gun owner against gun ownership?

[nwslopoke]

Had a conversation yesterday with someone about high powered magazines and high power rifles and high power ... The antis messaging is landing on target. When I say to her, a 9mm and AR15 shoot at the same rate being a semi auto firearms, I get a glass eyed response.

These are people who will never own guns due to age, finances or just have no desire. They have no up side (in their minds) to protect 2A rights. They can't fathom a US government committing tyrannical acts, regardless of watching police stand by at school shootings, Antifa beatings, government mandating guns turned in from other western countries, among other things.

When the US government flies in baby food, $7 gas in Modesto, this time last year my bank account had double the money in it. Call it a clue. Not predicting a violent future. Just taking a little preparation.

 

[GWS]

Long story short, I have a family member who is a gun owner, ccw permit holder (who uses it regularly as well), NRA member. And yet at the same time is AGAINST gun ownership. Ask this person about guns and they will try to talk their hardest to prevent you and everyone you know from buying one. He will tell you protection should be left to the police, and if you want it for plinking just rent one at the range. He even goes as far as saying if you have enemies that would want to harm you, you probably deserve it.

Anyone ever ran across this type of person before?

Yes I have met someone like that, an arrogant fool who thought only he had the skill, knowledge and insight to own guns and the rest of the hoi polloi should be be unarmed. I took great joy in out shooting him at the range.

 

[HelloKitty187]

 

[arakboss]

arakboss,

That is what almost every Trump supporter tells me. Where do you draw the line on gun grabs or other gun control?

I would like to know what it would take for you to deny a politician your vote.

When it comes to a binary choice between bad or worse, the bad will get my vote regardless because I would rather have bad than worse. I don't believe withholding my vote will do any good. But I am open to hearing the argument as to why it might.

 

[Ranb]

I'm asking you to draw a line. Will you do it?

If you make your voice heard to your Representatives, it can have some influence on the nomination process.

 

[Ura-Ki]

I know some people are not going to like this post, but here goes.

I have noticed an extreme shift in attitudes towards the 2nd Amendment since 2018. Gun owners, even those identifying as conservatives, have turned their backs on the 2A in order to support politicians they favor. I have not changed my stance on the 2A one bit, but my attitude has fallen out of favor in the last four years.

I'm the guy who loads ammo, makes silencers, coaches a rifle team, travels to Olympia to speak in committee on gun bills, has face to face meetings with WA politicians to push pro-gun bills. I vote the issues and have ZERO party loyalty and have always been this way since 1982 when I voted in my first election. I will speak to even the most rabidly anti-gun person in the legislature and do it in a respectful tone. Anyone who is willing to have a meeting with me so I can push a pro-gun bill gets my full attention and polite behavior.

Acting like this has been especially good for me from 2009 up to 2018.

In 2018 Trump turned his back on American gun owners when he used the power of his executive office to order the BATFE to classify bump stocks as contraband machine guns. He could have let Congress ban them, possibly with a buyback like WA did, or a grandfather clause. But Trump wanted his own gun grab so he stepped in and did it the only way he could which resulted in no buy back or grandfather clause. He knew it would not save a single life, but he knew his legacy would be in part, the gun grabber.

That was not enough. While discussing red flag laws with VP Pence in front of others like Diane Feinstein, he objected to any due process taking place prior to ANYONE losing their firearms if they were imagined to be violent. Without due process, no one can be certain, so it all comes down to biased unsupported claims and prejudice. Pence favored careful due process, but Trump made it clear due process was inappropriate prior to losing your firearms.

So what does a reasonable gun owner like me do? I object to these anti-gun actions and statements like anyone who believes in the 2A would; but at a cost. I did not change my stance on gun control a bit, but criticizing anti-gun politicians has cost me membership on several forums including two gun forums and a few political forums.

It is nothing new that a person would be more loyal to a politician than to their civil rights. But I was not expecting conservative gun owners to insist upon being lumped into a group like this. It is very shameful indeed, but those kinds of people do not see it that way at all. Some of them try to tell me that a Trump is better than Biden, but they fail to see that both are unworthy of representing us in the government and they both were not even worthy of being nominated.

I have questioned many people as to why they support Trump even after his proven, proud, anti-gun attitude is on display for everyone to see. They say that they approve of Trump even though they do not approve of the bump stock ban or his "take the guns 1st" insanity. So I ask, "Where do you draw the line on gun control?" and "What would it take for you to stop supporting Trump?"

NOT A SINGLE TRUMP SUPPORTER HAS EVER TOLD ME WHERE THEY DRAW THE LINE ON GUN CONTROL. I think this means they are willing to give up any civil right to prove they are loyal to their favorite politician, whoever it might be.

The anti-gun gun owners are all around us and they are willing to stab anyone in the back to prove they are right.

I understand your frustration here, and share your opinion. HOWEVER, we need to look past our own noses here, 1st, We only found out about Trump AFTER he went off the rails, so we had only ONE choice, support a known quantity, or support another FAR WORSER one coming up the pipe, so we were left with NO choice at all! What to do when this is what happens? I'm no fan of Donaldo J Trumpster, wouldn't vote him dog catcher normally, but what if it's Him vs the old Pedo again, Or Cankles decides the 19th time is the time she wins, how do you choose between them, all bad, do you pinch your nose again and vote the batstard in again, knowing full well he is no friend of the 2nd, or do you accept Pedo or Cankles, or that maniac Beto knowing full well where they stand on our rights?
Ya see, it's ain't just about how bad Trump is/was, it's that he lied to us, and then laughed and still demanded we vote for his sorry arse, but what choice did we have, but to vote him a second term, or watch as the Pedo stole it all and became the worstist POTUS in our entire history!

So, where do we draw the line, that is easy, NO GUN CONTROL, it's easy to say, and we call,, email, show up to participate and let our local and state politicos know that Gun COntrol will cost them,, but in the grander scheme of things, especially at the Fed level and dealing with an absolutist like Pedo, or a jerkoff like Orange man, were screwed no matter which way it goes! Your opinion, while frustrating, is also ultimately meaningless, especially if you don't back it up and vote like your rights depend on it!

Coming in November,, we here in Or. have to choose from the very very worse, a lame dick repub, or a moderately pro 2nd choice, not much to inspire, but it is our best shot. You Watch and see how many here rant and rave that that's no choice at all, so they will write in Donald Duck in protest, or they will vote the choice that has the lest chance, again, in protest, or, my fav. vote their higher conscience ( Gary Johnson) who isn't even running now, while screwing themselves and the rest of us!
Then you get the folks who claim that the vote doesn't even matter, that Potland controls the state, so what ever Potland votes, Potland gets!

 

[Ura-Ki]

I'm asking you to draw a line. Will you do it?

If you make your voice heard to your Representatives, it can have some influence on the nomination process.

Your mistake here is believing you have a choice, as in black and white! Your flat wrong, there is no choice when it comes to Bad, or Worse, you can only choose one, and be thankful if that choice is the one that wins!

 

[PORSCHE928S4]

 

[cbzdel]

Wow this post is old, I was so confused to getting notifications about it. I honestly don't even recall this post at this point or who it was about!

 

[Ranb]

Ura-Ki, you are the first I've seen that has draw a line. Are you going to stay behind that line?

I knew Trump was off the rails when he decided that grabbing pussies as a perk of wealth was something he enjoyed doing.

As far as gun control is concerned, I've been asking for the Trump supporters to draw the line on gun control from 2018 to the present day. Their refusal to draw any line in the sand at all has hardly changed since 2018.

Even after they found out Trump is an anti-gun zealot, the only thing that changed is that these pseudo pro-gun, Trump supporters, have started to use Democratic party anti-gun talking points. They say things like "no one needs a machine gun" or "no one needs that kind of gun" or"what do you want that kind of gun for?" It's disgusting.

Prior to 2018 it was only the anti-gun Democrats saying this kind of crap, now I hear it from Trump supporters.

So what is the difference between Trump and Biden supporters as far as gun control goes? Both welcome the proposed gun grabs for the most part. If you're not yelling in the street and slinging mud at the gun grabbers, then you might was well be asking them to screw you over some more.

Why aren't the people here willing to reject Trump and say so to their party? A vote for Trump is a vote for gun grabs.

If a person draws a line in the sand saying no gun control, then they should be willing to stop supporting the known gun grabber.

So far it is President Trump up to 520,000 guns grabbed, President Biden zero.

 

[arakboss]

I am beginning to smell that under a bridge air odor.

 

[arakboss]

Wow this post is old, I was so confused to getting notifications about it. I honestly don't even recall this post at this point or who it was about!

Funny how it is still relevant though.

 

[ilostmypswrd]

Ura-Ki, you are the first I've seen that has draw a line. Are you going to stay behind that line?

I knew Trump was off the rails when he decided that grabbing pussies as a perk of wealth was something he enjoyed doing.

As far as gun control is concerned, I've been asking for the Trump supporters to draw the line on gun control from 2018 to the present day. Their refusal to draw any line in the sand at all has hardly changed since 2018.

Even after they found out Trump is an anti-gun zealot, the only thing that changed is that these pseudo pro-gun, Trump supporters, have started to use Democratic party anti-gun talking points. They say things like "no one needs a machine gun" or "no one needs that kind of gun" or"what do you want that kind of gun for?" It's disgusting.

Prior to 2018 it was only the anti-gun Democrats saying this kind of crap, now I hear it from Trump supporters.

So what is the difference between Trump and Biden supporters as far as gun control goes? Both welcome the proposed gun grabs for the most part. If you're not yelling in the street and slinging mud at the gun grabbers, then you might was well be asking them to screw you over some more.

Why aren't the people here willing to reject Trump and say so to their party? A vote for Trump is a vote for gun grabs.

If a person draws a line in the sand saying no gun control, then they should be willing to stop supporting the known gun grabber.

So far it is President Trump up to 520,000 guns grabbed, President Biden zero.

WTF are you talking about???????

 

[arakboss]

WTF are you talking about???????

 

[Ura-Ki]

Ura-Ki, you are the first I've seen that has draw a line. Are you going to stay behind that line?

I knew Trump was off the rails when he decided that grabbing pussies as a perk of wealth was something he enjoyed doing.

As far as gun control is concerned, I've been asking for the Trump supporters to draw the line on gun control from 2018 to the present day. Their refusal to draw any line in the sand at all has hardly changed since 2018.

Even after they found out Trump is an anti-gun zealot, the only thing that changed is that these pseudo pro-gun, Trump supporters, have started to use Democratic party anti-gun talking points. They say things like "no one needs a machine gun" or "no one needs that kind of gun" or"what do you want that kind of gun for?" It's disgusting.

Prior to 2018 it was only the anti-gun Democrats saying this kind of crap, now I hear it from Trump supporters.

So what is the difference between Trump and Biden supporters as far as gun control goes? Both welcome the proposed gun grabs for the most part. If you're not yelling in the street and slinging mud at the gun grabbers, then you might was well be asking them to screw you over some more.

Why aren't the people here willing to reject Trump and say so to their party? A vote for Trump is a vote for gun grabs.

If a person draws a line in the sand saying no gun control, then they should be willing to stop supporting the known gun grabber.

So far it is President Trump up to 520,000 guns grabbed, President Biden zero.

My "Line in the Sand " is no line at all until they come for my guns for real, then it's going to actually be more then words! Until then, hell yea, I'll cross it! Here is the deal, IF, and I do mean IF it comes down to Trump and some other Demo like Beto, or ( Take your pick of BAD) then I have absolutely NO CHOICE at all but to ether choose Trump, or the other useless sack of sh!t that's running! Show me the last time the Repubs put up a half way decent candidate to challenge the Fudd Dems or the outright looser like Pedo and the hoe!

Your "Line in the Sand" sounds all patriotic when it's on an internet form, but it's a nothing burger with extra flies when it comes down to the vote, you have to choose what your going to do, do you step across your line to vote, knowing full well the feller or fellette will demand gun control, or do you stand on principle and say NO MORE, and then,..........what? Do you not vote, write in Donald Duck, or vote some other schmuck who lost in the primaries a year ago and had zero chance anyway? I'm curious as to how far you are willing to carry your "Line in the Sand" past the vote, or do you stand on that line and, ......................what?

I'm also curious what you think we all should be doing here, many of us take an active roll in contacting our civic leaders, and holding their feet to the fire, to very little effect, but we do it none the less. many of us here put our money where our mouths are and support pro gun ORGs ( at least the ones that are sane, not like Keven Sterett/OFF) to help fund the fight in courts where our rights ultimately are won or lost, so,...............what is it YOU suggest we all do here, draw a "line in the sand" and sing kum-by-ahhhh while dancing naked around the fire waving AR's in the air!!!!

 

[GWS]

Ura-Ki, you are the first I've seen that has draw a line. Are you going to stay behind that line?

I knew Trump was off the rails when he decided that grabbing pussies as a perk of wealth was something he enjoyed doing.

As far as gun control is concerned, I've been asking for the Trump supporters to draw the line on gun control from 2018 to the present day. Their refusal to draw any line in the sand at all has hardly changed since 2018.

Even after they found out Trump is an anti-gun zealot, the only thing that changed is that these pseudo pro-gun, Trump supporters, have started to use Democratic party anti-gun talking points. They say things like "no one needs a machine gun" or "no one needs that kind of gun" or"what do you want that kind of gun for?" It's disgusting.

Prior to 2018 it was only the anti-gun Democrats saying this kind of crap, now I hear it from Trump supporters.

So what is the difference between Trump and Biden supporters as far as gun control goes? Both welcome the proposed gun grabs for the most part. If you're not yelling in the street and slinging mud at the gun grabbers, then you might was well be asking them to screw you over some more.

Why aren't the people here willing to reject Trump and say so to their party? A vote for Trump is a vote for gun grabs.

If a person draws a line in the sand saying no gun control, then they should be willing to stop supporting the known gun grabber.

So far it is President Trump up to 520,000 guns grabbed, President Biden zero.

What line are you wanting drawn? What do you want gun supporters to do if that line is crossed?

What guns has Trump grabbed?

Got a link or other proof for that statistic?

 

[OldBroad44]

Long story short, I have a family member who is a gun owner, ccw permit holder (who uses it regularly as well), NRA member. And yet at the same time is AGAINST gun ownership. Ask this person about guns and they will try to talk their hardest to prevent you and everyone you know from buying one. He will tell you protection should be left to the police, and if you want it for plinking just rent one at the range. He even goes as far as saying if you have enemies that would want to harm you, you probably deserve it.

Anyone ever ran across this type of person before?

One possibility is he considers himself responsible enough to own a gun but thinks most people arent.

Actually, nothing would make you safer than if you had a gun and nobody else did. So maybe this guy is just trying to make himself as safe as possible and doesn't give a d@mn whether his words make those he is advising less safe.

I once advised one particular lady against getting a gun. Her 16-year old son was seeing a psychiatrist for depression and suicidal ideation. I told her she was out of her ever lovin' mind. A gun makes suicide much easier. I said get a dog or pepper spray or a taser or some combo. She was in a lot more danger from her kid killing himself than from being attacked by a bad guy, I thought.

 

[308]

Ura-Ki, you are the first I've seen that has draw a line. Are you going to stay behind that line?

I knew Trump was off the rails when he decided that grabbing pussies as a perk of wealth was something he enjoyed doing.

As far as gun control is concerned, I've been asking for the Trump supporters to draw the line on gun control from 2018 to the present day. Their refusal to draw any line in the sand at all has hardly changed since 2018.

Even after they found out Trump is an anti-gun zealot, the only thing that changed is that these pseudo pro-gun, Trump supporters, have started to use Democratic party anti-gun talking points. They say things like "no one needs a machine gun" or "no one needs that kind of gun" or"what do you want that kind of gun for?" It's disgusting.

Prior to 2018 it was only the anti-gun Democrats saying this kind of crap, now I hear it from Trump supporters.

So what is the difference between Trump and Biden supporters as far as gun control goes? Both welcome the proposed gun grabs for the most part. If you're not yelling in the street and slinging mud at the gun grabbers, then you might was well be asking them to screw you over some more.

Why aren't the people here willing to reject Trump and say so to their party? A vote for Trump is a vote for gun grabs.

If a person draws a line in the sand saying no gun control, then they should be willing to stop supporting the known gun grabber.

So far it is President Trump up to 520,000 guns grabbed, President Biden zero.

Just out of curiosity, when did #orangemanstweetshurtmysphinchter personally go grab five hundred and twenty thousand 'guns'….sounds like he's been busy

 

[Ranb]

Ura-ki,

It sounds as though you're not really caring about gun control laws and regulations unless they personally affect you?

Several years ago I was begging for someone, anyone, who would accompany me to a meeting with the House Judiciary Chair to push a gun bill. Not a single f--king person on this or any other gun forum could be bothered to do so. An Australian citizen eventually offer to go with and it was a great success.

So you might understand if I don't find your "many of us take an active roll in contacting our civic leaders, and holding their feet to the fire" to be unconvincing, to say the least.

 

[Ranb]

What line are you wanting drawn? What do you want gun supporters to do if that line is crossed?

What guns has Trump grabbed?

Got a link or other proof for that statistic?

I want to know what it takes for you to refuse a politician your vote? How many guns do they have to ban to make this happen?

The Trump administration claims to have required the confiscation or destruction of up to 520,000 bump stocks.

Yes, right here. https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/FR-2018-12-26/pdf/2018-27763.pdf Why is it that you are not familiar with this new rule seeing as how it has been out since 2018?