Illegal to carry on school property?

[CHLChris]

I'm a public school teacher. I'm a CHL holder. I know the answer to this question and most of you are missing the relevant issues. @mkwerx had it as close as anybody.

1) CHL holders can legally carry concealed into any public school. They can be a parent or an employee.

2) According to the OR State Supreme Court case Doe v. Medford School District, any school district can make employment rules dictating that a no-guns policy during work hours is legal.

3) Every district in Oregon has such a no-guns work rule. Employees cannot carry during work duties. Get caught, get fired.

4) There will be NO legal repercussions for getting caught, just loss of employment.

When I go to school as a parent, I carry because I love my life. When I go to school as a teacher, I don't...because I love my job. Unfortunately i am forced to choose between my job and my life!

 

[B3dlam]

I'm a public school teacher. I'm a CHL holder. I know the answer to this question and most of you are missing the relevant issues. @mkwerx had it as close as anybody.

1) CHL holders can legally carry concealed into any public school. They can be a parent or an employee.

2) According to the OR State Supreme Court case Doe v. Medford School District, any school district can make employment rules dictating that a no-guns policy during work hours is legal.

3) Every district in Oregon has such a no-guns work rule. Employees cannot carry during work duties. Get caught, get fired.

4) There will be NO legal repercussions for getting caught, just loss of employment.

When I go to school as a parent, I carry because I love my life. When I go to school as a teacher, I don't...because I love my job. Unfortunately i am forced to choose between my job and my life!

Yup Oregon is a right to hire right to fire state which means your employer can pretty much terminator you for any violation of their own policies as I understand it.

As for carrying on public schools as it was explained to me you can legally carry there however if an employee of the school notices you are carrying and asks you to leave they are within their rights to do so if you leave when asked you are in the clear however if you choose to argue or refuse to leave you are trespassing with a firearm.

Just how I understand it I am not a lawyer and I didnt stay at a holiday in express.

 

[01rednavigator]

I'm a public school teacher. I'm a CHL holder. I know the answer to this question and most of you are missing the relevant issues. @mkwerx had it as close as anybody.

1) CHL holders can legally carry concealed into any public school. They can be a parent or an employee.

2) According to the OR State Supreme Court case Doe v. Medford School District, any school district can make employment rules dictating that a no-guns policy during work hours is legal.

3) Every district in Oregon has such a no-guns work rule. Employees cannot carry during work duties. Get caught, get fired.

4) There will be NO legal repercussions for getting caught, just loss of employment.

When I go to school as a parent, I carry because I love my life. When I go to school as a teacher, I don't...because I love my job. Unfortunately i am forced to choose between my job and my life!

Very well said, teachers with CHL'S should be allowed to carry though. It could end up saving many lives!

 

[Defense Minister]

This should clear things up.

Pay attention to 166.360(9), 166.370(1), and 166.370(3)(g).

It is illegal to carry a gun on school property, but there is an exception for CHL holders for both public and private schools. As stated earlier, this does not prevent government employers from stripping employees of their Constitutional rights in the name of limiting their liability, the justification given by the Oregon appeals court in the case Shirley Katz vs. the Medford (Oregon) School District (2009). These unconstitutional employment policies aren't exclusive to school districts, either; state and local governments do the same thing...

 

[01rednavigator]

Technically with a CHL you could open carry on public school property and they really couldn't do anything about it. I would never do it or suggest it but you could.

 

[mkwerx]

Yup Oregon is a right to hire right to fire state which means your employer can pretty much terminator you for any violation of their own policies as I understand it.

As for carrying on public schools as it was explained to me you can legally carry there however if an employee of the school notices you are carrying and asks you to leave they are within their rights to do so if you leave when asked you are in the clear however if you choose to argue or refuse to leave you are trespassing with a firearm.

Just how I understand it I am not a lawyer and I didnt stay at a holiday in express.

If you have a permit and legitimate business they can't boot you for being armed. Its a public facility after all. Not that it would not stop them frim trying but state law allows carry on school grounds with a CHL, and does not grant said school the right to boot you. If you have legitimate reason for being there it is NO different than if you are at a public library, in a public park, or paying your light bill at the PUC office. It could be a very expensive lesson for the schools. I doubt they train employees very well on that law yet. Also shocked the teachers union has not fought much to change the law and nix schools from the list of places one can carry. Not that I want them to.

I have a first grader. Have to walk him to school and pick him up daily. Always armed. Only time I am at school is for conferences, or pick / drop.

Frankly I think the activist judges that allowed public agencies to force you into giving up your right to carry as an employment condition is as wrong as ball cancer. I wish a group lime SAF or GOA would have gone to bat and fought that ruling. I knew a teacher in high school that carried. He kind of let it slip once in a tongue in cheek moment. Suspect one other of having a gun if not on body then in his brief case or in his truck but don't know for sure. He was a master of deflection when it came to answering questions he did not like.

 

[01rednavigator]

I drop off and pickup my Niece from a Salem Keizer Public School atleast three times or more per week. I also volunteer when I can and I always have a gun on me!

In my opinion schools are the most vulnerable place and I will not risk the life of my niece or other children to cower down to make others feel better.

I try to conceal my firearm the best I can but I don't go out of my way to make certain that it is not visible, if someone has a problem they can come talk to me.

 

[CHLChris]

As for carrying on public schools as it was explained to me you can legally carry there however if an employee of the school notices you are carrying and asks you to leave they are within their rights to do so if you leave when asked you are in the clear however if you choose to argue or refuse to leave you are trespassing with a firearm.

There is some fail in this statement. There are no such distinctions for public buildings. What you are describing concerning "trespass" is with private businesses, in which even a legal CHL carrier, if carrying into a private business posting NO GUNS, can ask you to leave (if they make you as carrying a gun)... trespass if you don't leave.

In a public building there is no such thing as trespass laws, even if you're "made." There are just the other bevy of laws around making threats or whatever. That is not to say, however, that if a school secretary calls the local cops, they won't come and take you out of there, even if carrying is perfectly legal.

EDIT: Wait a minute. @mkwerx beat me to the punch AGAIN!! You are too smart and too fast for me to keep up.

 

[orygun]

ah, nevermind.

 

[v0lcom13sn0w]

Sprague was our mortal enemies in high school at McNary. buncha snobs. not all snobs but a lot. it is not illegal to have a handgun loaded or not with a CHL at a public school. however, he violated his terms of employment.

its dumb. they should allow armed teachers/ faculty members.

 

[orygun]

Concealed means concealed... in other words, don't ask, don't tell...

Well, not completely "nevermind".

I wonder what people are missing here. What's important, anyway?

My family over any law.

 

[CHLChris]

Now, on the other side of the coin, @v0lcom13sn0w, kids hug me all the time at work as a teacher. I would probably not carry even if I could. However, I really should be allowed to lock up a pistol in a special lock-box in my classroom. Each school should have one or more folks who are allowed to go through training (I'd even pay for it on my own) if they are allowed to store a firearm at school.

I'm sure I shoot more than all of the rest of the staff at the school, combined. I should be allowed to have a life-saving device at my disposal should the excrement meet the oscillator.

 

[CoastRange57]

As for carrying on public schools as it was explained to me you can legally carry there however if an employee of the school notices you are carrying and asks you to leave they are within their rights to do so if you leave when asked you are in the clear however if you choose to argue or refuse to leave you are trespassing with a firearm.

It is very clear a CHL holder can carry on school grounds in Oregon. I verified this with the local SRO. He was a social friend away from the job and knew I carried when I was on a school committee and testified before the Board a couple times a year. I carried a full size .40 for years in these meetings, he was there, and our mutual agreement was to be on opposite sides of the room, make sure our fields were clear and no cross fire. We had trained together and he was Marine Corps so well qualified. We were probably the only ones in the room who would have run towards the trouble that is for sure.

Now if you were made and the school employee asked you to leave because you were carrying, then they would be illegally asking you to leave since you are in compliance with local law, and there would be no legal basis to ask you to leave, unless you were violating some other school regulation or local laws. But why would you be made ??

Post office rules vary, but in our local post office which is a leased facility you can carry with a CHL. The sign in the front with the horrid slash mark had that disclaimer underneath it.

 

[Certaindeaf]

It must be illegal/fake because the biggest union in the world was just jacking off that day.
not

 

[v0lcom13sn0w]

Now, on the other side of the coin, @v0lcom13sn0w, kids hug me all the time at work as a teacher. I would probably not carry even if I could. However, I really should be allowed to lock up a pistol in a special lock-box in my classroom. Each school should have one or more folks who are allowed to go through training (I'd even pay for it on my own) if they are allowed to store a firearm at school.

I'm sure I shoot more than all of the rest of the staff at the school, combined. I should be allowed to have a life-saving device at my disposal should the excrement meet the oscillator.

true that. ankle or appendix carry would definately conceal it better if you are getting hugs and stuff. my kid is 3.5 he knows i carry and i take him shooting all the time. also, he knows not to tell ANYONE that mom and dad have guns. i tested him once by having a friend who he only has met a couple times ask him where mom and dads guns are... "we dont have any guns"


now if i could only explain to him how i lost them all in a tragic dogsledding accident.

 

[v0lcom13sn0w]

i just would feel so much better sending my kids to school knowing theres good guys with guns there.

 

[Diamondback]

i just would feel so much better sending my kids to school knowing theres good guys with guns there.

Wouldn't we all?

 

[Certaindeaf]

I'm a public school teacher. I'm a CHL holder. I know the answer to this question and most of you are missing the relevant issues. @mkwerx had it as close as anybody.

1) CHL holders can legally carry concealed into any public school. They can be a parent or an employee.

2) According to the OR State Supreme Court case Doe v. Medford School District, any school district can make employment rules dictating that a no-guns policy during work hours is legal.

3) Every district in Oregon has such a no-guns work rule. Employees cannot carry during work duties. Get caught, get fired.

4) There will be NO legal repercussions for getting caught, just loss of employment.

When I go to school as a parent, I carry because I love my life. When I go to school as a teacher, I don't...because I love my job. Unfortunately i am forced to choose between my job and my life!

But what if I'm a giraffe? Instructions not clear. lol

 

[Sgt Nambu]

Channel 12 news confirms that it is legal to carry on school/public property yesterday AM!
How open of them!

 

[HB of CJ]

Thank you for the legal distinctions. Regarding Katz vs the Medford Commies, the Teachers Union was part of the problem and most certainly NOT part of any solution? The Teachers Union actually condoned an Illegal Oregon Court Ruling?

A permanent fix would be to change policy within the School Board. To do that might also be very expensive and time consuming. Bad School Board members result in bad policy being enforced. Change the Board. Change the policy. NOT EASY.

Can the Courts make mistakes? Yep. Big one in this case. The decision twisted inside out Oregon State Law. The cost of having the various Gun Rights Groups to legally push an appeal would cost too much? Has this ruling been appealed?

This might be one of those cost/benefit situations. Bigger fish to fry. How much would it cost to push Matz vs Commies all the way to the SCOTUS? Are we prepared to spend THAT kind of money? We have very limited money resources.

Would we win? Do we have the will?

Thus the rub. The Enemies of freedom right now can out run us and out gun us. They have the millions of out of state and country cash donations. We do not. Until the money things switches sides stuff like this will continue. What can WE do?

Right now much much. Respectfully.