Pocket carry pistol

[Alexx1401]

I use a European single action .32 "police turn-in" that's all steel. I can empty the darned thing in "less than a heartbeat". I can also group them very tightly. Couple this with the penetrative and destructive properties of the Underwood "Extreme Cavitator" loads, and you can keep your .380 Auto.

Thank you very much.

Over the years there are several guns I have sold that I miss. One of them was an old imported .32, SA, that was all steel. Imported by FIE. It was too heavy to me for pocket carry but that weight did make the damn thing fun to shoot. As you mention I could unload a mag very fast on target due to the very low recoil. Someone talked me out of it since it was a safe queen. As so often happens I often wish I would have kept the damn thing now.

 

[Kruel J]

I use a European single action .32 "police turn-in" that's all steel. I can empty the darned thing in "less than a heartbeat". I can also group them very tightly. Couple this with the penetrative and destructive properties of the Underwood "Extreme Cavitator" loads, and you can keep your .380 Auto.

Thank you very much.

Underwood's .32 +p has 110 less ft/lbs and 15 less grain weight than their standard pressure .380 round. Not to mention 200 FPS slower. That's a strange argument to try and have. And ok, I'll keep my .380 and its FAR superior ballistics. No problem.

 

[Captain O]

If I had a .327 Federal Magnum revolver I sure wouldn't carry .32acp in it for defense.

Would you care to rephrase that statement so that is makes sense? Of course you wouldn't shoot .32 Auto in a revolver chambered for the .327 Federal Magnum Cartridge.

If you're going to carry a compact auto in a viable defense caliber, the .32 Auto with a longer barrel than the Kel-Tec .32 will impart more velocity/energy to the lighter bullet than the .380. If you want to carry the .380, carry the darned thing in the newer Browning "Black Label" pistol.

Despite the "cool" or concealment factor of the smaller handgun, a short barrel is not the friend of either cartridge; it robs the projectile of the velocity it needs to provide adequate penetration.

You just can't deny Newtonian physics.

 

[Certaindeaf]

Would you care to rephrase that statement so that is makes sense? Of course you wouldn't shoot .32 Auto in a revolver chambered for the .327 Federal Magnum Cartridge.

If you're going to carry a compact auto in a viable defense caliber, the .32 Auto with a longer barrel than the Kel-Tec .32 will impart more velocity/energy to the lighter bullet than the .380. If you want to carry the .380, carry the darned thing in the newer Browning "Black Label" pistol.

Despite the "cool" or concealment factor of the smaller handgun, a short barrel is not the friend of either cartridge; it robs the projectile of the velocity it needs to provide adequate penetration.

You just can't deny Newtonian physics.

What?
You can fire .32acp out of a .327 Magnum.. I'm saying I wouldn't carry the .32acp in it for defense.

 

[Captain O]

Underwood's .32 +p has 110 less ft/lbs and 15 less grain weight than their standard pressure .380 round. Not to mention 200 FPS slower. That's a strange argument to try and have. And ok, I'll keep my .380 and its FAR superior ballistics. No problem.

You are in denial over the physics of the standard .380 loads.

"Shot placement is king, penetration is queen. Everything else is angels dancing on the heads of pins." - Albuquerque New Mexico Coroner, 2005.

 

[Captain O]

What?
You can fire .32acp out of a .327 Magnum.. I'm saying I wouldn't carry the .32acp in it for defense.

I never suggested that you do so. Try again.

 

[Certaindeaf]

I never suggested that you do so. Try again.

The magnum is many times more powerful. Does that make sense to you?

 

[Kruel J]

You are in denial over the physics of the standard .380 loads.

"Shot placement is king, penetration is queen. Everything else is angels dancing on the heads of pins." - Albuquerque New Mexico Coroner, 2005.

OK Cap't. We all know shot placement is king. Nobody's first day here. And if I'm in denial, I would suggest you email Underwood and let them know their ballistic ratings are wrong for their standard pressure .380 loads. See how that works for you. Anyway, I learned a long time ago not to compare wits with anyone, especially on the net. Cheers and enjoy your .32!

 

[Captain O]

There's a friend of mine that works as an attorney in conjunction with the Albuquerque Coroner's office. The Coroner, along with my friend, performed more autopsies on "gangland" shootings between 1995 and 2005 involving the inexpensive .32 Auto and .380 Auo loads available at the time.

On particular "victim" was killed in the driver's seat of a mid-70's Chevrolet Impala from it's back seat. The shooter used a "ring of fire" .380 Auto with ball ammunition, striking the driver directly in the back of the head. When the driver's head was tilted forward, the 9mm Corto bullet rolled out of his mouth, ready to be reloaded.

Such power!

 

[aikikenjitsu]

Of course I carry a Ruger LCP .380. YouTube shows a lot of tests done with the Ruger .380 and comparable tests with other guns also, and the .380 is very impressive. Before you reject the Ruger .380, check out a few or more tests on them, on YouTube.
I can carry 16 rounds in my .380 if needed.
Yet, we all have guns we like. If it will cause a bullet to enter a bad guy's body, then it's a good gun. After that, it's all about splitting hairs.
Sifu

 

[Arv56]

The LCP with a 7 round extended mag helps with the grip size. I have the LCP custom (red trigger) and fairly large hands (although slender fingers), and have no trouble gripping this little gun.

 

[Pandaz3]

What?
You can fire .32acp out of a .327 Magnum.. I'm saying I wouldn't carry the .32acp in it for defense.

I think that is 32 S&W, 32 S&W Long, 32 H&R Magnum, and 327 Federal Magnum at least in my Ruger 327 Federal Magnum LCR six shooter.

 

[Pandaz3]

There's a friend of mine that works as an attorney in conjunction with the Albuquerque Coroner's office. The Coroner, along with my friend, performed more autopsies on "gangland" shootings between 1995 and 2005 involving the inexpensive .32 Auto and .380 Auo loads available at the time.

On particular "victim" was killed in the driver's seat of a mid-70's Chevrolet Impala from it's back seat. The shooter used a "ring of fire" .380 Auto with ball ammunition, striking the driver directly in the back of the head. When the driver's head was tilted forward, the 9mm Corto bullet rolled out of his mouth, ready to be reloaded.

Such power!

If the driver wasn't such a hard head the guy in the back would never have shot him...is that the moral of this story?

 

[ma96782]

It's not only Size that matters. One should also consider Weight and Caliber.

So....I used to carry a S&W M60 but you know, 5 rounds of .38 special and not exactly slim (due to the cylinder bulge).

Then.....38 Special and 9mm is universally accepted as a min. OK, you want to push it....maybe .380 ACP with the correct ammo. But, you'll need to practice. So, look at what store bought 9mm is going for vs. .380 ACP.

What am I getting at?

Take a look at this comparison of a typical small sized .32 ACP/.380 Kel Tec vs a new school small sized 9mm Diamondback behind it.


I'm cheap.....so.....
9mm,
small sized semi auto,
minimal weight, I can dig it.

Aloha, Mark

 

[Kruel J]

Frankly any of the choices mentioned are better than a beer bottle.

 

[Kruel J]

There's a friend of mine that works as an attorney in conjunction with the Albuquerque Coroner's office. The Coroner, along with my friend, performed more autopsies on "gangland" shootings between 1995 and 2005 involving the inexpensive .32 Auto and .380 Auo loads available at the time.

On particular "victim" was killed in the driver's seat of a mid-70's Chevrolet Impala from it's back seat. The shooter used a "ring of fire" .380 Auto with ball ammunition, striking the driver directly in the back of the head. When the driver's head was tilted forward, the 9mm Corto bullet rolled out of his mouth, ready to be reloaded.

Such power!

Seems to me the moral of this story is the round did its job. Good or bad the intended target ceased to breathe. I don't care if he was spitting out rounds like a popcorn machine. The bullet did what it was intended to do. That's the great thing about being an American and an individual......we all have choices! Cheers!

 

[Captain O]

If the driver wasn't such a hard head the guy in the back would never have shot him...is that the moral of this story?

No, the "gangland" shooters were using the typical short-barreled cast-zinc pistols sold to those that couldn't afford a more expensive handgun. These are frequently stolen from the low-income shooters and used to commit crimes by the "bags of cayuse droppings" that deal drugs and engage in gang warfare. Unfortunately, these are also the average barrel length of the modern 9mm Kurz (.380 ACP) pistols being sold for the concealment market.

One must remember that both the .380 Auto and .32 Auto have the same 17mm case length. This restriction coupled with the short barrel of the day tends to permit the propellant to burn outside the barrel. This is why, regardless of the published data on the ammunition box, the performance is generally less than optimal. In case you haven't noticed, most of the published data for the .380 Auto is for a 3.75" barrel. Most people want to carry a .380 with a barrel that's generally more abbreviated than this. Concealment comes with a price, and that price is velocity. The importance of velocity for the .380 cannot be overemphasized. Browning's Black Label in .380 sports a 4" barrel and a nice, spicy FMJ gains enough velocity to penetrate and handle well at the same time. It's not heavy enough, (through momentum) to match a .38 Special, but it comes close. I would like to see a hand-made 4" barrel in .32 NAA loaded with Underwood's "Extreme Cavitator" to see what kind of permanent crush cavity it makes.

I don't have a short-barreled .32 Auto, but I do have a 2" barreled .32 Magnum.

 

[Raidingtime]

I appreciate everyone's response. I would rather have a 9mm since I am already stocked up on that ammo.

I will check out some of the options but it sounds like the Glock 43 might be the ticket

SW Shield > Glock 43 in my opinion. They're less expensive, hold +1 9mm round over the 43, and are slightly smaller.

I used to EDC a 19 and KAHR CW9. The 19 is great but is bulky and definitely not pocket carry. Sometimes I still carry the 19 but it mostly stays locked up in my Suby. The KAHR is a jam o matic. I've thoroughly convinced people that like KAHR's are the people that don't regularly target practice. GF's KAHR P380 was a jam o matic as well. They're nice to look at but that's about it. KAHR's customer service in support of these firearms is also as terrible as their firearms reliability.

 

[aikikenjitsu]

The LCP with a 7 round extended mag helps with the grip size. I have the LCP custom (red trigger) and fairly large hands (although slender fingers), and have no trouble gripping this little gun.

Good idea, I bet all your magazines are 7 rounds.

 

[Pandaz3]

No, the "gangland" shooters were using the typical short-barreled cast-zinc pistols sold to those that couldn't afford a more expensive handgun. These are frequently stolen from the low-income shooters and used to commit crimes by the "bags of cayuse droppings" that deal drugs and engage in gang warfare. Unfortunately, these are also the average barrel length of the modern 9mm Kurz (.380 ACP) pistols being sold for the concealment market.

One must remember that both the .380 Auto and .32 Auto have the same 17mm case length. This restriction coupled with the short barrel of the day tends to permit the propellant to burn outside the barrel. This is why, regardless of the published data on the ammunition box, the performance is generally less than optimal. In case you haven't noticed, most of the published data for the .380 Auto is for a 3.75" barrel. Most people want to carry a .380 with a barrel that's generally more abbreviated than this. Concealment comes with a price, and that price is velocity. The importance of velocity for the .380 cannot be overemphasized. Browning's Black Label in .380 sports a 4" barrel and a nice, spicy FMJ gains enough velocity to penetrate and handle well at the same time. It's not heavy enough, (through momentum) to match a .38 Special, but it comes close. I would like to see a hand-made 4" barrel in .32 NAA loaded with Underwood's "Extreme Cavitator" to see what kind of permanent crush cavity it makes.

I don't have a short-barreled .32 Auto, but I do have a 2" barreled .32 Magnum.

I do have a Browning BDA in 380, it is a 3.8 inch barrel, 13 rounds and way to big to be a pocket pistol. I would love to own a Black Label but bigger 380's are plinkers or home defense guns to me and as pointed out by others 380 make for expensive plinking (I still do it, just not as much.)
I have short barreled revolvers and yes you do take a hit in performance with any barrel less than optimum...no one tells you what that is easily do they