Clark Co deputy shoots & kills off-duty Vancouver police officer

[arakboss]

Problem number one they were using drone footage at night for intelligence, great the next time your crazy neighbor starts telling you about black helicopters, remember this story. Our privacy is pretty well gone at this time in history.

 

[Caveman Jim]

The terrible irony is that the homeowners alerted the police to the suspect being at that house, had that not happened police would not have been at that address. Furthermore, had the homeowner stayed in his house, he could have defended his castle relatively easily and stayed alive even if the criminal had broken down the door.

He was a LEO, do you really think that most LEO's would cower in their homes in a situation like this? I think not.

 

[ilikegunspdx]

...Whatever mistakes he made it's all guessing and monday morning qb at this point. No possible way to get enough info to make a reasoned judgement on his actions.

Totally agree. So many times u have to actually be there in the situation to make any kind of proper evaluation/judgement or whatever u want to call it.

Fe let's say in a hypothetical situation of a person shooting mugger in adark alley. The victim may know from a perps body language they were intending to cause harm to the victim. But a third party after the fact can say "why did u shoot? he hadn't yet drew his gun". But if they were there it may have been obvious why they shot.

 

[ilikegunspdx]

Problem number one they were using drone footage at night for intelligence, great the next time your crazy neighbor starts telling you about black helicopters, remember this story. Our privacy is pretty well gone at this time in history.

Good catch on the drone thing. I wonder did this help the deputies by communicating info to them, or did it hurt by having too much info to process so that dispatcher/whoever didn't get the right info to the deputy who shot? I wonder if deputy even knew an off duty LEO was present? So many questions...

 

[ilikegunspdx]

He was a LEO, do you really think that most LEO's would cower in their homes in a situation like this? I think not.

Makes me think of this thread about catylitic thief in driveway pointing gun at front door. Kind of similar in a way. Seems to me that getting in a position of advantage (such as from a window above) and having a rifle or shotgun leveled on target without his knowledge would be ideal (if possible). Perp has no chance in that situation plus u are under cover to some extent (bullet would have to go through wall and floor if perp could even shoot at you in time - which he couldn't most likely). U would have control of the situation and if he doesn't comply with your instructions and begins to point a gun at you it's kind of game over for him.

But that's from a homeowner perspective. Like u said, for a LEO it might be duty first (apprehend) that was in his mind (that would be my guess, but who knows).

Washington - Catalytic thief pointing gun at house during robbery, what's legal?

The thumbnail of this video says it all: https://www.kiro7.com/news/local/armed-thieves-steal-bellevue-familys-catalytic-converter/DOXMD3X44JG4PENF7JRNEMYMAQ/ During the entire time the thieves are stealing a cat from a Prius, the lookout aims a firearm at the door of the house, probably...

www.northwestfirearms.com

 

[bkroger86]

He was a LEO, do you really think that most LEO's would cower in their homes in a situation like this? I think not.

Taking a defensive position inside your home with a firearm has a much lower probability for a bad outcome.

"After Sahota was shot, deputies surrounded him on the front porch, still thinking he was the robbery suspect, according to the affidavit. It wasn't until Segura stuck his hands out the front door of the home that officers realized Sahota was the homeowner."

 

[Member 53328]

Monday morning….

 

[The B]

theres a simple rule when it comes to cops: have gun; get shot

this MAY be mitigated by being a cop, but only if in uniform. maybe.

 

[ilikegunspdx]

theres a simple rule when it comes to cops: have gun; get shot

this MAY be mitigated by being a cop, but only if in uniform. maybe.

This example seems to support your point:

News Photographer Shot by Cop Who Mistook Camera and Tripod for Gun

An Ohio newspaper photojournalist was shot by a police officer last night after the cop mistook the camera and tripod the photographer was holding for a

petapixel.com

Funny but I have a spotting scope I installed on a crosman airgun plastic stock. Works really good to stabilize the image and quickly acquire target. Was using it to look for whalesfrom popular lighthouse spot on the beach but this news story was making me nervous the whole time because it was in public with poeple around and u have no idea their background.

 

[RobMa]

Hey Rob,

Would you have gone "hands on" with the guy, or would you have waited for backup to arrive?

Seems like there are so many ways for things to go wrong in a situation like this. Normally, as a non-LEO, I'd stay inside the house. We can't ask the off duty why he went outside, but one would presume it was because he was a LEO and wired that way. Whatever mistakes he made it's all guessing and monday morning qb at this point. No possible way to get enough info to make a reasoned judgement on his actions.

It all would have hinged on the situation, things like this happen very quickly...

 

[bbbass]

It all would have hinged on the situation, things like this happen very quickly...

Yeah, no way to know.

 

[bbbass]

Funny but I have a spotting scope I installed on a crosman airgun plastic stock. Works really good to stabilize the image and quickly acquire target. Was using it to look for whalesfrom popular lighthouse spot on the beach but this news story was making me nervous the whole time because it was in public with poeple around and u have no idea their background.

Mmmm hmmmm...

 

[arakboss]

Mmmm hmmmm...

View attachment 1121539

What caliber is that?

 

[bbbass]

What caliber is that?

$75.99

 

[Caveman Jim]

Taking a defensive position inside your home with a firearm has a much lower probability for a bad outcome.

For an untrained citizen yes but a trained LEO? I think not.

 

[Member 53328]

LEOs have a duty to the public and they hold themselves to that whether on duty or off duty. What tune would people be singing if they found out an off duty cop had stood by and the violent criminal went to the next house and killed a mother and her two kids…. Knowing the off duty officer could have potentially done something to intervene. The whole situation is sad and tragic but a good LEO isn't going to just stand by. Whether he is wearing the badge or not. Sure he could have done things different but atleast he did SOMETHING. The majority of the public would just stand by and allow another to be hurt. "As long as it's not them." It's sad he was accidentally neutralized but I am glad there are still people in this world who are willing to take that risk.

 

[American123]

He was a LEO, do you really think that most LEO's would cower in their homes in a situation like this? I think not.

"Cowering" is a verb that has nothing to do with making the choice to approach the situation more advantageously. Police are generally trained to deal with violent criminals in at least pairs if not more people, solo is never advised if it can be avoided. I really think the guy is dead because the criminal got the best of him and then by unfortunate circumstances, he was shot by the responding officer. It all started with losing to the criminal and it appears that however that scenario played out was poorly planned/executed. I'm suggesting that a plan that is more likely to win is better than a plan that is more likely to lose.

 

[bkroger86]

For an untrained citizen yes but a trained LEO? I think not.

There's a difference between on-duty and off-duty. Walking around in your pajamas with gun doesn't mean you're as effective as an on-duty police officer, who is typically fully kitted (including body armor, restraints, radio/comms) and typically has backup. And most importantly, on-duty police are typically in uniform, which would have saved this man's life. Out of uniform, once he exited his home, he became part of the shooting gallery.

 

[Member 53328]

There's a difference between on-duty and off-duty. Walking around in your pajamas with gun doesn't mean you're as effective as an on-duty police officer, who is typically fully kitted (including body armor, restraints, radio/comms) and typically has backup. And most importantly, on-duty police are typically in uniform, which would have saved this man's life. Out of uniform, once he exited his home, he became part of the shooting gallery.

Sadly soft armor doesn't stop edged weapons. And if he was shot with a rifle his vest would have only done so much. Although being in uniform he would have had more tools at his disposal.

 

[Caveman Jim]

There's a difference between on-duty and off-duty. Walking around in your pajamas with gun doesn't mean you're as effective as an on-duty police officer, who is typically fully kitted (including body armor, restraints, radio/comms) and typically has backup. And most importantly, on-duty police are typically in uniform, which would have saved this man's life. Out of uniform, once he exited his home, he became part of the shooting gallery.

I know the difference, I'm addressing the mentality between the two is all. Like once a marine always a marine.