Washington Pump Shotgun purchase requirements?

[Alexx1401]

Let's not forget that 20 gauge exists if 12 might be a bit much. 20 gauge still packs a real wallop.

As a side note, if she believes she will eventually want a firearm and wants to stay out of the WA database of pistol and semi-auto rifle purchasers as well as the medical waiver and annual background check that now saddles those firearms, she should plan on buying it relatively soon. A new legislative season is starting and JayBob is out to bubblegum us over.

I tried that, 20 Ga for Wife who watched me fire a 12 and would not fire one round. She did fire it, 20, one time. That was it for that. There was no way she was ever going to run several boxes of ammo through one to learn how to use it. Everyone has to remember that just because we love shooting not everyone else does. Wife would not even shoot my Kel-Tec 9mm rifle that I originally bought for her. The .40 version was too much for her. She shot the 9 a few rounds and no more for that either. Now when the Ruger rifle came out, that one she will shoot. Sadly a lot of people just do not "like" shooting anything larger than a .22. Many of them are just not willing to put the time needed in on something they don't like to shoot. As many find out the hard way it's VERY easy to miss with a shotgun at close range if you do not know what you are doing.

 

[awshoot]

I tried that, 20 Ga for Wife who watched me fire a 12 and would not fire one round. She did fire it, 20, one time. That was it for that. There was no way she was ever going to run several boxes of ammo through one to learn how to use it. Everyone has to remember that just because we love shooting not everyone else does. Wife would not even shoot my Kel-Tec 9mm rifle that I originally bought for her. The .40 version was too much for her. She shot the 9 a few rounds and no more for that either. Now when the Ruger rifle came out, that one she will shoot. Sadly a lot of people just do not "like" shooting anything larger than a .22. Many of them are just not willing to put the time needed in on something they don't like to shoot. As many find out the hard way it's VERY easy to miss with a shotgun at close range if you do not know what you are doing.

I agree that the recoil on 20 Ga isn't nothing. It does sound like your wife has somewhat of an extreme case recoil sensitivity though. I sort of get the impression from one the OP's comments -- the one where he says his mom thinks he'll drive up and set her up if the SHTF -- that she's shot before. That could be a misinterpretation on my part though.

The advantage I see with a shotgun for home defense in WA is not so much practical, as it is legal. If she doesn't mind being in WA's database (*), then a pistol or semi-auto rifle is a great choice. If she does mind, that leaves bolt guns, lever actions, and shotguns and of these, shotguns make the most sense for home defense.

(*) in a SHTF scenario, a state of emergency would certainly be declared, that could include suspension of certain civil rights, and the database makes confiscation easy. If she is already in it from having bought a pistol in WA, then buying another barely matters. But if she is clean, she might want to stay that way.

 

[RailwayMan]

Does she need to have a "Safety Class Certificate" first, or is that just for semi-autos?

For pump shotguns is a local law enforcement check required in addition to the federal 4473 instant check?

Is there a mandatory waiting period for pump shotguns, or is that just for semi-autos?

Get a VPIN id for checks ... instant clearence ... same level of security check for Federal Air Marshall.

 

[1Gr8m9d]

According to the guys at Sporting Systems here in vancouver, as long as the barrel isn't riffeled (some shotguns are I guess) and its not a semi-auto it isn't affected by the new laws

 

[RailwayMan]

For home defense get a Mossberg 590 Shockwave in 20ga or 12ga ... get two ... one for Ma and one for Pa. Hang a laser and a high intensity light on them and look out badguy! BATF legal.

 

[RailwayMan]

According to the guys at Sporting Systems here in vancouver, as long as the barrel isn't riffeled (some shotguns are I guess) and its not a semi-auto it isn't affected by the new laws

Eacvh one comes with the BATF exemption notice.

 

[z16chevelleguy]

For home defense get a Mossberg 590 Shockwave in 20ga or 12ga ... get two ... one for Ma and one for Pa. Hang a laser and a high intensity light on them and look out badguy! BATF legal.

View attachment 646206

Check gun laws- we tried buying Remington Tac-14 in Oregon for my brother (Washington resident) and deal wouldn't work as these are not shotguns but firearms.

 

[CarlMc]

I see basically three choices for home defense. Pistol, carbine (AR or PCC,) and shotgun. We used to have a shotgun in the house, but my wife is cross eye dominant and hated shooting the thing (once or twice a year was good for her) and I realized that in a panic, she'd pump it wrong or something. Too many things to go wrong for a biennial shooter. The carbine is a great choice for HD, given the standard 55gr doesn't penetrate very far, but the cross eye dominance ruled out any long gun. A full sized 9mm handgun with light and laser was the final choice, so all she has to do is point and shoot. No lever, buttons, timing, or anything. I wound up being realistic about all the users, as the gun I'd choose for ME wasn't necessarily the gun for everyone else in the house. The choices I made were what was best for everyone in my house, and the point is that you need to look beyond what YOU would choose for YOU, and think about the big picture. A friend was wanting a shotgun for his home, and after I let him compare the options, he's rethinking the original assumptions, which is great.

As far as the AR option and WA state law, if she buys and transfers a lower, stripped or not, it isn't an assault weapon, so the new rules don't apply. You and her have a little build party and she comes away much wiser about how her gun works and what matters.

 

[RailwayMan]

Check gun laws- we tried buying Remington Tac-14 in Oregon for my brother (Washington resident) and deal wouldn't work as these are not shotguns but firearms.

Yes, they are considered a hand gun.

 

[Alexx1401]

For home defense get a Mossberg 590 Shockwave in 20ga or 12ga ... get two ... one for Ma and one for Pa. Hang a laser and a high intensity light on them and look out badguy! BATF legal.

View attachment 646206

Sadly this is exactly why many women never learn how to shoot. Some well meaning experienced shooter will hand something like this to a new one, and often that is the end of them wanting to learn. Many just never get it. I love to shoot. Love something with some push back. It was crudely said to me when young by and older guy, "shooting something with no recoil is like having sex with some one who just lays there".
That is great for those of us who like shooting. MANY, especially many women, do not like shooting. A lot of them will have all kinds of fun with a .22. That does not mean they will ever like a shotgun. If they will not practice with one enough to be good its setting them up for failure. A hit with a .22 beats a miss with a 20 or even 12 Ga. Handing someone something that they hate or scares them is not helping them when the need comes up.
I have been SUPER tempted to buy one of these shorty shot guns since I think it would be fun as hell. No way would I hand one to a new shooter who wanted to learn and get something for protection.

 

[Alexx1401]

Get a VPIN id for checks ... instant clearence ... same level of security check for Federal Air Marshall.

That will not get around the new laws in WA state that they are talking about. We still have instant check for many things like long guns that are not semi, or even AR lowers that are "other". This is not a Federal thing here it's sadly a State thing that voters put forward. Some are putting in a lot of time, effort, and money to fight it, and we hope to beat it back.

 

[Alexx1401]

Yes, they are considered a hand gun.

Has anyone seen the state of WA actually put that in writing yet? As in is the State of WA transferring these shorty shotguns as a hand gun now? With the wait from your CLEO for a hand gun sale? If they actually do that here then they would be legal to carry loaded in a vehicle with a permit here since our permits do not allow us to carry a loaded long gun, only a hand gun.

 

[Alexx1401]

I see basically three choices for home defense. Pistol, carbine (AR or PCC,) and shotgun. We used to have a shotgun in the house, but my wife is cross eye dominant and hated shooting the thing (once or twice a year was good for her) and I realized that in a panic, she'd pump it wrong or something. Too many things to go wrong for a biennial shooter. The carbine is a great choice for HD, given the standard 55gr doesn't penetrate very far, but the cross eye dominance ruled out any long gun. A full sized 9mm handgun with light and laser was the final choice, so all she has to do is point and shoot. No lever, buttons, timing, or anything. I wound up being realistic about all the users, as the gun I'd choose for ME wasn't necessarily the gun for everyone else in the house. The choices I made were what was best for everyone in my house, and the point is that you need to look beyond what YOU would choose for YOU, and think about the big picture. A friend was wanting a shotgun for his home, and after I let him compare the options, he's rethinking the original assumptions, which is great.

As far as the AR option and WA state law, if she buys and transfers a lower, stripped or not, it isn't an assault weapon, so the new rules don't apply. You and her have a little build party and she comes away much wiser about how her gun works and what matters.

YEP! Many seem to have a real hate on for lights and lasers which if fine with me, I am big on them. Wife has two "go to" hand guns for the house and one "go to" PCC. They all have light / laser combos. Found some a while ago that use a rechargeable battery. You can charge them while on the gun. Loved them so much I bought a bunch of them. The by her head gun is 9mm with 18 rounds ready that has a light/ laser one it. The round is a little light but it's something she both can and will practice with and she is better with it than she realized. While ago she paid for a class aimed at beginners. She was so much better than the rest of the class the instructors spent almost no time with her. This made her mad that she paid and got so little time with them. As I told her though it was the teachers telling her she is ready to go.

 

[ZigZagZeke]

My range is just across the border in Oregon. If she finally gets one, then I will buy her a wall mounted ShotLock Shotgun vault

Amazon.com : ShotLock Shotgun 200M Solo-Vault (Mechanical) : Sports & Outdoors

Amazon.com : ShotLock Shotgun 200M Solo-Vault (Mechanical) : Sports & Outdoors

www.amazon.com

Also have a look at the Hornady version:

Hornady Accurate Deadly Dependable. Hornady® RAPiD® Safe Shotgun Wall Lock

Designed specifically for shotguns, this safe can be mounted horizontally or vertically in closets, behind doors â anywhere you want quick access using an RFID tag. These safes feature the same convenient and tamperproof security as our other RFiD-enabled safes.

www.hornadysecurity.com

 

[RailwayMan]

Sadly this is exactly why many women never learn how to shoot. Some well meaning experienced shooter will hand something like this to a new one, and often that is the end of them wanting to learn. Many just never get it. I love to shoot. Love something with some push back. It was crudely said to me when young by and older guy, "shooting something with no recoil is like having sex with some one who just lays there".
That is great for those of us who like shooting. MANY, especially many women, do not like shooting. A lot of them will have all kinds of fun with a .22. That does not mean they will ever like a shotgun. If they will not practice with one enough to be good its setting them up for failure. A hit with a .22 beats a miss with a 20 or even 12 Ga. Handing someone something that they hate or scares them is not helping them when the need comes up.
I have been SUPER tempted to buy one of these shorty shot guns since I think it would be fun as hell. No way would I hand one to a new shooter who wanted to learn and get something for protection.

She was trained at Lethal Force Institute; I feel confident she handles all firearms well.

 

[RailwayMan]

Has anyone seen the state of WA actually put that in writing yet? As in is the State of WA transferring these shorty shotguns as a hand gun now? With the wait from your CLEO for a hand gun sale? If they actually do that here then they would be legal to carry loaded in a vehicle with a permit here since our permits do not allow us to carry a loaded long gun, only a hand gun.

Each one comes with the BATF letter designating it a handgun. Does Washington think it can over-ride Federal law on this one? Don't know; we're in Oregon.

 

[RailwayMan]

That will not get around the new laws in WA state that they are talking about. We still have instant check for many things like long guns that are not semi, or even AR lowers that are "other". This is not a Federal thing here it's sadly a State thing that voters put forward. Some are putting in a lot of time, effort, and money to fight it, and we hope to beat it back.

So you are saying Washington has a background check requirement which over-rides the Federal requirement for a back ground check? That's strange. Thought Supreme Court already ruled states cannot do that?

 

[awshoot]

So you are saying Washington has a background check requirement which over-rides the Federal requirement for a back ground check? That's strange. Thought Supreme Court already ruled states cannot do that?

Washington has BG check requirements and maintains a confiscation database system for pistols and semi-auto rifles that runs parallel with the Federal requirements. For pistols this has been true since the 30s, for semi-auto rifles since last year.

Pistol:

(22) "Pistol" means any firearm with a barrel less than sixteen inches in length, or is designed to be held and fired by the use of a single hand.

The shotgun in question has a 14.375" barrel. So under WA law it is a pistol. That puts it squarely into the confiscation database system WA maintains.

• Definitions: pistol, "semiautomatic assault rifle", and rifle are pertinent: RCW 9.41.010: Terms defined.
• Info dealers are required to keep and turn over to the state, see Par 6: RCW 9.41.090: Dealer deliveries regulated—Hold on delivery—Fees authorized. (Contingent expiration date.)
• Dept of Licensing to store the data dealers collect: RCW 9.41.129: Recordkeeping requirements.

 

[Alexx1401]

So you are saying Washington has a background check requirement which over-rides the Federal requirement for a back ground check? That's strange. Thought Supreme Court already ruled states cannot do that?

The new checks here do not override the Feds, they are needed on top of the Feds. The Feds can say you are good to go, that does not mean the state will allow the dealer to sell you a gun. This state has had a waiting period for hand guns for so long I can't remember when it went in. was 5 now it's 10 Buis. days. What they are waiting for is the buyers CLEO to say it is ok. Now they added the wait to semi auto rifles too. Again this has nothing to do with the feds. When the feds started the mandatory checks they were doing hand guns for WA as a favor. They told WA they had to set up their own. We could wave the wait with a permit. The Feds gave up and told WA no more. So you still have a Federal check on all guns. After that you have the state hoops to jump through.

 

[Alexx1401]

Each one comes with the BATF letter designating it a handgun. Does Washington think it can over-ride Federal law on this one? Don't know; we're in Oregon.

It's not the Federal law in question here. You do know some states make guns the Feds say are ok illegal in their state correct? Not sure where anyone would get the idea that states can not make gun laws.
Anyway in this state WA, with a permit you can carry a loaded hand gun in the vehicle. If the state is actually running the checks on these shotguns as a hand gun, not a firearm, then anyone who has a permit (CPL) here could carry one loaded in the vehicle. I have yet to hear an FFL chime in yet that WA is actually running these as hand guns. So anyone who owns one I would make damn sure before carrying it in the car loaded.