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OSP - Very PO'd !!! that I did not disclose my CHL

Discussion in 'Legal & Political Archive' started by Remadl700, Oct 25, 2011.

  1. Remadl700

    Remadl700 Oregon Member

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    I was pulled over a while back on I-5 going slightly over the speed limit of 75 MPH:D

    Anyway I rolled the window down, vehicle in park, both hands on the wheel with ORDL and Ins papers. She (Motorcycle cop), asked the typical questions about where's the fire and how come I am going so fast......la dee daw ......Yes I was going 78.....any who she spends time back at the bike and on the radio, I am watching all this in the mirror and then ...she quickly looks up and gets behind her bike. I am thinking oh oooh! This lasted for a couple more minutes and she walks up this time her hand is on her gun and she is very close to the side of my vehicle and reads my the riot act of why did I not show her my CHL and where is the weapon located? I explained to her that I was not carrying it and there were no weapons in the vehicle and even if there were none of the training or ORS's state that I have to do that (I already new I was getting a ticket because I saw her write it) and why would she treat me like a threat even if I was LEGALY CARRYING it. I am in the system, I have had and passed a background check. I would think someone who hasn't passed a background check would be a much bigger threat? I also asked why she thinks any CHL carrier would pose a higher threat we are a known quantity compared to other people the OSP pulls over. She explained that I am required to disclose the CHL and location of the weapon and that it could be taken away for failure to disclose it to her. .......At this point I could not keep my mouth shut ......I wish ....I had but .....so a couple of verbal jabs on her part and I just said I know what my rights are and what I am required to do as a CHL holder and disclosure is not part of it. Well that bought me another 20 minutes of being late for work ....while I am sure she was trying to find something to bust me on. ........so next time just disclose? NOPE! But I won't talk back either.

    I have several LEO friends that I shoot with and the opinions vary on what the expectation is of a CHL holder. You would be surprised at the range of response you get from LEO's on this subject. I will leave it at that.
     
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  2. krkruse

    krkruse Salem area Active Member

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    You were dead meat from the very start.
     
  3. 9mmD

    9mmD sw wa Member

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    You meen you cant just show alittle titty and start crying and they let you go with a warning ;)
     
  4. SnackCracker

    SnackCracker Lake oswego, OR Member

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    Like you, I wouldn't have been able to keep my mouth shut. it ticks me off how they presume to know the law and are going to argue about it - when they are wrong. It would be one thing if they actually KNEW what they are talking about if they are going to start telling you what is "required by law". I would have spent the whole day along side the road just to prove that stupid power tripping honey doesn't know what she is talking about.
    I'm by no means a cop basher, but I have no respect for power trippers or know it all types - regardless of the profession. Yeah, I can be a pain, but I am also very cool and respectful of those police that are respectful to me. Tit for tat 'n all that. I'd have started off trying to be respectful and help educate her on her misinformation.... but if she turned bubblegum I'd have held my ground and made a point.

    I carry a copy of the ORS regarding CHL, open carry, no need to disclose etc, in my truck. I specifically have a copy of the ORS in my wallet with my CHL regarding state preemption, and our legal right to open carry anywhere with a CHL - Just for places like Portland, Salem, Beaverton etc where the city ordinance states you can't open carry a loaded firearm (but cannot be applied to CHL holders). I don't open carry, but I don't always completely conceal it either - it prints and shows often *shrug*. My point is that I know the laws surrounding carrying a firearm, CHL laws and requirements better than most LEO's. It's one thing for them to not fully know the law. It's another when they are gonna rip into you and try to enforce laws that don't exist.
     
  5. civilian75

    civilian75 Hillsboro, OR Well-Known Member

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    I am not saying this is why it happened to you, but I can't see it happening to me. I disclose. I do not talk back, ESPECIALLY if I know I am in the wrong. You never know what kind of day a cop had; may be already on their nerves. Not my job to test how much more they can take, or how much they know about the law. I treat she cops just like he cops. Women can often "smell" a mile away when a man does not respects her, even if we don't say a single disrespecting word. My wife has over the last 25 yr repeatedly proven that point.

    It takes hard work to stay under the radar.

    My $0.022 (in 2010 US$, adjusted for inflation)
     
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  6. deadeye

    deadeye Albany,OR. Moderator Staff Member

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    Where on I-5 in Oregon did the limit go to 75mph? I dont show my permit either and recieved the same response from a city cop once, I just put em in their place when they start in on the (supposed) laws.
     
  7. Nwcid

    Nwcid Yakima and N of Spokane Well-Known Member

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    Never argue on the side of the road you never win. If there is a real problem then it is time to file a report or take it to court where you can win.

    This is not to say dont see if the LEO is open to hearing the truth if they want but what can you actually gain on the side of the road by pushing it?
     
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  8. sprocket3

    sprocket3 Oregon - Wet Side Member

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    Where can we get the LAW regarding the requirement to disclose weapon in this situation or that one just has a permit?
     
  9. Nwcid

    Nwcid Yakima and N of Spokane Well-Known Member

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    I would say in your state laws, Oregon Revised Statutes In the state laws is where I find mine for WA......
     
  10. CHLChris

    CHLChris Portland Metro East Love me some guns! Bronze Supporter

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    There should be no mistake here: Just because a person is a LAW ENFORCEMENT Officer, it does NOT mean that they have a law degree.

    1) We must know our own rights
    2) Either fight for those rights in the moment and win in court LATER...or just say, "I'm sorry," and get out of there ASAP.

    Unless the fight is worth in the moment, I would rather just be respectful and give a little grace for them not knowing the law.

    She was probably a raving liberal and so anti-gun she spits on those rights. But you STILL should not have argued.
     
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  11. Gunner3456

    Gunner3456 Salem Well-Known Member

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    I don't have a problem with telling a cop I'm carrying. They are always a little on edge because they don't know who they are meeting. But if I wasn't carrying and didn't have my license on me, I would see no reason to.

    I know the law doesn't require it, but the cop is going to find out you have a permit and why not put them at ease up front? "Officer, I have a CHL and I have a gun at 4:00. You are in absolutely no danger from me. Is there anything I can do to make you more comfortable?" I've done that a couple of times and got nothing but courtesy in return.

    BTW many here know I don't like most cops AT ALL but I also don't like hassling with them.

    $.02
     
  12. DBagnall

    DBagnall SALEM Member

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    Most police agencies here have MDT's and are able to run your plate before making contact on a traffic stop. Whether you are a CHL holder or not is displayed with your DMV information so there is always a reasonable expectation that 1. You have a valid CHL and 2. There is a weapon present.

    Therefore it is usually pointless to declare and most of my peers wouldn't even bother asking about it. There is also a reasonable expectation that a CHL holder has at least some respect for the law.... ;)

    Regardless, most OSP officers I have run into do not have MDTs, especially motorcycle cops, and do most of their communications and checks via the radio. So they don't necessarily know about the CHL right off the bat. It still shouldn't matter though. Sounds like your friendly OSP trooper had an axe to grind.....
     
  13. Nwcid

    Nwcid Yakima and N of Spokane Well-Known Member

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    I know in WA it is not required and unless there is a need (like my wallet is still in my pocket and I am carrying on that side) I dont tell. It is not a lack of respect or any "I dont have to tell so I am not going to" thing. It is simply that if I am getting stopped it is usually for a traffic violation which has NOTHING to do with guns. Since the stop has NOTHING to do with guns I am not gong to be the one to bring a gun into the situation. If the LEO wants to bring guns into the situation by asking I will answer truthfully, but that is their choice.
     
  14. Blitzkrieg

    Blitzkrieg WA Well-Known Member

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    Women do not belong on the street as cops. Yes I am a male chauvinist pig :redspot:
     
  15. Mark W.

    Mark W. Silverton, OR Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Where in Oregon is there a 75MPH speed limit?????? I've been from one end of the state to the other on I5 and there is nothing posted higher then 65mph. So if you were 13mph over the speed limit which you were if you were in Oregon I have no doubt she was Pissed OFF.
     
  16. Ligito

    Ligito Oregon Active Member

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    In Oregon, a cop knows you have a CHL, as soon as they run your plate.
    I was taught to keep my hands on the wheel and wait for them to make the next move.
    They have always asked if I am carrying and I say yes.
    I've had no issues after that.
    I was stopped once, by a cop that was sitting in the center lane, just watching everyone. He stopped me and said his records showed that I had no insurance-my insurance company had transposed my VIN and it showed no insurance.
    I showed him my papers and he said to call my insurance company, to straighten it out, which I did.
    He also asked my passenger, a retired cop, for ID-he refused and asked if he wanted to see his BPST number-the cop just smiled and we went on our way.
     
  17. DBagnall

    DBagnall SALEM Member

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    I will add something to my previous comments.

    Regardless of whether you disagree with a LEO or not, its always best to comply courteously. If you do not like what they had to say or what they may have given you, just smile and nod and take it up with the judge later. There are other avenues that can be taken if you have a problem with a specific officer, arguing/aggravating only tends to make things worse...
     
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  18. pchewn

    pchewn Beaverton Oregon USA Well-Known Member

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    Last time I checked the laws:

    1) There is no requirement to show your CHL, nor to disclose that you have a CHL
    2) The CHL is a "concealed handgun license", not a CFEETPHL "concealed from everyone except the police handgun license". You do not have to reveal (by showing or telling) whether you actually have a gun or not.

    However: You MAY (or may not) be treated better if you reveal your CHL, or the fact that you are carrying. (There is evidence of it helping, and evidence of it hurting you). You will have to decide for yourself.
     
  19. deadeye

    deadeye Albany,OR. Moderator Staff Member

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    copied from here....too lazy to get out the book......http://oregonfirearms.org/faq/

    Question- I have been told that if I am stopped by a police officer on a routine traffic stop I MUST immediately tell him that I have a CHL and a gun. Is this true?

    answer- No. There is no law, statute, administrative rule or ordinance that requires this. Many "instructors" tell their students there is, or that it would be a "courtesy." But it is NOT required. In fact, we have heard from many people who DID tell police who stopped them that they had a CHL and found themselves dealing with very hostile cops who considered it a threatening gesture. ( Some states, like Ohio DO require this. In fact in Ohio it's a felony not to. Just plain nuts.)

    However, most police don't know what the law is and many of them believe, mistakenly, that you must tell them. Those police are wrong. To hear two Portland police officers discuss this (right before the first officer on the audio told a person who he stopped that he was going to have his license revoked) click here. The two officers on this audio don't know what they are talking about. But the the first cop says that the person who he stopped gave him "a lot of lip." That's because the person he stopped knew more about the law than the cop did.


    you need to buy this book, it helps....Oregon Firearms Federation
     
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  20. Remadl700

    Remadl700 Oregon Member

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    Point taken - just for reference, I was on my best behavior until she laid into me.