans don't seem to like anyone who may have any power over us, even if it's just the power to make us drive the posted speed limit.

Guess you've never heard of the term, "consent of the governed".

That speed limit is in itself an abuse of power, concocted by greedy bureaucrats looking to steal money from motorists.

 

[badclam]

Police serve the government, not the people. Everyone here defending their wrong-doings are ignorant of the truth.

"When the government fears the people,you have liberty.When the people fear the government, you have tyranny" One of my favorite quotes from our fore fathers.
There are obviously a lot more good cops than bad. There are a lot of mediocre cops also. The power and authority we give them should be used with respect for the citizens they serve. Yes THEY serve US! When any LEO forgets who he is serving and starts to think they can justify a paramilitary approach to common citizens,I'm not talking felon's and such, I'm talking pull over's and street encounters with people who have made a minor violation of the law,They are bad cop's. LEO should be polite,calm,and in control of their emotion's until the person they're dealing with gives them reason to escalate the situation. I would like to assume LEO's are better at dealing with confrontation in a calm manner than me.
..I think it's funny that ignorance of the law is no excuse for a citizen, but seems to be for LEO's.

 

[tenringguns]

That's a bad stop. It's against the law. She can't pull you over for your speed then use it to go on a "fishing expedition," especially in light of the recent case law that was appealed and overturned Arizona v. Gant.

She didn't have PC (probable cause) to even ask about your CHL; that was totally irrelevant.

 

[Stomper]

Americans don't seem to like anyone who may have any power over us, even if it's just the power to make us drive the posted speed limit.

As a U.S. CITIZEN, I bristle at the notion of anyone being "superior to another", ESPECIALLY when its based on "birthright" like in a monarchy... flippin' inbreeds, and waste of money. I believe that "general" posture we have "against authority" is steeped in our national history, started when our founders had had enough and FINALLY told the "King" to go pound sand... like may what occur against our current government's actions and behaviors in the near future.

My wife is from Australia and had a "slight bent" against guns in the beginning, but as she has lived here over the last decade in our "culture" she has embraced gun rights, and realizes that "if it weren't for guns, we'd all still be British".

Guess you've never heard of the term, "consent of the governed".

That speed limit is in itself an abuse of power, concocted by greedy bureaucrats looking to steal money from motorists.

I would contend that the speed limit laws are NOT an abuse of power as they are legislated by a duly elected legislature of the people, and are needed for general public safety... who wants to get killed/maimed/disfigured by some a-hat driving 120+MPH on the highway/freeway... or through a residential or school zone?

Now how those laws are enforced can be questioned, like throwing up a few traffic cones and declaring it a, "construction zone, fines double" even though there isn't any work being done is one of my pet peeves!

Reasonable and considerate people seldom run afoul of "the law", nor do they "trespass" against other individuals... Laws are for the lawless.

 

[Father of four]

I feel sorry for the LEOs that come here to relax and socialize like the rest of us. You can't vilify an entire occupation based on a few bad apples. They share their information and insights with us and a lot of you guys treat them like garbage just because they are cops. Sure, they are in a position of authority and there are those who abuse that authority, but I think a lot of resentment stems from the fact that they have the authority in the first place. Americans don't seem to like anyone who may have any power over us, even if it's just the power to make us drive the posted speed limit.

So lets bet adults and resist the temptation to jump on the hate train every time someone brings up the topic of LEO's. It demeans NWF as a whole.

I do not mean to offend all of the LEOS that visit this site. But I will call out the BAD LEOs. I think its the Good LEOs responsibility to keep the Bad ones in check. But when they don't, its Our responsibility to get onto both of them. The one for doing something bad and the other for...really covering up for them.

I have no problem with authority. We need Honest LEO's, some laws, some rules, some regulations, an honest court system...etc. What do we have today? A BUNCH of our authority run a-muck. Should we keep quiet?

 

[dmancornell]

I would contend that the speed limit laws are NOT an abuse of power as they are legislated by a duly elected legislature of the people, and are needed for general public safety... who wants to get killed/maimed/disfigured by some a-hat driving 120+MPH on the highway/freeway... or through a residential or school zone?

As if speed limits actually stop said asshats from going 120mph. As if going 30mph in front of a school deserves a $300 fine because kids apparently have no necks to turn and look before crossing, like any responsible parent should teach. Just like gun control "laws", the only people they harm are decent citizens.

The fact that speed limits have been staying the same, or even dropping, despite vast improvement in automobile technology in the last 30 years, is indicative that the entire "road safety" claim is a lie and a scam.

The drug war was enacted by a "duly elected legislature", does that make the drug war morally correct?

 

[Tangent123123]

I do not mean to offend all of the LEOS that visit this site. But I will call out the BAD LEOs. I think its the Good LEOs responsibility to keep the Bad ones in check. But when they don't, its Our responsibility to get onto both of them. The one for doing something bad and the other for...really covering up for them.

I have no problem with authority. We need Honest LEO's, some laws, some rules, some regulations, an honest court system...etc. What do we have today? A BUNCH of our authority run a-muck. Should we keep quiet?

I totally agree with you. A bad stop is a bad stop and the officer in question should be called on it. But we have some members who take things to the next level due to some bad personal experiences and thats the type of thing that doesn't belong in the forums. There is enough hate out there already without us adding to it.

But more on topic with the thread. If stopped for speeding I deserve the ticket, but it's none of the officers business if I am carrying or not and I'm not about to volunteer the information. If she wanted to make an issue bout it, I'd get her badge number and file a complaint. Arguing with her one the side of the road is a lose/lose situation.

 

[Tangent123123]

Guess you've never heard of the term, "consent of the governed".

That speed limit is in itself an abuse of power, concocted by greedy bureaucrats looking to steal money from motorists.

Driving is considered a privledge, not a right. When you sign the paperwork to receive your drivers license you are agreeing to be governed by the driving laws of that state. You agree to follow the rules and the government feels it has the right to enforce those laws. It's a social contract that we all function under for the good of the populace.

Though we don't always agree with the terms of that contact we are all bound by it. We are within our rights to vote for a representative that we feel best represents our views and adjusts that contact for us. The only other alternative is anarchy.

 

[The B]

Driving is considered a privledge, not a right. When you sign the paperwork to receive your drivers license you are agreeing to be governed by the driving laws of that state. You agree to follow the rules and the government feels it has the right to enforce those laws. It's a social contract that we all function under for the good of the populace.

Though we don't always agree with the terms of that contact we are all bound by it. We are within our rights to vote for a representative that we feel best represents our views and adjusts that contact for us. The only other alternative is anarchy.

the only alternative to a traffic code 5000 pages thick is anarchy? there's a **** of a lot of middle ground you're missing.

 

[Tangent123123]

hahaha.. Well that's true. But those pencil pushers just can't seem to help themselves. Once they start writing, they just can't stop. We don't do the "middle ground" very well. It's one extreme or another in this country.

 

[Grunwald]

hahaha.. Well that's true. But those pencil pushers just can't seem to help themselves. Once they start writing, they just can't stop. We don't do the "middle ground" very well. It's one extreme or another in this country.

If you think that the traffic laws are bad in the US, try Europe. They have enough traffic signs to make one want to buy a horse.

 

[pchewn]

If you think that the traffic laws are bad in the US, try Europe. They have enough traffic signs to make one want to buy a horse.

1) Do the europeons follow those traffic signs? (Europeon spelled correctly).
2) Do the police use the traffic laws (speeding tickets) as a source of revenue?

 

[Jamie6.5]

The fact that speed limits have been staying the same, or even dropping, despite vast improvement in automobile technology in the last 30 years, is indicative that the entire "road safety" claim is a lie and a scam.

As long as insurance companies that comprise the largest and most well funded lobbies in congress and the state legislatures, are allowed to keep giving vast sums of money to our representatives, this will be the case.
It has nothing to do with constitutional law and order (which I happen to agree with).
It's all about legislators getting funded on the side.

 

[Remadl700]

No one here is defending LEO's who mess up. Everyone should be held accountable. I believe what we are disagreeing on is the level of wrong-doing. Despite what dmancornell and some others may think, not all cops are constitution raping gestapo. Thinking they are is what is ignorant of the truth...

My bloodpressure is up dealing with the stupid comments on this thread. I'm done for a while. No point to it anymore. We're all saying the same bubblegum over and over. dmancornell and his ilk are spouting over and over that all or most cops are bad. Some of us are disputing that point. Arguing with you people is like yelling at a brick wall. You make about as much sense, and I get about the same satisfaction, that is to say, none...

I hope I did not come across that way in my opening thread. I have several friends that are LEO's and one is a Stater. I was just very surprised by her comments and attitude towards me.

 

[Remadl700]

I feel sorry for the LEOs that come here to relax and socialize like the rest of us. You can't vilify an entire occupation based on a few bad apples. They share their information and insights with us and a lot of you guys treat them like garbage just because they are cops. Sure, they are in a position of authority and there are those who abuse that authority, but I think a lot of resentment stems from the fact that they have the authority in the first place. Americans don't seem to like anyone who may have any power over us, even if it's just the power to make us drive the posted speed limit.

So lets bet adults and resist the temptation to jump on the hate train every time someone brings up the topic of LEO's. It demeans NWF as a whole.

I couldn't agree more!

This was one person (Stater)'s reaction to me not disclosing my CHL. She was wrong as she found out later, from what I heard.

 

[Remadl700]

That's a bad stop. It's against the law. She can't pull you over for your speed then use it to go on a "fishing expedition," especially in light of the recent case law that was appealed and overturned Arizona v. Gant.

She didn't have PC (probable cause) to even ask about your CHL; that was totally irrelevant.

Once they know you have a CHL and are carrying or have it in close proximity they can legally ask where it is located and that you make NO movements in that direction and keep both hands visible on the steering wheel. If you don't you can be charged with failure to comply. This is from my lawyer who specializes in these areas. So ...............take it for what it's worth.

 

[OregonBuzz]

Under Oregon law you are not required to disclose that you have a CHL, or that you are carrying. However, it is a good idea to present your CHL and ODL to the officer just to avoid any conflict. A very good source for understanding the confusing and sometimes contradictory Oregon laws regarding concealed or open carry is the booklet "Understanding Oregon's Gun Laws", put out by Kevin Starrett of Oregon Firearms Federation. It's a good "bathroom" book.