Is anyone else having buyers who are trying to go around the transfer laws?

[Keane]

I've said the same thing repeatedly, I'm not the paranoid conspiracy theory type but I mean why wouldn't they be here?

I recently had a cheap pistol for sale here and had a lot of PM response, 6 different people said they would take it in PM's and after I asked them if they were Oregon residents, over 21 and could legally own/purchase a firearm in the state of Oregon I never heard from any of these guys again, 6 different people? All were under 10 posts and new here so seller beware.

I'm not a paranoid conspiracy guy either, I know for a fact Definitely beware everyone.

 

[Trlsmn]

now that you mention it, it seems like i've had more than a few of these less obvious probes as well... a guy in WA who claimed he didn't need an FFL for a rifle receiver transfer (i'm still not straight on the law on that, despite so many people claiming FFLs are needed for ALL interstate firearm transfers- either way, my personal policy is to not do it), but backed out when i, surprise surprise, insisted on FFL. and i've had a number of "i'll take it's" for a revolver i have listed here, none of which have panned out.

maybe there really IS a lot of that kind of bullbubblegum going on. watch your p's and q's, gentlemen... a simplem purely innocent slip can get you into a world of trouble.

The way I look at it is 10 years prison for what? so you can sell a gun a few days sooner? That's what I call a bad investment. People don't make much sense to me sometimes.

One thing I have been insisting on is a agreement in PM that they are legally allowed to own/purchase a gun. I hadn't thought of it from the Fed standpoint but if a it was a Fed and you asked if they meet the requirements to purchase a gun and it was a setup it would be entrapment.

The way Feds did the sting in the Washington gun shows is they had a nark that was un-qualified to own a weapon approach people and then bust the people. If you ask the person if they are not qualified and they lie you will have a written record that can be used as defense against this sort of thing.

 

[Cougfan2]

I think the FOID suggestion was just to verify who this jerk is and that he really could buy it legally from his "FFL buddy". But you are not going to send the gun anyway, so..

I agree you should try to mess this guy up before he gets some unwitting gun seller in a lot of trouble

Yes, that was why I posted it.

 

[Trlsmn]

Yes, that was why I posted it.

What is this FOID you speak of? I've been told to FOAD but never FOID

 

[techieguy]

What is this FOID you speak of? I've been told to FOAD but never FOID

The Illinois State Police provides Firearm Owner's Identification Cards.

 

[Blitzkrieg]

The way I look at it is 10 years prison for what? so you can sell a gun a few days sooner? That's what I call a bad investment. People don't make much sense to me sometimes.

One thing I have been insisting on is a agreement in PM that they are legally allowed to own/purchase a gun. I hadn't thought of it from the Fed standpoint but if a it was a Fed and you asked if they meet the requirements to purchase a gun and it was a setup it would be entrapment.

The way Feds did the sting in the Washington gun shows is they had a nark that was un-qualified to own a weapon approach people and then bust the people. If you ask the person if they are not qualified and they lie you will have a written record that can be used as defense against this sort of thing.

A video of them saying it would be helpful. Otherwise it's just your word against theirs.. personally I will never sell a firearm unless it's FTF, and they have a current WA State CPL and Dr Lisc

 

[billdeserthills]

Federal law says that I can only ship across state lines to a dealer, shipping to a FOID holder would not meet this requirement.

I started this thread with 2 purposes in mind.

1. To help educate firearm sellers that it is their responsibility that the laws are followed. The only way to ensure that you are shipping to a dealer is if you have a copy of their FFL so that you can verify their name, address, and license.

2. For my curiosity, is there an organized effort to accumulate firearms that are only traceable to the original purchaser?

Here in Arizona this attempt is made often, from what I hear. People are always interested in getting ahold of guns from private parties, rather than have the gun show up on a form 7743

 

[Cougfan2]

What is this FOID you speak of? I've been told to FOAD but never FOID

Damn. That made me almost spit up on my keyboard!
As another post stated there is a Firearms Owner Identification Card required by the Illinois Socialist Republic for you to exercise your constitutional right to own a firearm. Gotta love them in Illinois!

 

[A.I.P.]

These are O'Blamma's minions, he is on an anti-gun kick to lure back his Commie boot lickers. Illinois is the give away as to thier intent. The entire state is controled by CORRUPT politicians and thier DIRTY COP cohorts. This is how Bill Ayers and V. Dohrn got away with murder (trial in Ill.) it's also why they still live there, safe from deportation to states that can still try them for murder.
Cops Judges, Pollys all commie and for sale in ILL.

 

[RallySoob]

These are O'Blamma's minions, he is on an anti-gun kick to lure back his Commie boot lickers. Illinois is the give away as to thier intent. The entire state is controled by CORRUPT politicians and thier DIRTY COP cohorts. This is how Bill Ayers and V. Dohrn got away with murder (trial in Ill.) it's also why they still live there, safe from deportation to states that can still try them for murder.
Cops Judges, Pollys all commie and for sale in ILL.

I'm voting for this as most plausible. I've never heard of these type of stories until recently. I used to do a lot of dealing on arfcom and nothing like this ever came up...so it makes me think. Why all the sudden?

 

[Keane]

I'm voting for this as most plausible. I've never heard of these type of stories until recently. I used to do a lot of dealing on arfcom and nothing like this ever came up...so it makes me think. Why all the sudden?

I'm voting it the biggest Wargarbl of the thread. This stuff has been going on for years both on here and off. The reason you are seeing it all of a sudden is a- people are reporting it, b- the site is getting much more attention from viewers as well.

 

[8ball]

These are O'Blamma's minions, he is on an anti-gun kick to lure back his Commie boot lickers. Illinois is the give away as to thier intent. The entire state is controled by CORRUPT politicians and thier DIRTY COP cohorts.

LOL. Never ascribe to malice that which can be ascribed to incompetence. There are plenty of idiots that want guns that are incompetent and/or budding criminals. Although it *could* be an ATF sting, my money is on the idiot/crook angle.

 

[Barefoot343]

yes.. i have, in fact, recently had several people from BAN STATES want me to circumvent federal or state laws. i had a guy from IL who offered me more than my asking price to ship a rifle to his home address- are you freaken kidding me? but he didn't make any threats when i told him to pound sand. i had a guy from NYC want me to send him a complete NFA upper loaded with evil features.. and the last one was a guy who wanted to pay extra shipping for me to split a rifle in two, sending the lower to his FFL and the non-compliant upper to his cali address.

these states DO attempt to entrap out-of-state sellers by getting them to violate their states' laws. NY is notorious for this. do not do business with people in anti-gun states- it's just not worth the risk. you have no idea what's illegal and what's not- but you DO know that MOST things are illegal.

I'm curious if the ATF can work a sting the opposite way and pose as the seller and catch buyers who are not following the rules. Does the weight of the rules and regs only fall on the shoulders of the seller? or... can the buyer be busted?

 

[coop44]

I seem to see people in a neighboring state wanting to "come up (or down) and get it" in this forum quite often. Morons. I think they may just not care to abide by the rules. I have had folks at gun shows try to buy from me with no identification ,or, out of state Identification, they seem to think this is all done on a "wink and a nod". The funny part is they will try and convince me that doing so is perfectly legal.

 

[Sasquatchvnv]

I'm thinkin' that regardless of what is behind it, it is easy enough to steer clear of transactions of this sort. Just say no - avoid the bright orange jumpsuit. Threats? Come on.

 

[The B]

I'm curious if the ATF can work a sting the opposite way and pose as the seller and catch buyers who are not following the rules. Does the weight of the rules and regs only fall on the shoulders of the seller? or... can the buyer be busted?

buyers can definitely be busted. if either person breaks the law, they're liable. if, for instance, the ATF caught wind of one of these illegal transactions and could get on it, both buyer and seller, if both knew, or even "should have known," something illegal was happening, would be prosecuted.

 

[billdeserthills]

I'm curious if the ATF can work a sting the opposite way and pose as the seller and catch buyers who are not following the rules. Does the weight of the rules and regs only fall on the shoulders of the seller? or... can the buyer be busted?

The Rules only fall upon the seller, unless the buyer is not allowed to have a gun.

 

[billdeserthills]

buyers can definitely be busted. if either person breaks the law, they're liable. if, for instance, the ATF caught wind of one of these illegal transactions and could get on it, both buyer and seller, if both knew, or even "should have known," something illegal was happening, would be prosecuted.

So glad to hear that, I can't wait for Bloomberg to be arrested for his "Sting Operations"

 

[The B]

So glad to hear that, I can't wait for Bloomberg to be arrested for his "Sting Operations"

no kidding. the hypocrisy of his abuse of investigative exemption does not escape us.

 

[billdeserthills]

At every gun show I do I wind up talking with several people (or more) who are not legal residents but want to buy guns. Since I am an FFL, there is no possibility of my transferring a gun to an out of state buyer, but I have been wondering lately about the legality of my slapping a pair of cuffs on the next guy who attempts to commit a felony by asking?