Other State KY EMT killed in police raid on wrong apt

[No_Regerts]

JBRS/JX is way better than Vinelink, IMO. Started by WA sherriff. Every WA county/local jail is supposed to be linked in, and real time booking info is available along with setting watches that notify if an individual gets booked.

They're not though. I don't get JBRS hits from tribal jails at all, and some smaller places.

 

[tkdguy]

Awful.

 

[GFormby]

Don't ever call 911.

I don't call 911 !

 

[No_Regerts]

I guess I am surprised from the fact that they

Guess I'm just surprised that if you think someone is drug trafficking as they say and you have been following them, you use methods other than sending officers into a house with unknown occupants.

You'll know the people who are tied to a residence or vehicle, but you won't know where they will be in the house. Also, its impossible to know all third parties. The point of entering is to make a seizure of evidence. The exigent circumstance is the ability to destroy or hide evidence crucial to prosecution. Its the same thing that allows an officer to take your blood if you refuse a breathalyzer. The speed of metabolism allows the officer to get the blood Immediately.

 

[No_Regerts]

I don't call 911 !

Remind me not to go jogging in your neighborhood.....

 

[GFormby]

They came about after numerous tragedies of officers getting shot through doors, criminals that were pushing drugs onto our kids having time to flush them before entries or escaping before they could be caught.

4th Amendment:
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Note, "unreasonable searches," not no-knock searches. Had a warrant. If it was a no-knock (facts still cloudy on this) then a judge decided to allow this, not the police. Since the constitution uses words like "unreasonable" there will always need to be case decisions to provide guidance. I don't always like them either but they are pretty set in these areas and used hundreds of times each day around the country with favorable results for society...we just don't read about them.

Welcome to NWF by the way.

Just because unconstitutional means are used "with favorable" (whatever favorable means Constitutionally) results around the country hundreds of times every day really makes me feel better about my Constitutional Rights being violated. (The more the better as long as it do0esn't hit the news, Right?)

How many innocents and wrongful deaths is "unreasonable"?
Maybe the "authorities" don't do no knock, illegal home invasions AFTER DARK! That's just asking for someone to get killed (suspects AND officers). What's the rush. Cut off the water, power, gas and surround the place until daylight say 8:00 or 9:00 AM. Everybody can see clearly what's going on and it would cut down greatly on officers AND suspects (or wrong residences) getting killed. (And I know this won't work in ALL cases but nothing works in ALL cases.)

 

[GFormby]

Remind me not to go jogging in your neighborhood.....

OK.... Don't go jogging in my neighborhood...so what now? I'll bet there are a bunch of neighborhoods you won't go jogging in (even before dark) that call 911 all the time, huh?

 

[No_Regerts]

OK.... Don't go jogging in my neighborhood...so what now? I'll bet there are a bunch of neighborhoods you won't go jogging in (even before dark) that call 911 all the time, huh?

And some that just shoot random people that jog in their neighborhood. The kind that "don't need no cops!" The kind that "don't call 911!"

Bless your heart!

 

[blacktailbucks]

You'll know the people who are tied to a residence or vehicle, but you won't know where they will be in the house. Also, its impossible to know all third parties. The point of entering is to make a seizure of evidence. The exigent circumstance is the ability to destroy or hide evidence crucial to prosecution. Its the same thing that allows an officer to take your blood if you refuse a breathalyzer. The speed of metabolism allows the officer to get the blood Immediately.

You better have evidence before you come to my door or one of us will die warrant or not

 

[No_Regerts]

You better have evidence before you come to my door or one of us will die warrant or not

I'm like, 1850 and 0 with the only trips to the hospital being for non-life threatening injuries for any participant. Mostly for trips and falls.

 

[Ura-Ki]

OK now, Bunch of noobs here making tough guy statements, accusations, and outrageous statements on this topic which is against the forums rules to which you all agreed to when you signed up here! I'm gonna say it ONE TIME ONLY, knock it off or this thread will be locked!

 

[blacktailbucks]

OK now, Bunch of noobs here making tough guy statements, accusations, and outrageous statements on this topic which is against the forums rules to which you all agreed to when you signed up here! I'm gonna say it ONE TIME ONLY, knock it off or this thread will be locked!

Not sure if your talking about me or not, but while I support law enforcement, we have become way to lax about allowing government employees to enter homes of private citizens, their are more than a few that want to go door to door and test you for disease's or inject you with their covid vaccine whether you like it or not Unfortunately it starts with small steps like liberal judges and employees that just follow directions without thinking.

 

[Ura-Ki]

Not sure if your talking about me or not, but while I support law enforcement, we have become way to lax about allowing government employees to enter homes of private citizens, their are more than a few that want to go door to door and test you for disease's or inject you with their covid vaccine whether you like it or not Unfortunately it starts with small steps like liberal judges and employees that just follow directions without thinking.

Can you provide links to any credible sources that state which law enforcement agencies have done any of what you just claimed?

 

[blacktailbucks]

Can you provide links to any credible sources that state which law enforcement agencies have done any of what you just claimed?

TRACE Act HR6666: What Does the Coronavirus Bill Propose ... and then check ventura county in california

 

[Ura-Ki]

That's not Oregon or Washington state, doesn't apply here! Even if it is happening, it's illegal search and seizure!

 

[blacktailbucks]

That's not Oregon or Washington state, doesn't apply here! Even if it is happening, it's illegal search and seizure!

And our governor doesn't follow California

 

[Ura-Ki]

And our governor doesn't follow California

Not when she doesn't have the Sheriff's and other LEO under her thumb she don't! Portland would LOVE to try ish like that,, but it would never fly, even under Multico's crooked Sheriff, he does have minimal morals!

 

[blacktailbucks]

Not when she doesn't have the Sheriff's and other LEO under her thumb she don't! Portland would LOVE to try ish like that,, but it would never fly, even under Multico's crooked Sheriff, he does have minimal morals!

Maybe he has self preservation morals

 

[Ura-Ki]

Maybe he has self preservation morals

Both inside the office and out!

 

[mkwerx]

They came about after numerous tragedies of officers getting shot through doors, criminals that were pushing drugs onto our kids having time to flush them before entries or escaping before they could be caught.

4th Amendment:
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Note, "unreasonable searches," not no-knock searches. Had a warrant. If it was a no-knock (facts still cloudy on this) then a judge decided to allow this, not the police. Since the constitution uses words like "unreasonable" there will always need to be case decisions to provide guidance. I don't always like them either but they are pretty set in these areas and used hundreds of times each day around the country with favorable results for society...we just don't read about them.

Welcome to NWF by the way.

Its better that some drug pusher gets to flush his stash and make the cops job harder occasionally than for an innocent person to get shot down in their bed, or an innocent resident gets killed for shooting what they reasonably perceive to be home invaders who turn out to be cops. Police work is dangerous work. They take risks and they know the risks when they raise their hand and take the oath just like any other uniformed service.

No knocks are BS and lead to too many bad outcomes on both ends. If banging on the door and screaming "POLICE, WE HAVE A WARRANT" makes things too tough and lets a bad guy flee, or destroy evidence sometimes, well, tough. Sometimes the bad guys "win" that round. Bring enough dudes with you to surround the house and prevent people from fleeing, and enter with enough overwhelming force to secure the people and evidence. Don't send three guys, in plain clothes, in the middle of the damn night. Even in Bumphuck Appalachia Ol' Barney could request officers from the county, neighboring agencies, state police, game wardens, or the local crossing guards to help on a warrant service if they don't have enough officers. There's no excuse for continuing a policy that is unnecessarily dangerous. Cops get bad info with enough regularity that these cases are no longer "rare" in the media.

Also every cop should be wearing a camera, especially during warrant service, and they should never be allowed to turn them off while on-duty except when they're taking a crap. It would clear up all of the finger pointing and would disprove false complaints and bad narratives like the whole "hands up, don't shoot" BS.

Hopefully this lady's family can take some comfort in whatever settlement they get, unfortunately it won't be coming out of the pockets of the cops who killed her, the judge that gave them a no-knock warrant, or the administrators who approved of the plan. It'll be the tax payers and their insurance company.

No knocks need to end.