What Ideas Do You Have for Improving Gun Rights?

[DuneHopper]

I'm a nihilist, so that whole God thing falls on deaf ears here... I'm a bad nihilist tho, as I put faith in my country and the potential for our government.

I would suggest that it be encouraged to youth through educational programs. However, I'm too broke to actually do this. Start them off with outdoor sports, and as they become adults emphasize defense more. Not everyone will get behind defense as the reason for encouraging the use of firearms, but it's also hard for those people to deny a person of a harmless sport that provides therapeutic recreation. You could also incorporate general stuardness of the environment and other outdoor activities. Much like the BSA ... I would say that the BSA has failed in this with its exclusion of different people for whatever reason. Politics, gender, religious affiliation, or lack there of, should not stop people from being included. Hopefully they can fix their image and get on track with the true meaning of being a scout, but I doubt it. More participation might occur if one were to initiate an after school club, with a cool name like "Ranger Corps" or something... maybe the fascist in me is leaking out a bit. lmao

Point being: more participation, more awareness, better image!

PS; I could probably volunteer at some point. Probably a good way for somebody who is retired to stay active...

The problem is the state where I live Oregon, the people already fighting ( use the term loosely as all they do is play defense) do not like competition.
I actually had a very successful run defending our rights and was pro-active and made some progress and
oddly the same side I was protecting not the Antis worked to take us down with fake news.
There is a hidden force on the west coast claiming they are for our rights, yet they wont play nice with any new attention others get in fighting and basically shoot themselves in the foot and make us all look petty and unorganized.
It can be done, but will take mass support to over come those that will work on our own side to take down the progress.
Its almost like the don't want us to succeed because then they would be out of a job.

I do agree @Lazyfaire God, family, honor, integrity and country is the glue that holds us and why not everyone follows a God in their life there is a adhesion in having a higher power involved in the process its as people tend to take patriotism and God in the same breath so why many may not follow the path of a higher power its influence to affect the masses is hard to deny.

 

[Hayshaker]

Threaten to files a complaint against floyd/jenny and the rest of the antis. doesn't make any difference whether it's true or not. Law would be forced to go and take away their guns ~~~ that they supposedly don't have

 

[Aero Denezol]

Relaxing regulations and establishing more shooting ranges where people can practice. It feels like all the local gun clubs walk on egg shells with the government. I'm all for safety, but the amount of apologizing they have to do is far beyond the pale. American Outdoors in Dallas tried to establish a new public range several years ago and they were shouted down by the school district (despite the fact most of those rural kids have grown up playing in the outdoors). The mood towards gun clubs is suspicious at best, and this is (IMO) self-righteous and unwarranted BS. It is easier to find a strip club or a dispensary in Oregon than a shooting range. When I used to work in a bar 20 years ago people would come in at 10 am to drink scotch and play video poker. The social ills stemming from that kind of behavior was tolerated because the State collected their money. Just my .02

 

[Bon Sauvage]

I'm a nihilist, so that whole God thing falls on deaf ears here... I'm a bad nihilist tho, as I put faith in my country and the potential for our government.

I would suggest that it be encouraged to youth through educational programs. However, I'm too broke to actually do this. Start them off with outdoor sports, and as they become adults emphasize defense more. Not everyone will get behind defense as the reason for encouraging the use of firearms, but it's also hard for those people to deny a person of a harmless sport that provides therapeutic recreation. You could also incorporate general stuardness of the environment and other outdoor activities. Much like the BSA ... I would say that the BSA has failed in this with its exclusion of different people for whatever reason. Politics, gender, religious affiliation, or lack there of, should not stop people from being included. Hopefully they can fix their image and get on track with the true meaning of being a scout, but I doubt it. More participation might occur if one were to initiate an after school club, with a cool name like "Ranger Corps" or something... maybe the fascist in me is leaking out a bit. lmao

Point being: more participation, more awareness, better image!

PS; I could probably volunteer at some point. Probably a good way for somebody who is retired to stay active...

Cooooool........ Did you have a small but meaningful role in The Big Lebowski?

 

[Flymph]

HAHAHA I was the scissors!

Cooooool........ Did you have a small but meaningful role in The Big Lebowski?

View attachment 374870

 

[Urgaburga]

Colonialism was a widespread destiny for many countries back then. Texans wanted to be left alone and didn't bow to Mexico City. The War w Mexico in 1846 was a more formalized war with them harassing citizens and Maximilian of France trying to take over Mexico, eventually ending with us invading them. Right thing to do? Meh. Times were different then and emotions ran high.

Killing the natives? Not right but not unusual. Australia set out to move out or kill their aboriginals. African countries enslave or murder tribes that are not their own. Think the Hutus and ??? from 20 yrs ago. Europeans killed/hated the Jews as a race so neither are their hands clean. Arabs have regressed from their "enlightened" times of the 1400s and now kill people who don't have the 'right' religion.
So when someone thinks I should feel guilty for being white or an American, I have two words for them. "I don't !"

It's not about the fact that it happened it's about being honest about it.

Did you learn about all the bubblegum we've pulled on people in history class at school? How we lost most of the battles in the revolutionary war? How wide spread antisemitism was a factor that kept the US out of WWII for nearly four years? Or were you told how the Founding Fathers beat the British and won two world wars back to back.

There are so many skeletons in our histories closet that it boggles the mind. If you look at the brainwashing and revisionist history in US schools you'd think we were the Soviet Union.

Right from the Revolutionary War to now where people and the media (who lost any integrity they had 100 years ago) are afraid to demand answers from government and put leaders to task when European nancies like the brits do so on a regular basis .

 

[Flymph]

Yeah, all the mud-rakers are dead and we're all slaves to the robber barons... Sure the Japanese were bad in China, but no worse than Americans in 1898 in the Philippines.
Be proud to be an American, and look to better yourself so you can better your nation.

AKA, educate yourself and help to educate others.

 

[etrain16]

Right now, far too many gun owners fight among themselves to really be an effective tool agains the government. Some gun owners are just fine with restrictive anti-gun laws and don't see the "need" for mags that hold more than 10 rounds, AR's, AK's, concealed carry, suppressors, etc., etc. Others simply don't care enough to get involved or think it's already a lost cause, so don't even bother to vote, much less write or call legislators. Others are simply so out of the loop on this stuff that they aren't even aware stuff like this is happening - in fact, there are still folks that haven't even heard of SB941 - 2 full years later.

We don't have a rallying point or anyone in this state that can or will pull all gun owners together. Until our numbers are united in purpose, we have no sway over Salem. We simply don't have any way to influence these folks away from passing anti-gun legislation. People keep voting in the worst of the worst, over and over again - how do you fight that when the voters don't give a flying f$&k what these people are doing to our rights? How the hell do you fight an ignorant, apathetic and dependent group of people that hold the majority in the state? How do you get the folks sitting on the fence or sitting at home to get up and participate? How do you convince supposedly pro-gun folks that we need these rights intact and that things like restrictions and registrations will actually hurt us all down the road?

I have no idea, short of saying we need two big things that are missing: a big money pro-gun proponent and a pro-gun group that has the numbers and the contacts to make a real impact in Salem. Problem is that pro-gun folks in this state don't agree with each other, they are divided along many lines, including party affiliation. So long as we can't find a way to work together to fight the folks in Salem, we can't win this battle. When hard-core anti's need to get something done, they unite, even when they don't agree with each other. Pro-gun folks do the opposite - they fight each other, dividing the vote and letting the other side win. It's petty, foolish and leading to our own self-destruction. Until we can get over that, we're our own worst enemies.

 

[Urgaburga]

Yeah, all the mud-rakers are dead and we're all slaves to the robber barons... Sure the Japanese were bad in China, but no worse than Americans in 1898 in the Philippines.
Be proud to be an American, and look to better yourself so you can better your nation.

AKA, educate yourself and help to educate others.

What I find amusing about the Japanese is that they have never apologized for the atrocities they committed during WWII on both civilians Allied POW's, and still don't think they ever did anything wrong. Yet they are still held in such high bubbleguming regard by all and sundry.

 

[Urgaburga]

Right now, far too many gun owners fight among themselves to really be an effective tool agains the government. Some gun owners are just fine with restrictive anti-gun laws and don't see the "need" for mags that hold more than 10 rounds, AR's, AK's, concealed carry, suppressors, etc., etc. Others simply don't care enough to get involved or think it's already a lost cause, so don't even bother to vote, much less write or call legislators. Others are simply so out of the loop on this stuff that they aren't even aware stuff like this is happening - in fact, there are still folks that haven't even heard of SB941 - 2 full years later.

We don't have a rallying point or anyone in this state that can or will pull all gun owners together. Until our numbers are united in purpose, we have no sway over Salem. We simply don't have any way to influence these folks away from passing anti-gun legislation. People keep voting in the worst of the worst, over and over again - how do you fight that when the voters don't give a flying f$&k what these people are doing to our rights? How the hell do you fight an ignorant, apathetic and dependent group of people that hold the majority in the state? How do you get the folks sitting on the fence or sitting at home to get up and participate? How do you convince supposedly pro-gun folks that we need these rights intact and that things like restrictions and registrations will actually hurt us all down the road?

I have no idea, short of saying we need two big things that are missing: a big money pro-gun proponent and a pro-gun group that has the numbers and the contacts to make a real impact in Salem. Problem is that pro-gun folks in this state don't agree with each other, they are divided along many lines, including party affiliation. So long as we can't find a way to work together to fight the folks in Salem, we can't win this battle. When hard-core anti's need to get something done, they unite, even when they don't agree with each other. Pro-gun folks do the opposite - they fight each other, dividing the vote and letting the other side win. It's petty, foolish and leading to our own self-destruction. Until we can get over that, we're our own worst enemies.

We really need to reach out and show people we are not the wing nuts many people think we are. I know plenty of lefties who don't like guns but also don't want them banned because they see that is an infringement of another person's rights. If we can do the same for other groups then we stand a better chance of attracting new and dare I say diverse shooters and support.

 

[Lazyfaire]

We really need to reach out and show people we are not the wing nuts many people think we are. I know plenty of lefties who don't like guns but also don't want them banned because they see that is an infringement of another person's rights. If we can do the same for other groups then we stand a better chance of attracting new and dare I say diverse shooters and support.

I agree with you. I always remember (IN boy here) when Detroit was having its previous issues that the police invited black ministers, activists, reporters, etc to go through the training that police officers do (simulators and live fire w/ pop-up targets). Every single one of them shot a civilian and missed the bad guy. The point was to show how difficult it can be when the officer is under stress. That is just an example of how to interact w the unknowledgeable public.

I would like to see shooting ranges open up and invite non shooters to come and try one out. Most people have never even held a pistol let alone pull the trigger. We need to expose these people to show them that these are tools, not killing machines. Ranting back and forth on FB will not bring anyone over to our side. I don't care if they EVER own a gun but I would like people to recognize our side of the argument.

 

[DuneHopper]

We really need to reach out and show people we are not the wing nuts many people think we are. I know plenty of lefties who don't like guns but also don't want them banned because they see that is an infringement of another person's rights. If we can do the same for other groups then we stand a better chance of attracting new and dare I say diverse shooters and support.

As an example there were two or three topic opened up in this forum over the last couple months with the idea of diversity and it was all but shouted down in this forum, and moved to a place with no name. If we can not even stomach having a dialog, we are doomed. I was talking with the Mrs last night about the bill that past and how our side loves to say how brainless and zombioe like antis are. And yet we all line up each year behind lobbyist like zombies empty our wallets and then are surprised when that little effort by us did nothing? Its hard not to laugh at our own ignorance.
I gave up for awhile trying to have a dialog on here with diverisity because there is too much hate and bitterness blinding the truth.

We are in a very dangerous spot my friends, we are at a tilting point. SB941 pushed us to the edge and SB719 has us teetering.
I ask myself are we really that ignorant to not see what we are doing and whom we are putting faith is are failing ?
There is rumored in 2018 Hicaps will make another run, and God help us if we think Lobbyist will save our rights when they have failed to change anything at all .
We need leadership, real honest non-hateful courage's leadership without it we are doomed to repeat the arse-kicking of 2012-13, 14, 15, 16 and 2017 .................back to your regular scheduled programming.

 

[Diamondback]

@DuneHopper Some of us have tried it and only gotten knifed in the back in reply--like the case I've mentioned ad nauseum of a former friend who saw firsthand what responsible CCW and gunhandling are like from me while I was in college, then decided to play Demanding Mommies Mynah Bird and take Bloomingnazi Blood Money because she decided pursuit of High Office was more important than personal integrity. (We defeated her, thank God.)

 

[etrain16]

As an example there were two or three topic opened up in this forum over the last couple months with the idea of diversity and it was all but shouted down in this forum, and moved to a place with no name. If we can not even stomach having a dialog, we are doomed. I was talking with the Mrs last night about the bill that past and how our side loves to say how brainless and zombioe like antis are. And yet we all line up each year behind lobbyist like zombies empty our wallets and then are surprised when that little effort by us did nothing? Its hard not to laugh at our own ignorance.
I gave up for awhile trying to have a dialog on here with diverisity because there is too much hate and bitterness blinding the truth.

We are in a very dangerous spot my friends, we are at a tilting point. SB941 pushed us to the edge and SB719 has us teetering.
I ask myself are we really that ignorant to not see what we are doing and whom we are putting faith is are failing ?
There is rumored in 2018 Hicaps will make another run, and God help us if we think Lobbyist will save our rights when they have failed to change anything at all .
We need leadership, real honest non-hateful courage's leadership without it we are doomed to repeat the arse-kicking of 2012-13, 14, 15, 16 and 2017 .................back to your regular scheduled programming.

And this is, ultimately, our biggest problem - gun folks can't find a way to work together. Either someone is "my" kind of gun owner, or I want nothing to do with them. Not conservative enough. Too conservative. Too liberal. FUDD. While the anti's find ways to get past their differences and WIN against us, we fight petty battles over someone's particular party affiliation. They tear into our rights while we complain that all gun owners aren't exactly like us. This is what's killing us.

So until gun owners can find a way to work together, we are going to continue losing. Without unity, across the board, we simply don't have the numbers. It is clear that some, perhaps more than some, won't accept working side-by-side with someone that isn't exactly like them. In this way, gun owners are their own worst enemies. And the anti's are laughing all the way to the governor's office.

 

[Urgaburga]

@DuneHopper Some of us have tried it and only gotten knifed in the back in reply--like the case I've mentioned ad nauseum of a former friend who saw firsthand what responsible CCW and gunhandling are like from me while I was in college, then decided to play Demanding Mommies Mynah Bird and take Bloomingnazi Blood Money because she decided pursuit of High Office was more important than personal integrity. (We defeated her, thank God.)

The problem with that is there isn't a politician in the land who won't sell is out majority public opinion at voting time. As Dunehopper says, we need numbers and public support. For that we need to open up as a welcoming community and have a dialogue with each other and those outside our community. We need to be ready to publicly support groups outside our and

And this is, ultimately, our biggest problem - gun folks can't find a way to work together. Either someone is "my" kind of gun owner, or I want nothing to do with them. Not conservative enough. Too conservative. Too liberal. FUDD. While the anti's find ways to get past their differences and WIN against us, we fight petty battles over someone's particular party affiliation. They tear into our rights while we complain that all gun owners aren't exactly like us. This is what's killing us.

So until gun owners can find a way to work together, we are going to continue losing. Without unity, across the board, we simply don't have the numbers. It is clear that some, perhaps more than some, won't accept working side-by-side with someone that isn't exactly like them. In this way, gun owners are their own worst enemies. And the anti's are laughing all the way to the governor's office.

We need to evolve as a group and as Dunehopper says be ready and willing to have a dialogue with each other and those outside our group and welcome them with open arms.

There is not a politician in the land who will not sell us out in favor of public opinion at voting time. We are in affect our own worst enemy. To win we need public support and for that we need to throw the doors open and also be ready to support groups outside our own.

 

[Urgaburga]

I saw this way back in 2014. Watch it and listen right to end and the applause he receives.

Why I chose a gun

 

[rick benjamin]

Impossible to improve perfect words of 2nd amendment.

Laws undermining intent, law crafters, oathbreakers.

Break the law, go to jail, free hots and a cot, free medical dental, free entertainment.
Seriously warped criminals. released, walking among us

Law provides the line of crime and punishment, cross it and get ...? rewarded?
Reprehensible thought, remove criminals, sane or insane? Who are the insane?
Cali politicians, preventing recalls.
Un-elected Oregon office holders approving enacting unjust laws (Lies)
Un-ravel the threads? Thin the herd?

 

[Urgaburga]

Impossible to improve perfect words of 2nd amendment.

Laws undermining intent, law crafters, oathbreakers.

Break the law, go to jail, free hots and a cot, free medical dental, free entertainment.
Seriously warped criminals. released, walking among us

Law provides the line of crime and punishment, cross it and get ...? rewarded?
Reprehensible thought, remove criminals, sane or insane? Who are the insane?
Cali politicians, preventing recalls.
Un-elected Oregon office holders approving enacting unjust laws (Lies)
Un-ravel the threads? Thin the herd?

SB941 was an infringement, SB719 will be another and more violent rhetoric and armchair general saber rattling (like we see on here all the time) will do nothing to stop it. All people did was write angry letters to people (the UN does the same thing to African Warlords and dictators with about the same affect).

The rights of shooter will be eroded away until we can open the door and have a dialogue with other people gain support, and support others (although we'd really be better off if we could drop politics altogether).

What illusion of any rights we have left will be eroded further and faster while people come on forums like this and see some of the hate filled crap people spout, and while gun owners are associated with the far left or right.

If the Euro's can exact more change from their leaders by protesting, making public demands, and demanding answers to their faces all when it is nearly impossible for most of them to buy anything but a shotgun, what is your pro-gun argument? It ain't all that right to bear arms to defend against an unjust government, we've had plenty of them and nobody's gone out and done bubblegum about it.