Announcement The Atmosphere of Northwest Firearms - Changes

[Mikej]

I have to disagree with you on one point @Hal Jordan. I fully believe Donald Trump's hairdo SHOULD be a topic of discussion if someone wishes too. Though the topic may be more appropriate in "Off Topic"?

 

[tminus]

What a bunch of babies holy #@$%. From a new members point of view the people that cant keep their opinions to themselves are clowns. Like its been said this isnt a political view point website. Leave a link to one and invite anyone who would like to, go there and talk about politics. Everyone who would like to excersize their rites to speak freely can go there.

 

[Joe Link]

What I see that runs people off!

#1 is Thread Crapping!

#2 Mods running off helpers which are a Great Asset to the form because of the incidental/advert sales where it be a part time hobby or full blown retail.

Not every dealer/self funding hobbyist is making a massive profit. Most are kitchen counter or home garage hobbyists covers expenses.

We garage hobbyists cannot afford the massive monthly charges on a NWFA supporting membership so we just stop helping to avoid a hassle. When we get moderated about not being a supporting member etc. Why spend time to help to refer to another vendor "some times we do" or get told not to advertise when we can help and offer a discount to Members?

We are treated as If our expertise/knowledge is not wanted? Knowledge is always free to a point! But some times a item must be referred why help and refer to someone else? If one can help make a few bucks + forum gets content = more members!

Our time and knowledge, yes even hobbyists/collectors in a specific area is just as valuable as yours is, and if we got what they are Asking For, Require, or Need local = good for Both!

Again The Forum gets the knowledge & content + generally more content afterwords. Possibly the dealer or hobbyist makes a few bucks.

I can see where a large dealer like keiths or others may have to be supporting members.

As the last message I received I have withdrawn from any ak build help.

Just my thoughts!

Why help when we get classified as a dealer and the forum wants large sums of cash monthly.

This is one rule we will not be reconsidering. This site requires a great deal of money each month to stay online. We're not going to split hairs here, if someone is engaging in commercial activity a Supporting Vendor membership is required. These memberships start as low as $37.50 per month, so it's not as if we're not trying to give little guys a chance.

I need further explanation of this point:




Will that mean Preparedness will have to be about guns, or can't be about guns, or something else?

Good question, definitely not. There is a ton of great information in there, and it's always good to be prepared. That point is referring to the political/tinfoil/TEOTWAWKI side of things.

 

[Joe Link]

@Joe Link, I've got an idea that popped into my head recently and wanted to run it by you, and since this thread seems like the right place - here it is. I was thinking about creating a position at the forum known as "Ambassadors". The idea would be that there would be a pool of folks, preferably established members, that would or could be 'assigned' to new members and visitors. The purpose of the ambassadors would be to help the new folks learn to navigate, answer some questions and just be certain that the new folks get a warm welcome. It could be an optional thing, that a new member could select to have assigned to them. Most of the jobs I've worked, you have someone assigned as kind of a welcome team, to help guide you in your initial arrival to a new place. It's kind of along those lines. We have some pretty friendly folks here that I'm sure wouldn't mind offering to fulfill such a position. I know the mods and you are busy with other things, so it wouldn't put any additional burden on any of you. Ultimately, it assures that they make at least one personal connection when they come to the site, and that may just help more folks comfortably enter the NWFA space.

NWFA Mentors - I think this is a fantastic idea! I'd rather use the Mentor title as Ambassador has more of a B2B connotation rather than education/helpfulness. A mentorship program is actually something we considered a few years back, completely forgot about it. I can see this as, as you said, maybe an option when registering. Until we got a software solution in place it could be a simple 'Find a Mentor Here' thread in the new member introduction section. Once we get the ideas here fleshed out lets talk more on this

 

[Lilhigbee]

So I see this "Crowd Moderation" is working already in another thread!! Just curious, however, the post that was deleted had been quoted and still shows up in the post where it was quoted. Not sure if this is a problem, just mentioning what I saw.

 

[Phil Nelson]

Just kidding...

 

[tminus]

I have to disagree with you on one point @Hal Jordan. I fully believe Donald Trump's hairdo SHOULD be a topic of discussion if someone wishes too. Though the topic may be more appropriate in "Off Topic"?

Nobody can argue that his hair is funny.

 

[twa2471]

When I first came on here I ran into many many posts that were mostly rude comments by a bunch of curmudgeons or folks that just seemed to want to argue about nothing at all and make derogitor comments and just wanted to be "Dicks" in general. And I hadn't noticed many good folks.

So I left. Recently I saw the changes and came back after getting a e-mail outlining the changes to check it out again.

And I couldn't be happier with the changes I've seen !! Now you''ll probably have someone that will be doing thousands of posts and sticking around as I have on Gunco. You Poor Guys!!!

I do think blocking the occasional cuss word is a bit over the top IMHO though , but if threads do turn into tirades filled with nothing BUT cuss words, Then there's an issue and your justified.
But the occasional cuss word IMO don't bother me,,I too occasionally get PI**ed off at things and can't help but to express that with a cuss word to emphasize a point or show my displeasure with something. Rants with nothing but cuss words,,,I'd generally ignore anyways and agree they don't really have a place anywhere.

I do very much like the changes I've seen so far overall,,and already met some really good folks here , so my initial impression of this site has changed 180 degrees,and I'm impressed and pleased with the changes. Thank You.

So now I'll be staying around and now your stuck with me !!!

Poor Bas***ds!!! Hey ,,you asked for it after all!!!

 

[DuneHopper]

When I first came on here I ran into many many posts that were mostly rude comments by a bunch of curmudgeons or folks that just seemed to want to argue about nothing at all and make derogitor comments and just wanted to be "Dicks" in general. And I hadn't noticed many good folks.

So I left. Recently I saw the changes and came back after getting a e-mail outlining the changes to check it out again.

And I couldn't be happier with the changes I've seen !! Now you''ll probably have someone that will be doing thousands of posts and sticking around as I have on Gunco. You Poor Guys!!!

So now I'll be staying around and now your stuck with me !!!

Poor Bas***ds!!! Hey ,,you asked for it after all!!!

Welcome back................

 

[Patriot1668]

When I first came on here I ran into many many posts that were mostly rude comments by a bunch of curmudgeons or folks that just seemed to want to argue about nothing at all and make derogitor comments and just wanted to be "Dicks" in general. And I hadn't noticed many good folks.

So I left. Recently I saw the changes and came back after getting a e-mail outlining the changes to check it out again.

And I couldn't be happier with the changes I've seen !! Now you''ll probably have someone that will be doing thousands of posts and sticking around as I have on Gunco. You Poor Guys!!!

I do think blocking the occasional cuss word is a bit over the top IMHO though , but if threads do turn into tirades filled with nothing BUT cuss words, Then there's an issue and your justified.
But the occasional cuss word IMO don't bother me,,I too occasionally get PI**ed off at things and can't help but to express that with a cuss word to emphasize a point or show my displeasure with something. Rants with nothing but cuss words,,,I'd generally ignore anyways and agree they don't really have a place anywhere.

I do very much like the changes I've seen so far overall,,and already met some really good folks here , so my initial impression of this site has changed 180 degrees,and I'm impressed and pleased with the changes. Thank You.

So now I'll be staying around and now your stuck with me !!!

Poor Bas***ds!!! Hey ,,you asked for it after all!!!

Not that I doubt that it could happen, but in three years or so I've personally never read a single post as you described. That said, I don't read or post to all forums. Where on the site has this been happening on a regular basis?

EDIT: ....and welcome back!

 

[Joe Link]

So I see this "Crowd Moderation" is working already in another thread!! Just curious, however, the post that was deleted had been quoted and still shows up in the post where it was quoted. Not sure if this is a problem, just mentioning what I saw.

Good catch! I'll let the developer know.

 

[twa2471]

I came on in early 2011 looking for information to a problem and it was my first experience with gun forums. Back then I wasn't all that impressed and it reminded me of the Dirty Dozen Bunker to a degree,, but I sure do like the changes I've seen sense. Good Job mods.
I have already meet some real good folks and already had some great conversations,,I'm happy as a clam now!! I hope I can contribute positively here. I sure do love the C&R section and many others here!!

I'm an old guy but do have several "evil Black Guns" but mostly I'm a hunter/ target shooter/ builder,, more than anything and that's what kind of guns I enjoy most. Even though I have several "Evil Guns"
Thanks for the great changes, a much better place now.

 

[twa2471]

BTW, I'm still figuring out the site so I'm sure I'll make mistakes posting ,,so give me heck if necessary!! I still don't quite know how to change my profile pic or edit a post though when I loose my train of thought ???

 

[2A2Dend]

With my being fairly new here and I call it as I see it. Some strike me as if they have an agenda given their response. A bait-n-hook. Those types hinder why the forum exists. Or does it? What is the purpose of the forum? I continue to see it happen, and my jist of it, this place revolves around bait-n-hook.
If this is called "getting to know you", I call BS.

For as much as I disprove, I don't "ignore" anyone. I simply move on.

That's my take.

 

[Hal Jordan]

What is the purpose of the forum? I continue to see it happen, and my jist of it, this place revolves around bait-n-hook.

That's an unfamiliar term. Do you mean bait-and-switch? Are you thinking something like "You lured me here with the promise of firearms discussion, but all I see is trolling and arguing?" If that's it, I can show you several great discussions with no trolls or arguments in sight.

The purpose of the forum was discussed earlier in this thread, I think. There isn't an overall mission statement. But if you look at the rules page, under #2 you'll see that it says "We are a single-issue organization, focused solely on bringing people together in support of the 2nd Amendment." Maybe that's the answer you were looking for.

 

[2A2Dend]

No Sir. Bait-n-hook
http://dictionary.reverso.net/english-definition/to bait the hook

 

[Vantage]

Personally, I'm glad to see these changes occurring. I left this community a few years ago because of the very reasons discussed.

QUESTIONS TO CONSIDER

• How do we create a positive, welcoming environment here?
  
• What do we want peoples' initial impressions of our community to be?
  
• What words do we want people to use to describe our community?
• What words do we not want people to use to describe our community?

I'd like to suggest the idea of a posted Mission Statement. Or a "Constitution". A Code that serves as a guideline for behavior. A Pledge maybe. Many of us are veterans and understand those things. Nothing long, or elaborate, but something that says this is who we are, and this is how we behave. It's setting a quality control standard. Anything that falls below that standard gets eliminated. Personally I think strict adherence to the rules needs to be enforced until some precedence has been set. Just like the "Broken Windows" policy, or like raising kids. Principles set when they're young are easier to enforce in the long term.

The battle we are fighting in this forum is the same one we are fighting nationally. There are three groups of people out there. Those devoted Pro-Gun, those devoted Anti-Gun, and those that haven't really spent much time considering either, and are in the middle.

We're likely not going to sway those people in the Anti-Gun community. What we need to focus on are influencing those that are in the undecided/middle. Additionally we need to keep those currently Pro-Gun from not wanting to be associated with a certain type of image. The "Black Helicopter Brigade" as Joe Biden labeled them/us.

Insulting people who disagree with us does not make us look very attractive. Calling people stupid, or idiots does not make us look like reasonable, informed people that others should be listening too. Who wants to be part of a group of people who are angry, and negative, and name calling? And who can only accept the world as their very own narrow view of things? I don't want to be a part of that.

We need to present our argument in an educational, informative, and welcoming way.

I like the idea of having a voting system in place. I don't know if it's like or dislike. I do agree that having "dislike" creates a negative feel to it.

Is there a way to do it like Reddit where people vote a topic up or down? Or "report" or "flag" when something is posted that should be addressed immediately?

It's all going to come down to the population of the members. If there are more of us that want it vs those that want it they way it's become.

Would it be possible to immediately suspend everyone's membership and require that people read and agree to the Pledge before reactivating the membership? It would also be something that new members would be required to do in order to start a membership.

I bet that might weed out some of the bad apples right there. They are not going to want to agree to those things.

Just my two cents.

 

[Vantage]

If you want to force people to play nice then require people to use their real names. Some people will stop posting but they're going to anyway if you have to check a rule list to determine if what you want to say is okay.

Don H. is right. Anonymity is what allows people to behave like jerks.

 

[tminus]

This is one rule we will not be reconsidering. This site requires a great deal of money each month to stay online. We're not going to split hairs here, if someone is engaging in commercial activity a Supporting Vendor membership is required. These memberships start as low as $37.50 per month, so it's not as if we're not trying to give little guys a chance.



Good question, definitely not. There is a ton of great information in there, and it's always good to be prepared. That point is referring to the political/tinfoil/TEOTWAWKI side of things.

Almost $40 a month is kind of expensive, I'm on disability. What advantage does the Supporting Vendor get you, or are those for someone with a license to sell weapons?

 

[Mikej]

I came on in early 2011 looking for information to a problem and it was my first experience with gun forums. Back then I wasn't all that impressed and it reminded me of the Dirty Dozen Bunker to a degree,, but I sure do like the changes I've seen sense. Good Job mods.
I have already meet some real good folks and already had some great conversations,,I'm happy as a clam now!! I hope I can contribute positively here. I sure do love the C&R section and many others here!!

I'm an old guy but do have several "evil Black Guns" but mostly I'm a hunter/ target shooter/ builder,, more than anything and that's what kind of guns I enjoy most. Even though I have several "Evil Guns"
Thanks for the great changes, a much better place now.

With my being fairly new here and I call it as I see it. Some strike me as if they have an agenda given their response. A bait-n-hook. Those types hinder why the forum exists. Or does it? What is the purpose of the forum? I continue to see it happen, and my jist of it, this place revolves around bait-n-hook.
If this is called "getting to know you", I call BS.

For as much as I disprove, I don't "ignore" anyone. I simply move on.

That's my take.

Personally, I'm glad to see these changes occurring. I left this community a few years ago because of the very reasons discussed.

QUESTIONS TO CONSIDER

• How do we create a positive, welcoming environment here?
  
• What do we want peoples' initial impressions of our community to be?
  
• What words do we want people to use to describe our community?
• What words do we not want people to use to describe our community?

I'd like to suggest the idea of a posted Mission Statement. Or a "Constitution". A Code that serves as a guideline for behavior. A Pledge maybe. Many of us are veterans and understand those things. Nothing long, or elaborate, but something that says this is who we are, and this is how we behave. It's setting a quality control standard. Anything that falls below that standard gets eliminated. Personally I think strict adherence to the rules needs to be enforced until some precedence has been set. Just like the "Broken Windows" policy, or like raising kids. Principles set when they're young are easier to enforce in the long term.

The battle we are fighting in this forum is the same one we are fighting nationally. There are three groups of people out there. Those devoted Pro-Gun, those devoted Anti-Gun, and those that haven't really spent much time considering either, and are in the middle.

We're likely not going to sway those people in the Anti-Gun community. What we need to focus on are influencing those that are in the undecided/middle. Additionally we need to keep those currently Pro-Gun from not wanting to be associated with a certain type of image. The "Black Helicopter Brigade" as Joe Biden labeled them/us.

Insulting people who disagree with us does not make us look very attractive. Calling people stupid, or idiots does not make us look like reasonable, informed people that others should be listening too. Who wants to be part of a group of people who are angry, and negative, and name calling? And who can only accept the world as their very own narrow view of things? I don't want to be a part of that.

We need to present our argument in an educational, informative, and welcoming way.

I like the idea of having a voting system in place. I don't know if it's like or dislike. I do agree that having "dislike" creates a negative feel to it.

Is there a way to do it like Reddit where people vote a topic up or down? Or "report" or "flag" when something is posted that should be addressed immediately?

It's all going to come down to the population of the members. If there are more of us that want it vs those that want it they way it's become.

Would it be possible to immediately suspend everyone's membership and require that people read and agree to the Pledge before reactivating the membership? It would also be something that new members would be required to do in order to start a membership.

I bet that might weed out some of the bad apples right there. They are not going to want to agree to those things.

Just my two cents.

A site with many people is going to have those you agree with and would love to share a beer, get a sandwich with etc. You'll also have those that are a little strong. You just need to let those you feel are to strong/pushy/insulting be who they are, as long as they are not blatantly offensive, leave 'em alone/ignore them. (I don't mean use the ignore feature unless that's your thing) If we got too thin skinned around here we'll kill what I love about the place. Be the bigger person and let it go. Converse with and enjoy those that you like. The bad apples will drift away.

As I've read things for the past 4+ years I've seen very few who need to be gone, and for the most part, those people end up posting very little or not at all now.

This site is a living thing with ebbs and flows, go with it, stay around and we'll all benefit!

Damn! is that prophetic or what?