Taurus 1911 Quality

[PhysicsGuy]

To those with missing posts here:

This is a forum for firearms discussion, please keep your personal arguments out of it.

 

[ls2gto]

Yeah, so anyway, back to Taurus...

Are the Taurus PT92's still made on the former Beretta 92 factory tooling machinery? I had a PT92 back in the early 90s. Man, I loved that gun. Reliable, accurate, inexpensive, and easy to field strip. Then the divorce monkey bit my butt, and bye bye. Now I've got a very nice Beretta 92FS Pro Shop and recently got rid of two other 92FS's, but I can't say they are "better" than my old Taurus PT92.

i bought a pt92 back in 1998'ish and i just recently bought a brand new one with the rail. both seem to be identical in quality and build from what i can tell.

 

[AlphaCoyote]

I do enjoy the threads that state categorically that Taurus's are crap because the poster heard of a guy who heard of a guy whose brother in law's sister had a problem. I was just reading a thread here started by blkbear in which he described the cracking of a S&W frame. What conclusions should we draw from that thread about the quality of Smith and Wesson firearms? Answer: None.

 

[jake2far]

Have to way disagree. I would buy a Rock Island 105 times out of 100. When I was looking for another railed 1911 taurus was cheap and available, and I waited. they use cheap parts, cheap finish, cheap quality, cheap everything. If you want a budget 1911 without buying a cheap POS look elsewhere

I have to disagree, I have 3 Rock Island 1911, I have 2 PT 1911, I have 1 Argentine 1911, and an American something 1911, if you think the PT1911 is so bad I will trade you 1 for 1 my Rock Island for your PT 1911. Let me know when and where. 1 Rock Island has brand new night sights. I am serious.
The quality of parts in the Taurus is better than the RI, the warranty is better, and yes I have warrantied both brands, the fit and finish is better in the Taurus, and the Taurus will hands down shoot tighter groups.
SOOOO...... 105 to 100 you would pick RI, tell me when and where I will bring all three RI's and you can pick from the lot, bring 1 2 or 3 PT1911's I will swap you.
[email protected]

Jim
email me and let me know cause I really want to do this.

 

[iamme]

That would mean you think id have a taurus anywhere near my babies

 

[coop44]

In my eyes taurus was always crap, is crap, will always be crap. Too many failures, poor quality control, to make taurus a viable contender for my dollars.

 

[AlphaCoyote]

Your evidence being...

 

[KCB]

I have a PT1911AR that is great, accurate, and reliable. I have put about 500 rnds out of it. It does however have all Wilson Combat internals and the only thing Taurus left on it is the Slide and Frame haha.

 

[MountainBear]

Your evidence being...

If his evidence isn't enough, I would add mine. Having worked at several gunshops, both large and small volume, I can attest to the poor quality of Taurus. On average it seems one taurus was sent in for warranty for every ten to fifteen that were put out for sale. To clarify, that was guns that were shipped broken and were never put out on display. In Taurus's defense, they fixed them all.
If you want a 1911to play with at the range and price is an issue, then consider a Taurus. But be prepared for the very likely instance that you may need to utilize their warranty. That may also prove true of other brands, however, my experience as both a gun salesman and gunsmith indicates to me that Taurus products are generally on the lower end of the quality/quality control scale and break or malfunction more often than most other mainstream brands.

 

[ZA_Survivalist]

To the OP, Taurus makes great firearms.
Especialy the PT1911 and PT92. I've owned quite a few Taurus pistols, none have failed. And I abuse my firearms.

I'd trust my life with a Taurus.

Everyone brand bashing is just internet parroting.

If you'd like, I go shooting up off Salmonberry road quite a bit, bring some ammo and you can handle my PT1911 for yourself.

 

[BAMCIS]

The OP wanted the ugly truth regarding Taurus.

I suggest taking a look at the completed auctions on gunbroker. By completed auctions I mean the ones where there were bids were made and the gun actually sold. Usually when I look at the completed auctions I don't waste my time that had or has a reserve.

Seems to me the price of a Taurus 1911 is half the price of a decent Colt. Is it half the gun? The purchaser has to make that call. Like the OP is trying to do I did my homework and made up my own mind. But when the 1911 bug bit me (and it bit me HARD) I so far have two Colts. The wife has a Colt and a Kimber if that gives any indication.

Doing the research is half the fun of getting a new gun.

Good luck!

 

[MountainBear]

To the OP, Taurus makes great firearms.
Especialy the PT1911 and PT92. I've owned quite a few Taurus pistols, none have failed. And I abuse my firearms.

I'd trust my life with a Taurus.

Everyone brand bashing is just internet parroting.

If you'd like, I go shooting up off Salmonberry road quite a bit, bring some ammo and you can handle my PT1911 for yourself.

I'm glad you're happy with your Taurus, but how is my experience as a gunsmith and gun salesman considered internet parroting? The OP asked for opinions on the quality of the Taurus 1911. I answered his question based on personal experience. So my opinion is just as valid as yours. Just because it differs from yours is not justification for you to imply that I am simply repeating what I read on an internet forum somewhere...

 

[ZA_Survivalist]

I'm glad you're happy with your Taurus, but how is my experience as a gunsmith and gun salesman considered internet parroting? The OP asked for opinions on the quality of the Taurus 1911. I answered his question based on personal experience. So my opinion is just as valid as yours. Just because it differs from yours is not justification for you to imply that I am simply repeating what I read on an internet forum somewhere...

I see so much of it with no real proof. No offence intended, but I cannot take any Firearm salesmans word for it, just as there are folks who bash brands.. same goes for shops.
I've seen nothing but firearm shops bash brands because they get a better deal on something or perhaps prefer something because they make a little extra off the final sale versus the "Cheaper" brands. Sometimes they just mash their opinion into the mix and it just so happens its the higher end brand that they like.

As for gunsmiths.. I've seen some people dawning that title as I have FFLS yet I see them do things that a novice would.. so again, I cannot accept an opinion regardless of ones occupation, though it may be in the firearm field.
So for folks to base an opinion off a gunshops opinion though you've seen some flaws I'd like to see what those flaw might have been.
The OP should have had a bunch of folks post pictures/videos of Taurus lovers pistols as well as all these "Lemons" I keep hearing about.. yet I don't see very many.

All I know is, I've owned many, as have family and friends yet I've never seen any issues other than finish wear.. but if you play hard with your toys like I do.. little to nothing will stand up to my abuse over time. Mechanically, all worked VERY well.

 

[iamme]

I see so much of it with no real proof. No offence intended, but I cannot take any Firearm salesmans word for it, just as there are folks who bash brands.. same goes for shops.
I've seen nothing but firearm shops bash brands because they get a better deal on something or perhaps prefer something because they make a little extra off the final sale versus the "Cheaper" brands. Sometimes they just mash their opinion into the mix and it just so happens its the higher end brand that they like.

As for gunsmiths.. I've seen some people dawning that title as I have FFLS yet I see them do things that a novice would.. so again, I cannot accept an opinion regardless of ones occupation, though it may be in the firearm field.
So for folks to base an opinion off a gunshops opinion though you've seen some flaws I'd like to see what those flaw might have been.
The OP should have had a bunch of folks post pictures/videos of Taurus lovers pistols as well as all these "Lemons" I keep hearing about.. yet I don't see very many.

All I know is, I've owned many, as have family and friends yet I've never seen any issues other than finish wear.. but if you play hard with your toys like I do.. little to nothing will stand up to my abuse over time. Mechanically, all worked VERY well.

Because when I reference what gunsmiths have said it's usually not Joe Schmo in his garage but well known reguarded smiths that if you search you'll find the info. Many of the smith's that build $4K+ custom guns post on easily searchable forums- and well I'd take their input on some of these things.

 

[MountainBear]

I see so much of it with no real proof. No offence intended, but I cannot take any Firearm salesmans word for it, just as there are folks who bash brands.. same goes for shops.
I've seen nothing but firearm shops bash brands because they get a better deal on something or perhaps prefer something because they make a little extra off the final sale versus the "Cheaper" brands. Sometimes they just mash their opinion into the mix and it just so happens its the higher end brand that they like.

As for gunsmiths.. I've seen some people dawning that title as I have FFLS yet I see them do things that a novice would.. so again, I cannot accept an opinion regardless of ones occupation, though it may be in the firearm field.
So for folks to base an opinion off a gunshops opinion though you've seen some flaws I'd like to see what those flaw might have been.
The OP should have had a bunch of folks post pictures/videos of Taurus lovers pistols as well as all these "Lemons" I keep hearing about.. yet I don't see very many.

All I know is, I've owned many, as have family and friends yet I've never seen any issues other than finish wear.. but if you play hard with your toys like I do.. little to nothing will stand up to my abuse over time. Mechanically, all worked VERY well.

Yeah, you're probably right. Those Taurus that were sent back broken right after they arrived at the shop must have been a figment of my imagination. Are they or their issues less real than the Taurus you claim to have owned (I suppose I could question your claim to have owned a number of Taurus because people on the Internet tend to exaggerate)?

I understand your hesitance to believe things, especially on the Internet, that run contrary to your experience. However, most of us have limited experience in the grand scheme of things, so it's possible that some things will differ from your experience. For instance, none of the key locks on my newer production S&W revolvers have ever seized up during recoil. However, it's a known issue. I cannot ignore the possibility of it happening simply because its never happened to me.

As for doubting "gunsmiths". A very valid concern based on the number of tinkerers and armorers who refer to themselves as gunsmiths. Suffice it to say that while I may not currently work as a gunsmith, I did spend two years in school for it and several years working at it. While I am by no means a master gunsmith, and would never refer to myself as such, I do have a working knowledge of guns that surpasses a good deal of gun owners (not all by any means) and have been fortunate to work on a good number of guns and have seen a number of different issues with many guns, including Taurus.

 

[Yamahamottox]

I have 4 Taurus pistols 2 judges one has been sent back to factory twice, on 22 mag revolver at gunsmith right now because rear sight keeps falling off, and a .45 that i have had no problems with. So 2 out of 4 work fine the other two had minor issues that were fixed. I have had 3 kimbers that all needed work to function correctly but that's another story.

 

[strick]

I have no clue as to the quality of the Taurus myself but as I just purchased my first 1911. I figured I would give a different point of view. I was looking at the Taurus 1911, but ended up getting the ruger 1911 due to the fact I found a local shop that had one for only $600, the Taurus was going for about $625. If that deal had not fallen into my lap, I would have had the Taurus sitting in my range bag instead. I know many of the Taurus's other models get some flak, but I have always heard great things about the 1911 they make.

 

[AlphaCoyote]

I understand your hesitance to believe things, especially on the Internet, that run contrary to your experience. However, most of us have limited experience in the grand scheme of things, so it's possible that some things will differ from your experience. For instance, none of the key locks on my newer production S&W revolvers have ever seized up during recoil. However, it's a known issue. I cannot ignore the possibility of it happening simply because its never happened to me.

As for doubting "gunsmiths". A very valid concern based on the number of tinkerers and armorers who refer to themselves as gunsmiths. Suffice it to say that while I may not currently work as a gunsmith, I did spend two years in school for it and several years working at it. While I am by no means a master gunsmith, and would never refer to myself as such, I do have a working knowledge of guns that surpasses a good deal of gun owners (not all by any means) and have been fortunate to work on a good number of guns and have seen a number of different issues with many guns, including Taurus.

First of all, I find MB to be one of the most thoughtful and constructive participants on this board, even when he's wrong. So his views carry weight with me. YMMV.

I've never had one of my Taurus's break, and I like them and trust them. Obviously others have had my experience. But others have also had lemons it seems. Part of this thread establishes that it happens with all kinds of products, including guns of various manufacturers. I appreciate the input of people like MB and Yamaha who have actual experience (as opposed to the internet parrots who seem to be experts about everything without experience about much).

MB: Did you notice a pattern regarding what was going wrong with those Taurus's that had to be sent in for warranty work? Metallurgy? Parts manufacturing? Assembly? Were you seeing the same sorts of issues, or was it just random? Did the warranty work generally solve the problems?

 

[MountainBear]

Most of the Taurus revolvers that were sent back had basic mechanical issues. Some had canted barrels, some had bad cylinder stops that allowed the cylinders to freely rotate (although they seemed to lock when the trigger was pulled). A few of the Judge's we sold came back as the chambers were not cut in all the cylinder holes. The issues with the revolvers followed a fairly regular pattern that could very easily have been corrected by better quality control.
The autoguns were rarely problematic right out of the box and when they were it was mostly due to burrs and aesthetic/finish issues. Mechanically, the autos we saw come back were a good number of firing pin issues and several feeding issues that looked like rough machining marks left on the feed ramps.
I have owned several Taurus firearms. I don't currently, having sold or traded them all away. Mine so far have worked well, however, they've all been range toys, not working guns. I never really ran them hard like my work guns. Ironically, the only gun I ever had stolen was a Taurus snub-nose .17 HM2 revolver. The theif dug to the bottom of my range bag and skipped my S&W 1911, two custom S&W revolvers I had built, and a Ruger Blackhawk .45LC. I guess he was a Taurus fan. I laugh now as I got the gun back a few years later and promptly traded it away...
And I repeat my comment from an earlier thread, Taurus took care of almost very gun or issue I ever sent to them. Still waiting for some trigger parts I ordered for a customers gun five years ago. Found out the hard way that the hammer and trigger pins were not pressed into the frame like a S&W. Got the pleasure of machining a new part after I blew one of the pins into the space between spaces where lost parts end up...

 

[jake2far]

In my eyes taurus was always crap, is crap, will always be crap. Too many failures, poor quality control, to make taurus a viable contender for my dollars.

"The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance -- it is the illusion of knowledge."

Perhaps you should set aside your illusion of knowledge, Taurus is the third largest manufacturer of small weapons in the world. They were owned by Bangor Punta which also gave them sharing of design and info with Smith and Wesson, and Taurus purchased the manufacturing plant from Beretta.
Perhaps doing some research would help, try this for a starter:
Taurus International Manufacturing Inc - History

I have to disagree, I have 3 Rock Island 1911, I have 2 PT 1911, I have 1 Argentine 1911, and an American something 1911, if you think the PT1911 is so bad I will trade you 1 for 1 my Rock Island for your PT 1911. Let me know when and where. 1 Rock Island has brand new night sights. I am serious.
The quality of parts in the Taurus is better than the RI, the warranty is better, and yes I have warrantied both brands, the fit and finish is better in the Taurus, and the Taurus will hands down shoot tighter groups.
SOOOO...... 105 to 100 you would pick RI, tell me when and where I will bring all three RI's and you can pick from the lot, bring 1 2 or 3 PT1911's I will swap you.
[email protected]

Jim
email me and let me know cause I really want to do this.

This offer has been up for awhile, it is a valid offer for those who dislike the Taurus PT 1911, I wonder why no one has taken me up on it or even commented. OFFER STILL STANDS, put your money (or in this case pistol) where your mouth is.

If I was buying another 1911 I would stick with the American made ones, Remington, Colt, Wilson Springfield, S&W, ect. Thats just me though

Back to the Illusion of knowledge, using bigotry as an excuse, and for those who don't know here is the definition:

big·ot·ry
 

noun, plural big·ot·ries.
1.
stubborn and complete intolerance of any creed, belief, or opinion that differs from one's own.

Taurus makes weapons on par with any other mass produced weapons, some models are lower in quality and others are higher in quality, the same as all other manufacturers.
The bigotted comment about made in America is a complete falsehood, as the vaunted Springfield is not made in America.
Smith and Wesson, made in America, try this:
The Dark Side of Smith & Wesson
Taurus is good to go. If you don't like them that is your opinion, being the 3rd largest manufacturer in the world, they got there because they build a good product, offer an excellent life time warranty, if they didn't the company would fail. The facts out strip your Illusions.


Jim