How many fpe is needed to kill big game animals?

[osprey]

The .357 mag lever gun thread had many opinions on whether it is enough for deer out to 150yds. I say it is and if it were all I had I wouldn't hesitate to use it. There are many opinions about what is minimum to cleanly take a big game animal so let's hear how many fpe you think it takes to cleanly kill?

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[JohnnyMac]

I had to google fpe so I'm no help.

 

[Val1884]

Depends. A mellow feeding deer I've seen killed with 357 an 32-20.. a pissed off adrenaline filled buck I've watched absorb 5 rounds of 3006 . Both situations it was good vital shots. Weakest caliber I've used was a 357 sig. Muzzleloader failed an I drew pistol an shot the buck at 15 yds he leaped an caught 2 more an fell over dead in 5 ft of first hit. Yes it was modern firearm season in the Stella for those wondering.

 

[bcp]

And remember that men need larger cartridges for hunting than women need.



Bruce

 

[Cape_hunter]

This is a loaded topic....

Energy alone won't kill and animal.
I've seen deer taken with a .22 short.
I've also seen bear take 3 shots from a 375h&h and still not drop.
Also seen an elk dragging a front leg that was almost blown off by a bad shot.

The real question should be what is the minimum humane caliber and load to quickly dispatch big game in NA.

Ftlbs of energy is only part of the equation and you can't simply look at that number in reference to your question.

 

[Certaindeaf]

The .357 mag lever gun thread had many opinions on whether it is enough for deer out to 150yds. I say it is and if it were all I had I wouldn't hesitate to use it. There are many opinions about what is minimum to cleanly take a big game animal so let's hear how many fpe you think it takes to cleanly kill?

The dod has quantified that 50fpe is required to kill you, an x pounder.

 

[Cape_hunter]

I guess the most accurate answer would be whatever energy it takes to punch through the hide, muscle and bone and still have enough to stop the heart.

 

[Nosferatu]

40lbs of bad language or one Alex Baldwin.

 

[HighlandLofts]

If it can penatrate in to the chest cavity it is enough.
What's more important is shot placement.
With out proper shot placement you get wounded animals and wasted meat.

 

[Koda]

The answer is called the bullets Terminal Velocity.
That is the minimum velocity it needs at impact to expand and perform as designed. Bullet makers usually have different values but if not its generally accepted between 1800 and 2000fps minimum for expanding ammo to mushroom.

 

[Mark W.]

The answer is called the bullets Terminal Velocity.
That is the minimum velocity it needs at impact to expand and perform as designed. Bullet makers usually have different values but if not its generally accepted between 1800 and 2000fps minimum for expanding ammo to mushroom.

Interesting 45-70 (trapdoor level) and many muzzle loaders don't make that speed at the muzzle yet have taken everything from squirrel to Bison

 

[osprey]

Bullets of smaller diameter that are designed to expand to increase frontal area certainly work better when in their performance envelope. There are so many options some old some new. There are several designs that will cleanly kill at subsonic speeds and at 1000 fpe and less. A round ball .400 and above launched at 800-1000 fps can be very effective.

 

[Koda]

Interesting 45-70 (trapdoor level) and many muzzle loaders don't make that speed at the muzzle yet have taken everything from squirrel to Bison

It depends on the bullet design.

 

[osprey]

Interesting 45-70 (trapdoor level) and many muzzle loaders don't make that speed at the muzzle yet have taken everything from squirrel to Bison

Yep 40-50 million Bison would argue it was quite effective.

 

[osprey]

My whole impetus for this discussion is to demonstrate there are many ways a bullet can be effective and lethal within it's design limitations and we should all be a bit more opened minded of the possibilities.

 

[Cape_hunter]

The answer is called the bullets Terminal Velocity.
That is the minimum velocity it needs at impact to expand and perform as designed. Bullet makers usually have different values but if not its generally accepted between 1800 and 2000fps minimum for expanding ammo to mushroom.

That is not a bullets terminal velocity.
Velocity is certainly used in the equation, but terminal velocity is not what is used to measure bullet expansion. 2 seperate things.

 

[Koda]

That is not a bullets terminal velocity.
Velocity is certainly used in the equation, but terminal velocity is not what is used to measure bullet expansion. 2 seperate things.

Lost me. Are you referring to expansion size?

 

[ilikegunspdx]

Just search Ron Spomer outdoors on YouTube and you will know everything there is to know about the subject.

 

[Koda]

My whole impetus for this discussion is to demonstrate there are many ways a bullet can be effective and lethal within it's design limitations and we should all be a bit more opened minded of the possibilities.

I misread your post as "fps" not "fpe", sorry for any confusion in my reply above.

I dont know what the minimum energy is for game, say a deer. Generally Ive read at least 1000ft lbs of energy for deer but that does seem way more than needed for a deer. I would guess at least enough energy to pass thru, even if just plop out the other side.

 

[bcp]

To compare extremes, the 22-250 and the 45-70(original) both have around 1700 fpe (muzzle), but they are not equal on game.

Look at other factors.

Bruce