What Ideas Do You Have for Improving Gun Rights?

[Aero Denezol]

That's Australia, mate. It's well known that the Americas were founded by religious exiles and trappers/entrepreneurs, at least North America.
Whatcha talkin'bout, Willis?

You should check out Howard Zinn's A People's History of the United States, 1492-Present, this is the authoritative US History book for liberals, widely read in leftist circles. This book is the #2 bestseller on the Social History list of Amazon's American History section. First published in 1980, the book has sold over 1.5 million copies... And this book more or less tears down everything about America you and I ever learned in grade school.

 

[Flymph]

There are plenty of conservative historians out there. Some of the most well known historians are conservatives. Stephen Ambrose and David McCollough to name two of the most prominent.
I think it should be up to conservatives to actually bother themselves with reading history books than to accuse liberals with misrepresenting history. Don't like what is said about something, research the event and write your own book. Plenty of conservatives do! Then again, read some "southern democrat" historical literature from about 1910, and you'll see some misrepresented BS in school textbooks. Tho comparing southern democrats of the 19th through the mid 20th century to modern liberals is a whole new degree of stupid ignorance.
If the facts of history dissuade your ideas or political ideologies, maybe those ideologies are not as sound as your faith in them. Faith is for the complacent.

 

[Flymph]

You should check out Howard Zinn's A People's History of the United States, 1492-Present, this is the authoritative US History book for liberals, widely read in leftist circles. This book is the #2 bestseller on the Social History list of Amazon's American History section. First published in 1980, the book has sold over 1.5 million copies... And this book more or less tears down everything about America you and I ever learned in grade school.

Most of what you learned in gradeschool was watered down propaganda, and any conservative historian would likely agree.

 

[Bushman]

The only viable idea for the two party opinions (some think we should be allowed, others think we shouldn't be) is to create states just for the anti's. I say give them NY, IL and CA. They are already banned there in most ways anyways, so let them just ban them outright. I'm sure all their gun crime problems will vanish instantly....

We can have the rest of the states and observe the effect of 24/7 legal carry on crimes of violence.....My guess is that violent crime will go down in our states and up in theirs...

 

[Flymph]

No, cause then we'll just have more people moving up here... make the places they are more appealing so they stay there.

 

[Lazyfaire]

The day before I left my Unit in the RVN in 1970, I got my haircut but the Barber who had been doing it once a week for the last year+. That night I was on the Green line when three "Pigs " were spotted in the wire - shots were Fired. As Sgt. of the Guard it was my Duty to go out and clean up the mess. ALL three Pigs had taken hits from the ten round burst of .50BMG Tracers that I had fired. All three Pigs were carrying satchel charges including the one who had cut my hair the day before!!!

Lesson Learned.

He could have shaved your neck too! Glad you made it back

 

[Lazyfaire]

Hillsdale college's on line course about the constitution is a good start also "Not a living Breathing Document:Reclaiming our Constitution" by Kris Anne Hall is a good start

Everyone-- Go to www.Hillsdale.edu to check out the series they do on the Constitution. They walk the talk.

30 years ago the gov't went to Hillsdale and said they have to follow all Title 9 rules on hiring. Hillsdale said they don't (They had a black woman professor in 1860. Gov't came back and said yes you do. You have students who take student loans. Hillsdale said OK, at the end of the semester all students on gov't student loans will be expelled! Gov't backed down but Hillsdale put a call out to its backers and alumni and within 2 years have created a system of its own to loan money to students at the same rate and terms as before, but no gov't involved. I believe they have about $1B in the endowment now. As I said, they walk the talk.

 

[Lazyfaire]

The only viable idea for the two party opinions (some think we should be allowed, others think we shouldn't be) is to create states just for the anti's. I say give them NY, IL and CA. They are already banned there in most ways anyways, so let them just ban them outright. I'm sure all their gun crime problems will vanish instantly....

We can have the rest of the states and observe the effect of 24/7 legal carry on crimes of violence.....My guess is that violent crime will go down in our states and up in theirs...

I think Alcatraz is currently available to live in...

 

[Aero Denezol]

Most of what you learned in gradeschool was watered down propaganda, and any conservative historian would likely agree.

Yes, everyone over the age 15 knows that. I'm certainly not suggesting Columbus discovered America. I am however, talking about the rewriting of US History in the context of gun rights. I believe if you can cast doubt on key historical actors and events as being wrong-headed, arcane, obsolete, pernicious, and/or outright lies, you have a strong position from which to attack gun rights (among other things). I also want to emphasize that a lot of these revisionist histories are politically and economically motivated.

 

[KKG]

I started "Carrying" a sidearm when I was 19 and in the Military. I've had a CPL since I turned 21. AND I have had five(5) reasons to be thankful for having a sidearm with only one that had a direct affect on my personal wellbeing and that All of those occurred before or after I was wearing a Badge - which I did for 8-1/2 years. I know that there are at least four people who are very, VERY happy I chose to carry and to do it properly. ALL five bad guys went to the Graybar Hotel and at least two came out in body bags and I don't feel the least bit bad about that.

 

[Flymph]

That's all popular historians do, frankly. It's how they make a living, on either side. Historians are always politically biased, but usually they're relatively humble towards eachother about it.
Yeah, I've read some amateur crap online from both sides in both respects that makes a sane person's head spin.
I suppose we need to emphasize history and social sciences a bit more in schools. Critical thinking courses should be a minimum of bi-annual requisite for graduation.

 

[DuneHopper]

I am going to restart my podcast soon I may take this topic there and see where it can go.
Seems that we are still lost as a movement. We understand the problem, we engage and communicate it
very articulately. YET............ we fail to mobilize and solidify a resolution. I think knowing the problem is great
and reading this topic seems most clearly get the problem................ yet crickets can be heard chirping when we discuss resolving it.

 

[Urgaburga]

That's Australia, mate. It's well known that the Americas were founded by religious exiles and trappers/entrepreneurs, at least North America.
Whatcha talkin'bout, Willis?

Accept for the part about stealing the SW from Mexico and the extermination of the natives. The usually gets left out.

 

[Urgaburga]

In history normally the conquered have no say in the written history, since about 1865 The left has slowly been writing their version of history. This is nothing new and has been a death by a thousand cuts. We alone do not have enough band-aids to heal those cuts.
It will take leadership and organization something the right is lacking.

As far as I''m aware in 1865 leftist opinions belonged to the Republicans. It was Lincoln who struggled to have slavery abolished right to the bitter end opposed by the Democrats (who were supported by the KKK when they were founded the same year).

As American's we tend to apply the truth that suits our argument best while kids are fed diluted and revisionist history in school.

 

[DuneHopper]

As far as I''m aware in 1865 leftist opinions belonged to the Republicans. It was Lincoln who struggled to have slavery abolished right to the bitter end opposed by the Democrats (who were supported by the KKK when they were founded the same year).

As American's we tend to apply the truth that suits our argument best while kids are fed diluted and revisionist history in school.

I would disagree the left had already established roots in the south and why there were many a capitalists at the time in the south,
the change by 1865 had begun. If you look at history for about 100 years there after the South stood solid and denied the influences however there was no so called flip flop from left to right as many would like us to think. The view on the left today is a fabrication, it is nothing more then a slide of hand smoke and mirror. In one word, Affirmative Action, was one of the most raciest profiling projects ever and it was done to control minorities not help them. But thats a hole other topic not for this forum.
But I stand by my statement the left had began to pull the wool over everyone eyes starting back then.
The right is still right and the left is still left, but people will see only what they are told to see.

 

[Lazyfaire]

Accept for the part about stealing the SW from Mexico and the extermination of the natives. The usually gets left out.

Colonialism was a widespread destiny for many countries back then. Texans wanted to be left alone and didn't bow to Mexico City. The War w Mexico in 1846 was a more formalized war with them harassing citizens and Maximilian of France trying to take over Mexico, eventually ending with us invading them. Right thing to do? Meh. Times were different then and emotions ran high.

Killing the natives? Not right but not unusual. Australia set out to move out or kill their aboriginals. African countries enslave or murder tribes that are not their own. Think the Hutus and ??? from 20 yrs ago. Europeans killed/hated the Jews as a race so neither are their hands clean. Arabs have regressed from their "enlightened" times of the 1400s and now kill people who don't have the 'right' religion.
So when someone thinks I should feel guilty for being white or an American, I have two words for them. "I don't !"

 

[KKG]

I believe that if Old Abe had had his way ALL of the Slaves, including the so called Free ones would have been shipped back to Africa on the next available transport. It seems to me that the problem just might have been solved. They still don't consider themselves to be Americans and so maybe Africa is where they belong. But maybe they'd want to be called American-Africians! Think about IT!!!

 

[DuneHopper]

So to steer this back on topic, it will take allot of work to improve the status of gun rights.
We know what got us here, now where do we go from here?

 

[Lazyfaire]

So to steer this back on topic, it will take allot of work to improve the status of gun rights.
We know what got us here, now where do we go from here?

Part of the problem is that by nature gun people are not terribly outgoing with their guns. We are so used to being vilified for even talking of them that we hedge at speaking out loud. I agree that we all want to encourage others to be involved and have the fun that we have. We do believe in the values that we all espouse, God, family, honor, integrity and country. We think "who wouldn't think those are all good things", but there are those who want them deconstructed in our lifetime. People call us paranoid, but what if we are right and they are not?

 

[Flymph]

I'm a nihilist, so that whole God thing falls on deaf ears here... I'm a bad nihilist tho, as I put faith in my country and the potential for our government.

I would suggest that it be encouraged to youth through educational programs. However, I'm too broke to actually do this. Start them off with outdoor sports, and as they become adults emphasize defense more. Not everyone will get behind defense as the reason for encouraging the use of firearms, but it's also hard for those people to deny a person of a harmless sport that provides therapeutic recreation. You could also incorporate general stuardness of the environment and other outdoor activities. Much like the BSA ... I would say that the BSA has failed in this with its exclusion of different people for whatever reason. Politics, gender, religious affiliation, or lack there of, should not stop people from being included. Hopefully they can fix their image and get on track with the true meaning of being a scout, but I doubt it. More participation might occur if one were to initiate an after school club, with a cool name like "Ranger Corps" or something... maybe the fascist in me is leaking out a bit. lmao

Point being: more participation, more awareness, better image!

PS; I could probably volunteer at some point. Probably a good way for somebody who is retired to stay active...