So I walk into a gun shop Saturday...

[edison bulb]

And profiling and commenting on it is his 1st Admendment right just as it is your right to say he is profiling. So what is the problem ??

Odd logic, Coast. Profiling doesn't do 2A supporters any favors. Remember, we're being profiled by the anti-gunners and the unsure voters. I'd imagine that as 2A supporters, we'd like to foster a more inclusive image of firearm ownership. This means welcoming minorities (black, Asian, Muslim, LGBTQ, etc), who are otherwise legal to buy firearms, to enjoy them without prejudice.

 

[CoastRange57]

Odd logic, Coast. Profiling doesn't do 2A supporters any favors. Remember, we're being profiled by the anti-gunners and the unsure voters. I'd imagine that as 2A supporters, we'd like to foster a more inclusive image of firearm ownership. This means welcoming minorities (black, Asian, Muslim, LGBTQ, etc), who are otherwise legal to buy firearms, to enjoy them without prejudice.

Why is that odd logic ?? To you it might be and that is your opinion and right.

The man has a right to speak his mind, you have a right to speak your mind, I have a right to speak my mind. We might not agree with each other, as this is obvious. I am pretty much suspicious of everybody until I have accurate gauge of their moral compass. I do not give a damn if they are black, white, Muslim Christian, Jew or Asian. My 3 boys served in the Marine Corps, and my house has been a crash pad at times for many young men of various races and religions. Fire arm ownership also does not mean jack shot about your moral compass.

I do not hold that my opinion is so right that I can tell the person who disagree's with it that they are wrong and say that their position is bullshot. This all comes down to how you choose to disagree. To tell me my position is wrong, or to label his comments as prejudice is imposing your views on some one else who may not care to be labeled that way.

 

[Member 5605]

I guess making an observation means you are judging, judging means you are racist, being racist means you are anti-freedoms and believe that people should be targeted based on the color of their skin or the language they speak.

This has gotten so far off from my original intent. I'm glad there are others who pay attention to social cues and can say that sometimes something just seems odd and will call it out as such without saying that the person needs to be crucified.

 

[The B]

This has gotten so far off from my original intent.

Perhaps you can clarify what, exactly, your original intent was, then?

 

[The B]

Exactly. It is just a case of somebody expressing their opinion. He expressed an opinion, and then the other person opened their yap hole and with the negative ( no) and said you are profiling. By your labeling it BS, that is your opinion. The use of the negative in the first word of the sentence, says " I am saying your are wrong, this is what you actually are doing. "

So when that person decided to take the contrary position and verbally tell the other person he was wrong and as you say call BS on it....that was his opinion expressed and it invited a response. This is just how disagreements start with the back and forth with each person supporting their position.

I prefer to take the position that if a person makes a statement that is their right too, and I do not agree with that statement or position, I would respect that position and not tell him, '"No, you are profiling. "

I try to respect other peoples positions, and I do not feel inclined to say you are wrong and put my own label on what you are doing, or call BS on it.

Generally if somebody tells me I am wrong and doing something and wants to put their own label on it, I would end the conversation with a GFY and walk away.

So you're saying we shouldn't debate?

What the hell are we here for, then? You think we're just here to throw flowers and preach to the choir? This is internetting, dude. Debate is entertaining, and sometimes even enlightening. It's important to have your positions examined by your opposition, and ripped apart- for two reasons: 1, so you can produce stronger arguments in the future; 2, to reveal to you your own BS positions... everyone holds some.

 

[The B]

will you be safe it there is someone with a bat that want to bash your head in and you have a gun?

Uh, sure... but will he?

Guns are equalizers. If the man wants to be on even ground with me, he'll bring a gun, not a bat.

 

[The B]

So you're saying we shouldn't debate?

What the hell are we here for, then? You think we're just here to throw flowers and preach to the choir? This is internetting, dude. Debate is entertaining, and sometimes even enlightening. It's important to have your positions examined by your opposition, and ripped apart- for two reasons: 1, so you can produce stronger arguments in the future; 2, to reveal to you your own BS positions... everyone holds some.

I hate the be the guy that posts 4 times in a row, but as I was sitting here chewing a Tootsie Roll after a nice long socially menacing, non-tax-contributing bike ride... I really think the lack of the above is the reason you guys freak out so bad any time anyone challenges your cookie-cutter opinions on here. We're all on the same team- I'm a 100% pro-liberty, pro-gun, pro-God 2nd Amendment kind of guy, but because I think racism is a bad thing, ride a bike, and recognize the corporation as the single evilest thing to happen to capitalism, I'm a pinko commie bastard libtard seditionist traitor not worthy of your presence, and should definitely be banned, probably shot by firing squad.

And certainly "ignored."

 

[Member 5605]

How is profiling the same as racism?

I don't understand....

My heritage is Irish, Swedish, Cherokee, and a few others.

Racism:
the belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races.

Profiling:
the recording and analysis of a person's psychological and behavioral characteristics, so as to assess or predict their capabilities in a certain sphere or to assist in identifying a particular subgroup of people.

Not equal.

You and I agree on quite a few things. Pro America, 2nd A, freedoms, Yaweh and even bicycles.

 

[Mongo1]

This has been an interesting read. I'm surprised that one of the moderators didn't lock it down. Things are improving in regards to moderators over reacting and locking a thread just because of spirited discussion. I will consider becoming a supporting member.

 

[The B]

Racism:
the belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races.

Profiling:
the recording and analysis of a person's psychological and behavioral characteristics, so as to assess or predict their capabilities in a certain sphere or to assist in identifying a particular subgroup of people.

Firstly, I didn't accuse you of racism. I accused you of profiling, based on race/ethnic/nationality. (wouldn't be a big step to go racial with that, but I didn't, for the record)

BUT, even if I'm agreeing with your definitions above - what you did was not your definition for profiling- you don't know crap about those dudes' psychological and behavioral characteristics - all you know is they had darker skin and talked funny.

So again... since we missed your point.... what was it?

 

[CoastRange57]

I really think the lack of the above is the reason you guys freak out so bad any time anyone challenges your cookie-cutter opinions on here.

I do not think anybody is freaking out over a challenged opinion. People can disagree, but when one side starts the debate with a " You are wrong" statement, that pretty much sets the tone for how it is going to go. The chance of you changing my opinion about anything is pretty slim, and I have the same expectation of you. We can debate it all day long, but I have a lot of other things I would rather do than beat some fing dead horse.

but because I think racism is a bad thing, ride a bike, and recognize the corporation as the single evilest thing to happen to capitalism, I'm a pinko commie bastard libtard seditionist traitor not worthy of your presence, and should definitely be banned, probably shot by firing squad.

You are putting words in nobody's mouth. I do not see in the thread anywhere where anybody called you or anybody else out in those terms, they are completely of your own writing and fabrication and perception. I see you in none of those terms, but rather a passionate patriot who is willing to defend your position, in your own way.

 

[CoastRange57]

This has been an interesting read. I'm surprised that one of the moderators didn't lock it down. Things are improving in regards to moderators over reacting and locking a thread just because of spirited discussion. I will consider becoming a supporting member.

Agreed. This is nothing. I could link you up with a flame board where all we do is insult each other in profane ways, and call each other names and argue positions, and have for the last 12 years.

 

[albin25]

Maybe this is why we argue... a passion for guns bringing together divergent people with as few as ONE shared trait....

We are all..........................(yikes!!)..........

Ammosexuals
A term for someone who feels affection for firearms. Often an attraction to the beauty and design of the gun, but can also refer to love for the history, freedom, security, or tactile feel of the gun. Also typified by those who feel joy in being able to find and acquire ammunition to feed their firearms, especially at an affordable price.
Ammosexuals, like many alternative lifestyle groups, have been ruthlessly attacked by hate-filled bigots who desire the eradication of individual liberty and equality, in favor of either violent mobs, might-makes-right, or tyrant kings.
Fearing violence and protests, most ammosexuals are forced to hide their firearm affection from vocal and violent prejudice. Ammosexuals are frequently the target of anti-freedom laws and politicians, and are currently denied many freedoms granted to other minority groups in most nations.
(from, Urban Dictionary)

"This is my very favorite rifle. I call her Vera."
(Jane Cobb, from Firefly)



To tie this into the OP....
Benefit of the doubt leads me to believe that he was expressing his concern for a vendor not being aware of proper sales requirements to non-citizen/legal resident alien buyers in these confusing post I594 times. I'm sure he would have been just as concerned and probably more vocal to the vendor if he knew the buyer was from Idaho (saw his plates) but overheard him say he was from Washington State. Seems like he may have held back because he was afraid of causing offense due to skin color or accent/language.

I have no more reason to judge him a racist profiler than I do to judge some responders as reactionary jackwagons.

 

[U201491]

Going Blind................4 in a row ?????????????

 

[U201491]

Every good immigrant deserves the same rights we all have, but that does not mean that illegals , or those with ill intent deserve even one of those rights because they do not.

Scrutinizing people that look like a duck, act like a duck and they even could be a duck is not unwarranted.

I didn't hear that they did anything about it other than discuss the fact here.
That is a right also, at least discussing , talking, and all that is a right and they don't deserve to be called out for that same right that you seem to say you believe in there .

See it does not have to fall under your terms of how it is said there BenB.

That is an ill attempt at control. That is what liberals do. Push PC nonsense. Free speech is not PC , it is free.
People need to get some hide on them. PC is what is wrong with this country.

.

 

[Member 5605]

Close, I've spent my entire life as one who sits on the outskirts and watches social behaviors, interactions on how people react and act in situations. I'm an introvert. I could give the exact name but it wouldn't be relevant in this conversation.

BB:
Your assumption that my profiling was solely based on skin color and language spoken is mistaken.

I'm always observing. Social structure, reactions, how people carry themselves and even down to inflections of their voice.

So if I saw somebody in public (let's use a gun shop again so it's equal), and they were white, blonde (or shaved head), blue eyed like myself and speaking German and perfect unaccented English I wouldn't be concerned. But if they turned to each other spoke German while looking at a man of color (albeit Hispanic, Asian, African etc), and had mannerisms of their actions that lead me to believe they were neo nazis I would have said something as well.

Same goes for a Timothy McVay mother lover type. You come in dressed in fatigues talking to your buddies about stuff in code I'll get suspicious as well.

Melanin doesn't matter to me. Neither does language.

But in the original post we have home grown terrorists that can spring up anywhere. Doesn't matter if they are of German, Asian, middle eastern, or Russian descent.

Being alert is important and it's the most important thing we can do to survive. Driving or walking. Know our surroundings.

Remember this was an observation that was made that I found interesting.

With that I'm done.
I could care less if this thread is locked. It's ran its course and went sideways.

I wouldn't mind taking you out shooting Sometime if you are ever in this area. I promise I won't go jihad (or scalp you).

 

[U201491]

Close, I've spent my entire life as one who sits on the outskirts and watches social behaviors, interactions on how people react and act in situations. I'm an introvert. I could give the exact name but it wouldn't be relevant in this conversation.

BB:
Your assumption that my profiling was solely based on skin color and language spoken is mistaken.

I'm always observing. Social structure, reactions, how people carry themselves and even down to inflections of their voice.

So if I saw somebody in public (let's use a gun shop again so it's equal), and they were white, blonde (or shaved head), blue eyed like myself and speaking German and perfect unaccented English I wouldn't be concerned. But if they turned to each other spoke German while looking at a man of color (albeit Hispanic, Asian, African etc), and had mannerisms of their actions that lead me to believe they were neo nazis I would have said something as well.

Same goes for a Timothy McVay mother lover type. You come in dressed in fatigues talking to your buddies about stuff in code I'll get suspicious as well.

Melanin doesn't matter to me. Neither does language.

But in the original post we have home grown terrorists that can spring up anywhere. Doesn't matter if they are of German, Asian, middle eastern, or Russian descent.

Being alert is important and it's the most important thing we can do to survive. Driving or walking. Know our surroundings.

Remember this was an observation that was made that I found interesting.

With that I'm done.
I could care less if this thread is locked. It's ran its course and went sideways.

I wouldn't mind taking you out shooting Sometime if you are ever in this area. I promise I won't go jihad (or scalp you).

Right on track. The PC police all need to just GFT and get over it.

Profiling is probably the most effective tool that exists fore fighting crime.
And also for fighting terrorism.
That is why the corrupt left doesn't like it.

PC began with the Socialist/Marxist/communist push in America in the late
60's and ramped up right along with the rest of the bullpucky.

.

 

[CoastRange57]

I'm always observing. Social structure, reactions, how people carry themselves and even down to inflections of their voice.


Being alert is important and it's the most important thing we can do to survive. Driving or walking. Know our surroundings.

Exactly. This is how I live. I study this all the time. I can tell you what people are going to do before they do it. 2 plus hours a day of watching people in retail stores on monitors gives you a great education, and the things you learn when you confront criminals are important as well.

This makes you observant and aware, not profiling.

 

[oli700]

I just think it's funny wearing camouflage pants is part of the alarming description of your encounter with a wouldbe terrorist, glad you made it out alive

 

[NoFlinch]

Some may remember my post about the ISIS DRESSED guy I ran into at the Grants Pass Fred Meyer.

YOU BET I PROFILED HIM!

I followed him and observed him until I was satisfied that he posed no threat to ME or others.

I profile EVERYONE.

Some more than others.........