Washington Ruby Ridge lite

[No_Regerts]

Why did they come back next day, when there was no immediate threat to anyone? Apparently man had a bad day but did not threaten anyone and he was on his own property. Did he tell that "God Almighty" deputy to GTFO his property? What's the problem? And that's why the whole army of trigger happy arrived another day - to create and escalate the crisis and to retaliate?

The "whole army" is why police line-of-duty deaths in the US are so few. Its also why one million comissioned LEOs nationwide only kill 900 to 1100 people every year based on over a billion hours of policing.

 

[bbbass]

"Joe Blow, this is the BFE PD!

Should be the BFD PD!

 

[bbbass]

Surevaliance is not the quickest FNG to make it to my ignore list, but he's in the top ten!

 

[surevaliance]

Welfare check becomes assault with a deadly weapon, turns into PC statement to get a warrant that has to be signed by a judge, safety planning and logistics have to be complete, thats how.

If LE is looking for PC - it will be found.

 

[No_Regerts]

If LE is looking for PC - it will be found.

Where I work, we have to have our T's crossed and i's dotted pretty well if we want to make an entry on a home. Guy pointing gun at me would be one of the easier ones.

 

[albin25]

You mean you can't answer the door at night, armed?....
....not enough "Jimmy's" out there, I guess.

 

[bbbass]

You mean you can't answer the door at night, armed?....
....not enough "Jimmy's" out there, I guess.

That would be dependent on how it is done... Before I installed peeps in the doors, if I had to open the door to see who is there (not gonna happen at midnight, we can yell at each other until it gets sorted out. Might be a drunk, it's happened), anyway if I opened the door at night during reasonable hours, I had a handgun behind the door out of sight. And another in a cabinet nearby, and a shotgun leaning against the corner. It's just rude to open the door with a gun pointed at somebody when you don't know who it is... that's an automatic DQ for violation of one of the 4 cardinal safety rules.

Then there's this report of what happened... waving a weapon (brandishing, reckless endangerment), and refusing to follow legal commands of a law enforcement officer/deputy (failure to comply)... This is how "Jimmy"s get killed. Don't call for a welfare check if you know your badazz husband/relative is drinking, unbalanced, or otherwise in a bad mood/place.

So the deputy files a report/complaint, the prosecutor decides to take it to a judge, and an arrest warrant is issued. Since the perp has already shown violent, aggressive behavior to law enforcement, the arrest team also has a SWAT unit for their own protection... standard stuff as far as I know.

"When the deputy exited the vehicle, Johnson came out of the cabin waiving a pistol "and yelled for the deputy to get off his property," according to the lawsuit. When the deputy told Johnson to drop his weapon, Johnson "turned around and walked into the house."

 

[surevaliance]

You mean you can't answer the door at night, armed?....
....not enough "Jimmy's" out there, I guess.

Smart cop.

 

[DuneHopper]

Hmmmm something, doesn't round right, looks like a nice spin.
The response with a sniper for a warrant, of what would have been at the most bradishing a firearm
make no sense. Something is not being said I think.

 

[mkwerx]

They need to release body & dash cam footage of the initial encounter and the warrant service.

 

[No_Regerts]

Hmmmm something, doesn't round right, looks like a nice spin.
The response with a sniper for a warrant, of what would have been at the most bradishing a firearm
make no sense. Something is not being said I think.

"Sniper" is the word the ignorant often describe anyone with a rifle and optic.

 

[slimmer13]

Having no opinion, because of lack of information, is a perfectly reasonable position. Those who jump to the "dirty shoot" side, with that same lack of information interest me. It makes me wonder what ingrained bias against police they have to not only think the initial responding deputy is lying, but at least 5 others the following day.

 

[bbbass]

Hmmmm something, doesn't round right, looks like a nice spin.
The response with a sniper for a warrant, of what would have been at the most bradishing a firearm
make no sense. Something is not being said I think.

I would agree under normal circumstances, but IMO it's not simple brandishing when you wave a gun around, and possibly at, a LEO. Then oOrder him off your property, refuse to drop the weapon, and the stalk back to the house. If that's how it went down, every department that has a SWAT team and an armored vehicle is going to deploy those resources for their own protection when serving the warrant.

It seems to be common to have a long rifle shooter in the turret. Maybe it's a good thing he was there because this guy came blasting out the rear of the cabin pointing a handgun at law enforcement personnel. How could the long rifle gunner not take the shot under those circumstances.

We just had officers killed while on duty in two different states... and we're wondering why a heavy response to an aggressive actor is taken.

If that's how it went down... we need an official word on this, but it's an old case. 2017. I wonder what was released at the time.

 

[Mooseman]

I have a sign at My driveway "Trespassers will be shot, survivors will be shot again" and everyone including the local Sheriff knows to come in at night with headlights on and blow the horn when you get to the house if its night time or you will be met with an armed homeowner. They respect that down here ! I see someone sneaking around on Night vision Cameras there may be a big problem when I start taking em out with My AR-15 with a starlight scope because they have been warned ! Due to ammo costs we no longer waste warning shots !!!

 

[slimmer13]

I have a sign at My driveway "Trespassers will be shot, survivors will be shot again" and everyone including the local Sheriff knows to come in at night with headlights on and blow the horn when you get to the house if its night time or you will be met with an armed homeowner. They respect that down here ! I see someone sneaking around on Night vision Cameras there may be a big problem when I start taking em out with My AR-15 with a starlight scope because they have been warned ! Due to ammo costs we no longer waste warning shots !!!

Aaaand since someone "sneaking around" on your property, isn't enough to use deadly force in any state, you'd go to jail.

 

[Mooseman]

If they are armed and trespassing then its too bad for them...No jury here would convict you.

 

[notazombie]

Having no opinion, because of lack of information, is a perfectly reasonable position. Those who jump to the "dirty shoot" side, with that same lack of information interest me. It makes me wonder what ingrained bias against police they have to not only think the initial responding deputy is lying, but at least 5 others the following day.

I made my "looks like a dirty shoot" comment based on the article linked in the very first post.
"He came to the door armed not knowing who was there. As a result of the welfare check, nothing happened. The officer left and then did proceed to get an arrest warrant because Mr. Johnson answered the door with a firearm," Linscott said...

I don't automatically think all cops are bad...but I've met a couple. I'd have just as much issue with someone who automatically thought all cops are infallible angels. Just like any pool of people in a given profession, there are bad apples and bad days.

I wish they'd release some actual evidence instead of just some limited testimony. This is just a bubblegumty deal all around.

 

[clearconscience]

I wouldn't put blame ( at least based off from the very limited info) on the sway team.
I would put it on th initial deputy who did the welfare check.
And from the article the victim didn't have a warrant, the deputy issued the arrest warrant after the inital welfare check.

But the two peices of info needed to make an intelligent armchair quarterback assessment are:
Why did his wife ask for the welfare check?
And what took place during the welfare check intially?

Maybe the wife said he was suicidal?
Maybe during the initial check he told the deputy he wanted to kill cops, and got out by suicide by cop,
Maybe he exited the house through the back door to circle the house and shoot cops?

There just isn't any factual information to justify this being a unlawful or lawful death.

Any one could make a decision for both sides based off from the very limited information given.

 

[surevaliance]

Aaaand since someone "sneaking around" on your property, isn't enough to use deadly force in any state, you'd go to jail.

It depends on how quick you can hide the body.

 

[Mooseman]

It depends on how quick you can hide the body.

depends on how Hungry my Wolf is....