Announcement The Atmosphere of Northwest Firearms - Changes

[BoonDocks36]

Mr, Boondocks36, I share your patriotism, And I agree, I miss Mr. TAKU also. SNIPPED for Brevity ....
Forefathersrback, not in, not out, just me!!!!

Forefathersrback, Thank you for your reply . . . I posted, to Create AWARENESS.

There is a Purple Elephant in the room. AND IMNSHO, Only one person has addressed it thoughtfully.

Plainly Spoken, there is Some Moderation that HAS NOT been Equally Applied.

"Animal Farm" "All Animals are Equal, Some Animals are More Equal than others" . . .

DOES NOT work, NEVER has NEVER WILL . . .

for Those who speak of my use of the "Gang of SIX Five" and Think it means/Meant Ganging up on Posters, Completely miss the X Ring on the target . . .

Nay, they hit the Next Lanes TARGET.

We, of the Gang of Five remaining . . . supported each other in what Often was a Cross-fire Ambush . . . Three to our "One", we eventually gathered at Pete's Piccadilly Circus, and met, ate Popcorn, Cotton Candy and had a GAY Great Old Time . . . Emailing each Other, about specific threads, And YES, posting in Same.

If I agree on your Points, A, B, C, E, G, H, I, L . . . & Z and you are being attacked by five Phyne Phokes who use every Alinski Trick in the book, on A, C, E, G, I, L, M, O, P . . . & Z.

And I support you That is only is only Common Courtesy. we are a bunch of like minded friends, who saw some being ravaged by WOLVES Kitty Cats . . .

Each Member has Many Many thousand posts. . . I myself was put in a Corner by the Butler, for eating Bleu Cheese, on a Cheddar Cheese night. Oh Well, ~My bad~ . . . .

What Joe Wants he can and will have . . . But he WILL lose VITAL Members. HE ALREADY HAS.

"30,000 Member Count" PaShaw . . .

From Personal Experience, I know that Member Counts, rarely drop inactive
members . . .

On another Forum, when a very POPULAR member (and friend to the forum staff) POSTED it should be Open Season on SWAT LEO's, I objected By writing a post, which included a Rule of that forum.
>>>>> edited in By
My post was PULLED by the Butler of that Forum, and I was SCOLDED by said moderator, for "Still Wanting to be a Moderator" (never had never wanted never will . . .) But that was the Vision out of that Butlers Blind Eye.

After many many Secure Messages . . . I formally asked to have my membership removed. It was, by the words BANNED FOR LIFE . . .

I am over it . . . But I made the point (deleted, as well) That I could not be in a Forum, that advocated Murder of LEO's . . .

I think my point has been made.

If Joe runs a Forum of Equal Posting for all, no BUBBLEGUM allowed, great. Up to NOW, it has not been that way.

It will end sadly, when Alinskyites all post what they Want, in delicate polite words, whilst the Odor of Eu de' ParFUMES, increasingly disturbs one's Olfactory Senses . .

I gotta go,

philip, GO5, Humor Division

 

[Scotch7]

Quora.com has a "Suggest Edits" feature that may be possible to implement here.

If I catch something on Quora.com that bothers me, whether it is a one-word typo or an entire post by a non-native English speaker needing heavy editing, I can suggest changes. And have. Everything from a single word to a full-essay edit. So far all my "suggestions" have been accepted, including some to top-rated posters, but they can also be ignored.

If implemented here, I think most editing suggestions will be for posts that are well-intentioned, written by people who just don't write all that well, plus typos. Despite a modern culture of heavy texting, actually writing fully developed paragraphs well, is still not a common skill.

Quora has upvotes, downvotes, comments, thank, suggest-edits and report. Upvotes are immediately reported to all, downvotes have an impact, but they're invisible until a certain threshold is hit. Not perfect, but still a pretty good model. Quora skews left politically, except on 2A/RKBA where the strong voices are decidedly pro.

On a 2A/RKBA forum you're going to have a fair number of trolls, who are easy to identify, and who should be progressively quarantined if all attempts to teach proper netiquette fail.

 

[Brutus57]

Real life is some serious $h!t....the interweb considerably less so.

Brutus Out

 

[Phil Nelson]

Just kidding...

What the heck? half of my post is missing...

Anyway, hope everyone's ok out here... I didn't realize people could be so offended by voluntarily reading something online... If you're offended, look away. The U.S. Supreme court has said that.

 

[DuneHopper]

There is a Purple Elephant in the room. AND IMNSHO, Only one person has addressed it thoughtfully. Plainly Spoken, there is Some Moderation that HAS NOT been Equally Applied.
It will end sadly, when Alinskyites all post what they Want, in delicate polite words, whilst the Odor of Eu de' ParFUMES, increasingly disturbs one's Olfactory Senses . .
I gotta go, philip, GO5, Humor Division

I think I gave a very honest response to your elephant concern.

I think as well could be said, a person who points out the elephant in the room
may have skeletons in their own closest. I do not say that as an attack on you personally I say that because I am not stupid, and I see on other forums what other say total B.S. to make it sound like its peaceful protesting and voicing concerns as is hinted here. Some do use the same user names elsewhere and nope not buying it. I see people again not saying you specifically with agendas to turn every gun group into a angry pissed off militia group.

Are there issues we should be feeling that way about yes. There are places for those groups and a need. Joe Link is being clear that he doesn't want that here why is that so hard to get when he supports the ability to use other groups and has said so.
As others have said, this is the internet, gees people are not coming to your house and saying think this way or well censor you. But we are coming to another mans home invited yes, but does that give us rights to tell him his rules in his house. ? No, Do I agree with all the changes personally? Nope, do I have to nope. But if I want to remain a guest here I have a choice respect the rules or take my toys and go home.

If you were standing on the steps in Salem and being told not to think as you do,
I would stand right there with you and say you have the right to complain about all thats wrong with Oregon and Elsewhere. But the 1st Amendment doesn't apply in another person home thats the part it seems you want forced. But conversations like this confuse and divide not help join us to fight for our rights as one. This is my last word on this subject.

DH Out !

 

[Hamilton Felix]

If moderation has been less than objectively balanced, then that's on the Moderators.
But it still comes down to: The guy who runs the forum makes the rules. And I think this forum is really trying to be reasonable. While I think the forum that booted a guy for pointing out a serious violation of its own rules is crazy, at least the response of leaving that forum is rational and always an option.

Funny thing: I join probably more forums than I really have time for (maybe when I retire ). I seldom even bother reading through all of the rules. I find that by not being obnoxious or insulting, and by disagreeing politely rather than calling names, I seem to get along just fine.

We're here for guns, shooting and the freedom to have guns and shoot. You're never going to completely escape politics in such a place. But we can keep it to a minimum. We're not here to argue abortion, gay marriage or anything like that; there are plenty of other forums that do.

I'm going to do my best to remember that gun haters and perhaps more importantly, "on the fence about it" readers are looking at us, not just the pro-gunners we see here. I'll try to help them see our "gun culture" as a positive thing.

 

[Brutus57]

Hello NWFA, my name is Chelsea and I just wanted a safe place to talk.........


Sorry, couldn't help it, sometimes at work, on lunch break my inner smart a$$ can't keep the lip zipped. This remark is not aimed at anyone or anything in particular. Call it a flyer



Brutus Out

 

[Hamilton Felix]

LOL! That's a good one!

Well, I do think that with just a bit of restraint we can have civil discussions and even disagreements here. Not to bring politics into it, but "debate" is supposed to be reasoned discussion, a rational point and counterpoint, not the "Jerry Springer Show" we've been seeing under the debate label on national TV lately. (Now, nobody say "Jane, you ignorant slut...")

 

[Diamondback]

We considered this years ago and ultimately decided against it. I don't think the rules are difficult to follow, it's mostly people who don't agree with them choosing not to follow them.

Thank you. As someone with a stalker problem (it seems dormant but I'm well acquainted with the "lull into false sense of security" strategy since this guy used it on my ex), if you make such a rule change I will need to IMMEDIATELY delete my account and all my content, including posts where others have quoted me.

So far, everything I've seen from On Top as planned "rules revision" seems reasonable.

 

[BoonDocks36]

I think I gave a very honest response to your elephant concern.

yes, YOU did, and you are One of Several members I follow regularly . . .

I think as well could be said, a person who points out the elephant in the room
may have skeletons in their own closest. I do not say that as an attack on you personally I say that because I am not stupid, and I see on other forums what other say total B.S. to make it sound like its peaceful protesting and voicing concerns as is hinted here.

I worry not, about what any body says or thinks of me, but like the quote in the movie: "I don't care what you say about me . . . but don't talk bad about my dawg"

Are there issues we should be feeling that way about yes. There are places for those groups and a need. Joe Link is being clear that he doesn't want that here why is that so hard to get when he supports the ability to use other groups and has said so.

I am in total agreement . . . Again ! ! !

But if I want to remain a guest here I have a choice respect the rules or take my toys and go home.

Again, DuneHopper, total agreement ! ! !

SNIPPED BREVITY

This is my last word on this subject.

DH Out ![/QUOTE <left open on purpose>

My Original points, restated are these:

1. Political Correctness, in and by itself is worthless.
2. My Opinion only: the Largest Problem is PROPER MODERATION.

A completed restatement. Brief. To the Point.

The Lost Gang of 6 member, In My Opinion, Was the Most Influential, Non Professional Member here. I read, Dave Workman, I agree on most of his Writings. He and I went around the clock, on one topic, and I think we agreed to disagree in the end . . . HIS work is most of what he posts here. So I can understand his position.

I challenge EveryBody, Joe Link included, to go to the Political Forums, and Count TAKU's posts. the man, lives & Breaths 2A, beyond that, he is an Expert in Gunsmithing, milling & machining.

He will not return, DUE ONLY TO ONE THING, mal-practiced moderation.
PERIOD.

Am I speaking out of turn? No. He in fact has Privately emailed me, and said "philip, do not get Yourself in trouble, over my being banned"

I translated that in my Viet Nam Veteran Brain as "brother, I'm bleeding out, its getting Dark, save yourself, No Morphine, save it for someone alive . . ."

Over Dramatic ? ? ? thank you for the opinion. I am ANGRY.

Do I care if I am Modded off the forum? Not in a Rats A$$ . . . and that isn't like a double down dare . . . I just do not care.

see prior post about Murdering SWAT, this thread: I was a Life Time "Special Award" Member, for my Very instructive Posts in Survival. I Taught Members of that Forum, some driving 200 Miles for our gathering . . .

And I WANTED to stay there. One Bad Moderator who had it In For me, Paranoia ? ? ? Only if they are Not out to get you. I Wrote the OWNER private Email, and spoke . . . Why Some dip$hit felt insecure about thinking I wanted to moderate . . . I have No Idea, in the ORIGINAL Rules: "First we are self moderating" Also in rules: "No Illegal Activities shall be presented"

OK, so . . . advocating Murder does not pass my smell test, how about any of you, ~Joe Link~ Would you allow that?

See folks, I am really trying explain the Ideals of a "perfect Forum here" as if possible.

The Butler: if that person does not know who he is then he has Never Played "CLUE" . . .

I will not name the person, I got a temp ban for that ONCE.

But Equality of Moderation will be Two Hundred Percent MORE better, than 98% of PC Oh be so nice, brother & sister.

Dune Runner, NONE of the above is pointed at you, I would buy you your drink of choice anytime I was on the Coast, where da Dunes be at . . . .

And, This thread, Is the Only Thread I will post in, until the Needs of the Forum are met.

I save my posts just for prosperity . . .

philip. Christian. Patriot. Conservative, because of the First two . . .
"Long Live Taku, Finest Member a Forum could Ban"

 

[SVT-ROY]

Well I am guilty of being a hot head and spouting off myself. Let's all tighten our game up and be more positive and respectful to all.

 

[scrandall01215]

Mr, Boondocks36, I share your patriotism, And I agree, I miss Mr. TAKU also. Others say their posts have never been censored, mine & others have been censored!!!! { and deleted} I will speak only of mine!
Not because of name calling, or rude behavior, just for simply voicing my opinion! Which must have been viewed as, politically incorrect! Wow, times have certainly changed. Remember the time when the Master Craftsman taught an apprentice the correct way? We are now living in a time when the apprentice, is teaching an apprentice! and my message to them, "You're an errand boy, sent by a grocery clerk, to collect an over due bill."

Forefathersrback, not in, not out, just me!!!!

I to have recently had my posts deleted for voicing my opinion and I NEVER called anyone names, belittled, or was rude.
I don't understand why there is only ONE mods. Name on ALL the deleted posts I thought there was 4-5 mods. But only ONE finds these posts offensive.
I've been a member here since '12 and every time there has been these types of issues it always leads back to one mod.! Why not get rid of the devisive moderator instead of creating a bunch of new rules it would solve most of the problems then have the remaining mods. Equally enforce the rules.

Stacy
P.S. We'll see if I get punished for speaking the truth in public!!!!

 

[BoonDocks36]

Well I am guilty of being a hot head and spouting off myself. Let's all tighten our game up and be more positive and respectful to all.

Real Humans realize that, and say, Gee SVT-ROY, I was a bit off kilter posting that to you, sorry, It used to be called "man-UP", but we got some AWESOME Ladies here, and so I used ~humans~.

And I can grok that. BTDT, took a bit to see the fool in the Mirror. Yeah, we can all tighten up.

My Point, again, is there are trolls on here, they are not Republicans, or Conservatives . . . I will use my favorite phrase for them, "Alinskyites", from Saul Alinsky, Rules for radicals . . .

If a heavy hand from the Butler was Ever needed, it is on their case . . .

If I seem to be Tunnel Visioned, Your seeing 20-20, because I am. I Abhore Communism, I can handle Democrats, and Libertarians, or even Liberals . . . do not feed me "Progressive" and tell me I am eating Prime Rib, I have had Prime RIB, and the plate was $50.00, so I think it was ~fair~ to ~moderately Good~ . . . not just a menu item . . .

I hope etrain16 is reading, he just received my new book, How to understand philip's HUmore, and other methods of Sprechen zie Englaish . . .

Any of "those" who enter Any Forum, to create dissension of and for itself should be banned into pixie dust, for ever. ISP locks and all.

And they Know How to Infiltrate. They are like a Cancer. Joe Link: is there illness in
your Forum ? ? ?

But, The Number One Most Posts, until Banned: hot headed, yes. Fervent. YES. for he has seen the Enemy, and Fought him in the REAL LIFE Trenches, RVN. US Marine. Mid-60's. me: I was 1969-70, In Rocket City, in the middle of the Fish Hook, for those whose history includes RVN. I do Not Like Communists, that FORCE a twelve year old girl to carry a Mortar Tube, and her 10 year old Brother 2 mortars, Under threat that their parents will be (Killed) I was Polite there for our Females here, the Ladies, who should never see/hear what a Devoted Communist will and can Do . . . . . . .

No, I do Not think this is a thread memorializing my friend TAKU.
But Might I mention there is a Chartreuse Pachyderm in the Room?
there . . . I need Not say that Again, I manipulated the correct icons.

I love my new MacBook Air, my iPad took a hit from a 308, they are threat level III but not IV . . . but I digress, and gee, it is dinner time . . .

gotta go, chow down on Tube Steak, and a glass of Milk.

later philip Christian. Patriot. Conservative, due to Numbers One And Two, brought to you today, by the words Freedom, Eternal Flame, and by the Tree of Liberty, waterd by the Blood of Freedom Fighters who are called Terrorists by our current prezEdent.

 

[etrain16]

I hope etrain16 is reading, he just received my new book, How to understand philip's HUmore, and other methods of Sprechen zie Englaish . . .

And a fine read it is

 

[Libertas7]

First off I'd like to say thank you Joe Link for all work you've done on this site! It shows.

QUESTIONS TO CONSIDER

• How do we create a positive, welcoming environment here?

Not accusing anyone of this but trying not to be (too) judgmental of others would be good to keep in mind.

 

[Silver Hand]

Respond politely!
Silver Hand

 

[forefathersrback]

Hi @Forefathersback I think you are getting to where people need to read and understand your post gives great insight, I noted you did not mention at anytime your 2nd Amendment right was censored, just your non-firearm political views and I can say that is going to vary person to person and ergo is why I have said in my opinion non-2nd political related should not be on a gun enthusiast site( my opinion). Its very clear reading Boondocks last post as well that this is exactly were the problem is at. I know the choice has been made to allow political stuff here still but as we can see the group is divided of political vs 2nd Amendment rights. Some say they are all in the same, some say not. Those that have been censored have only been done when it was a non-2nd Amendment issue. I am mid to the right politically not far right but I get and agree with allot of post I have seen and some even removed. But I don't post to them often or respond cause I didn't see this as the place to discuss it. but I have yet to read anyones claim when they were talking about gun laws, or gun rights their posts were removed and that should tell allot about where we are as a group right ?

 

[BoonDocks36]

QUOTE="forefathersrback, post: 1411311, member: 29184"]Dunehopper, hope all is well.
I wrote a long reply to your post. I chose to shelf my original post for now.
SNIPPED for Brevity
I chose, not to pale in his shadow. { I will finish the rest at a later date}

Forefathersrback, not in, not out, just me defending the whole constitution![/QUOTE> Left open for
CLARITY . . .

I just had to take a time out, Got my MacBookPro out, and watched a Movie, rather than stay on the forum. I watched Robin Williams in "Hook" . . . I ~Really needed the Humor~ . . . you see, From 8 January to present time, I have been really twitchy. a personal Matter, but my ABILITY, to control my PTSD, has only of recent, been easier . . . the Entire Five weeks after 8 January, have been harder to deal with than anything I have faced since '96 . . . So MOST of the Burns/Hammond issues I HAD to LET GO of . . .

So Forefathersrback, I know nothing of your comments I removed. Highlighted in your above, is my reason for reply . . . I admire Any One, that can shelve a post that has Emotional Impact, that yours (still has) . . . This is not a put down, or anything near it . . . just my thoughts.

I have in the internet time I have done forums, written as explosive a post as this one. later then I felt More like Post #135 and then looked in the mirror. ala' post#137 prior page (7) . . .

I am writing, this, because I admire Both persons in the post I am quoting . . . AND ~that~ is what Joe Link is discussing . . . And I would ask, as a friend of the Constitution . . . to rethink this post, in regards to the Real Issue at hand.

I could walk past Dunehopper and not know it, and you as well, But I know both, from reading your posts.

Hopper of Dune's is not the & not your Enemy. I speak only as a RVN vet, who has seen too much in my life. FFB, I would gently challenge you, to read other DH posts, not related to the Extremely Heated topic of Burns . . . and its aftermath . . . See Him for the Fellow Patriot he is ! ! !

and if possible, then delete your post . . .Wait longer, let your Anger & RAGE come down some more.

I offer this as well: if you Wish, private message me, talk to me ALL of your pain's that caused you to write this even AFTER WAITING a while. I give my Word as a Pastor, it will go no where else, but Brother in Patriotism, I read ~the need~ for you to vent it out, and I listen good.

Note, none of my above has my usual style of humor in it . . . I know there is NOTHING humorous of & about Harney County & aftermath.

Just straight talk . . . BTW, not mentioned for a Long Time . . . I was a Chaplin's Assistant, both stateside & for a while in the Fish Hook . . . the Padre' was short a man, and the LORD spoke to me, I filled in, until his assistant arrived . . . It is the SAME reason I write this, I listen to my SAVIOR, and do HIS bidding.

philip, Christian. Patriot. Conservative, because of those first two words.[/QUOTE]

 

[Cataphract]

So I'm going to come out and admit that I was one of the people who'd asked to be removed from this forum. Why? Because I got tired of reading about liberals being the worst kind of scum, about "people who vote for Hillary should be brought up on treason charges..." "Liberals should die" sort of thing.
My Grandmother voted for Hillary. She thinks a woman in the White House is a great idea, and isn't specifically interested in gun control. Do the people making these comments really want to shoot my Grandmother? They're probably using a bit of hyperbole to make a point, but then again I've met some crazy people, and more importantly, those comments are indicative of the kind of divisive language that shuts people out.
So, being a newer member I thought to myself, "So this is the culture here..." Which, if it was, is fine. I didn't build this site, and many, many people have been here posting prior to my joining, so if that was the established culture, so be it. The one thing I didn't want to do is to demand that an established culture change itself simply because I arrived. That's not in my nature, and I find it irritating when others do it. So, I simply asked to no longer be a part of the culture.
I thought about simply not reading the posts that caused concern, but by my way of thinking, if the forum was perfectly fine with advocating death for the folks who don't agree with them politically, it probably wasn't going to be my thing anyway.
Some of the replies I've seen here seem to be indicative of another issue I've seen in recent years and that is that people seem to think that just because they have the first amendment to protect free speech, that it means that EVERYTHING that comes into their heads must be said, regardless of propriety or audience. To give you an example of this, I took a relative to the doctor a few years ago. We were sitting in the waiting room, and there were a few other people with us, a couple of whom happened to be a minority. My relative took it upon himself to start trying to talk to me, in a voice that others in the room could clearly hear, about how these minorities are just coming in and wasting our hard earned taxpayer dollars because they don't work, don't contribute, just stealing from you and me, no job, no insurance....and I looked at him, and said, "if they decide to come over here and beat your "bubblegum", I won't stop them...".
Was it his right to think these things? Yes. Was it his right to say them. Definitely. Was it the right thing to do? No. We all have the right to free speech as Americans, and I believe in upholding that right. I also believe that we exist in a society, both on this forum and outside, and we have to use our freedoms responsibly. We have to remember that in a society, we do not exist in a bubble, and what we say and do affects other people to some extent.
The war for the 2nd amendment is going to be fought in the middle. Like it or not, there's 10% of folks who will always think guns=murder, and 10% who think that an armed revolution is the only answer for the problem...any problem... It's the 80% in the middle who we have to win over, and if you're one of those 10% who seems to advocate for some kind of holy war against people who don't totally back your ideals, then you're hurting the cause. The quickest way to turn people off to the whole idea of guns and shooting is to play into the stereotype of a tinfoil hat wearing heavily armed nutjob who's itching to pop a few rounds off in the general direction of a school because he thought the helicopter flying overhead was spying on him. Posting things like "...liberals should die" makes you sound like the American version of the Taliban...unyielding in your ideals to the point where the folks who may peacefully disagree with you must be dealt with in a violent fashion.
Call it "pussification" if you want, but I think the only way to avoid further attempts to regulate guns, is to no longer allow our image to be set by this highly vocal 10%. There are kids graduating high school who have never held or shot a gun outside of a video game. In a year or two, maybe sooner, they'll be voting. They have no "real world" connection to guns, as it's not a part of their lives. If you know one, the next time you go plinking, invite them along. Teach them the basics of gun safety, teach them about the fact that while on the one hand guns can be used for the kind of chaos we're bombarded with 24/7 by the news channels, they can also be tools for gathering food, for protection, and...mostly, a great time in the woods or the range. Offer to take that person you know who's never been around guns out and make it a part of their reality. Be an ambassador for our sport/hobby/obsession, and reap the benefits that getting more people involved with it will bring. Bring them to see the gun as another tool, and they'll soon be asking the right questions when a gun control bill comes up for vote. Show them that not everyone who responsibly owns, carries, and uses firearms is a threat to them, and they will cease to blindly follow fear when they cast a ballot.
So, I don't know about any of the backstory, who's been censored, who's been banned, or why. I can just tell you that in my opinion, Joe Link has done the braver thing in this socio-political climate and advocated for moderation in our responses to each other and the outside world. It would have been far easier for him to sit back like many of us did and just watch the forum become a one dimensional hate fest where anyone who doesn't conform must be eliminated. I certainly didn't speak up, and I'm guessing there are others who would have simply drifted away as well.
As it's been stated several times, this is Joe Link's forum, and they are his rules. If he said we all had to have purple ponies as our profile pics or he'd delete our accounts, then he'd be a little odd, but well within his powers. So if he's asking us not to suggest that folks we don't agree with should be spitted and roasted alive, rather than simply disagreeing in a civil fashion, why is that hard? If having to relate to others in a manner that doesn't relay a total lack of respect bothers you that much, the internet's a big place, and it's not that hard to start your own forum where you make the rules.

 

[Hal Jordan]

Cataphract, what a great post! I regret that I have only one "like" to give in response.

So, being a newer member I thought to myself, "So this is the culture here..." Which, if it was, is fine. I didn't build this site, and many, many people have been here posting prior to my joining, so if that was the established culture, so be it.

I am also a newer member, but my experience was a little different. The "Liberals should die" folks seem to be everywhere, to the point where my brain just skips over those attacks. What hit me in the face about this forum was posting in a very contentious thread, replying to one member with an opposite opinion. His response was to say something like "You're an idiot, welcome to my ignore list, you just set a new record." That started the alarm bells ringing for me.

Many years ago I was in an administrator position on a very large discussion board. There was a group of trolls in the General Discussion forum who delighted in trying to violate the rules just slightly and then complain when they were told to stop. They formed their own secret discussion board and called themselves the Mayhem Attack Squad (MAS). Their goal was not to participate in good discussions but to cause problems and mayhem for our board's staff members. We had a spy on their board, and he fed us information about what they were planning. One of their tactics was using their board to coordinate attacks in different sub-forums of our board. So if we told one of the MAS members to stop causing problems in a discussion thread, other MAS members would show up and offer support to the problem-causer by attacking our board's staff. Some of their attacks would take the form of "You are asking me to stop, but you never asked this other guy over here to stop, and what he said was far worse." Our time was eaten up with constant explanations for why we took an action, rather than being able to help other members and participate in the fun discussions ourselves. The MAS members were laughing about some of their exploits, because their only goal was to get the board members and staff to respond and get angry.

What I remember from that board was what I was seeing in that discussion thread. A new member of this forum, when seeing one person attacking someone else, might think one of three things:

1. This forum is not very friendly. Attacks on other members are allowed here. I will find somewhere else to hang out.
2. This forum is not very friendly. Attacks on other members are allowed here. I will ignore the attacks and participate in the useful discussions.
3. This forum is not very friendly. Attacks on other members are allowed here. Oh boy, this looks like a good place to troll. I wonder if there's a Mayhem Attack Squad that I can join.

In the first case, you lose a potentially valuable new member. But the third case is even worse. If you love trolling, then sooner or later you will be hooking up with the other trolls, making life on the forum miserable. Then the Gang of Six becomes the Gang of Ten or the Gang of Twenty-Five, supporting each other by attacking those who they see as enemies. After a while, the trolling becomes so pervasive that other members can't ignore it any more, and they will start leaving too. My discussion board is now also a ghost town, due in large part to successful trolling by the MAS members.

Some of the replies I've seen here seem to be indicative of another issue I've seen in recent years and that is that people seem to think that just because they have the first amendment to protect free speech, that it means that EVERYTHING that comes into their heads must be said, regardless of propriety or audience.

I am starting to think (without any evidence, so far) that some of the more extreme statements like "Liberals should die" are being made on blogs and forums by the anti-gun folks, to make us look bad. You will see a rational discussion going on here, with people making interesting and well thought out points, when suddenly someone will come in talking about traitors, and false flags, and watering the tree of liberty. I believe it's done on purpose, so they can go back to their anti-gun discussion forums and say "Well look at this post on the NWFA forum. They're all a bunch of redneck nutjobs over there." No proof of that so far, but it looks highly suspicious.

Call it "pussification" if you want, but I think the only way to avoid further attempts to regulate guns, is to no longer allow our image to be set by this highly vocal 10%.

I wouldn't call it that. If we can't discuss issues in a rational and friendly manner without tearing each other apart, then we're not very good representatives of our cause. And even if someone among us has awesome military experience and vast firearms knowledge and is a great source of information to others, if he refuses to abide by the forum rules then he needs to have his membership privileges revoked.