Oregon concealed carry question

[HB of CJ]

Be curious how this plays out. Right now it looks like nobody knows for sure.

 

[Member 5605]

....and even better to consult an attorney knowledgable in this area of the law.

And at one hour of an attorney, you'd have your license paid for and some....

 

[Camelfilter]

That is something I hadn't thought of. I was fairly certain I was right, I really just like to plan against my own ignorance, as well as that of others.

Also many FFL's will not let both parties leave until the buyer is "all set", even though once the proccess begins the weapon is the property of the FFL.

...so let's say you are trying to sell a pistol to someone named Joe Smith, and he doesn't have a CHL. That will be an automatic human review down at the OSP, and if the buyer did not provide his social security # (as is his rite)...delayed.

At that point the FFL just might offer the seller the weapon back, after a BGC of the seller, and the buyer paying all fees. Etc etc.

Some FFL's will allow the seller to leave while the buyer is still being run. At that point any BGC issues are between the buyer and the FFL.

 

[dangerranger60]

The property owner can CC carry on his/her personal and private property? Yes? Without a CC permit? Yes? Inside you home would be an example. Outside on your private personal property another example. But I do not know if an associate or employee can also CC carry without a CC permit with permission of the owner. Grey area?

Also if you have imaginary or real deal concerns about another employee then perhaps this all should be addressed by other means. I had a MD Doc appointment this afternoon. I had to disarm myself to go inside the doctors office building. They had that silly stupid free kill zone sign. The ladies in the front office are all known to me.

When I asked them about the free kill zone they got instantly mad and very hostile. I had to change the subject fast. Strange how they went from zero to pissed so quick. One nice lady said that in Cave Junction everybody carries only not inside the Doctors office. Made no sense to me but there you have it. The Doc hunts Elk. No guns inside..

The guys at OFF would know your needful answers.

My son worked for a Orthopedic Group in the Radiology department. You would be surprised at how many problems they have had with guns in there office! They actually had one older gal fire her gun! It passed through a wall and lightly clipped a Drs ear!

 

[ob1]

Is it legal for someone to carry a concealed handgun without a permit if they are indoors at their office/place of business?
Long story short: I have a permit, my wife does not, there is an individual at her workplace that she has serious concerns about and she is considering carrying when she is by herself in the office.

At post 25 now on this thread and I still don't understand what the big issue is on her just getting the permit. Who cares about the niceties of who owns what property...she is obviously finding herself in a threatening situation on a daily basis. She needs answers now. If her employer HR can't / won't help for some reason, get her to be proactive, but have her start there to document the problem {no mentioning guns obviously}

From what I have read, the situation she finds herself in is screaming for her to go through the couple hours of training. If for no other reason, just to give her a competent understanding of liability and the dynamics of using defensive deadly force, which she is apparently fearing for some reason. Have her go through the training at your CHL issuing Sheriffs Office. She can probably get in a few hypothetical "what if" answers from the LEO{s} doing the instruction.

 

[soberups]

Private?

If so, check your HR policies. If in a private building, there could be a second set of requirements to comply with. Example an office tower -

Federal? School? Post Office?

Help her take an on-line course over the weekend, and get a permit application started next week.

She is the HR manager of her company, so the only person who could fire her is either herself or the owner, who is seldom there and who is pro-gun. So her concern is legality, not company policy.
You mentioned an on line course. When I got my Oregon permit in 1997, it was a class I took in person at a gun range with live fire qualification. Has that changed? Is it possible to do everything online now?

 

[soberups]

At post 25 now on this thread and I still don't understand what the big issue is on her just getting the permit. Who cares about the niceties of who owns what property...she is obviously finding herself in a threatening situation on a daily basis. She needs answers now. If her employer HR can't / won't help for some reason, get her to be proactive, but have her start there to document the problem {no mentioning guns obviously}

From what I have read, the situation she finds herself in is screaming for her to go through the couple hours of training. If for no other reason, just to give her a competent understanding of liability and the dynamics of using defensive deadly force, which she is apparently fearing for some reason. Have her go through the training at your CHL issuing Sheriffs Office. She can probably get in a few hypothetical "what if" answers from the LEO{s} doing the instruction.

Long story short: she is actually the HR manager of the company. The employee in question has approached, but not reached, the threshold of behavior that would justify terminating him.
Here is the problem with her getting a permit. She is phobic of guns. Her first husband committed suicide in front of her with one. She is conceptually pro-2nd amendment and supports my hobby and that I carry, but gets severe anxiety at the sight and sound of a gun so out of respect for her I keep them secured and out of view in our home. Live-fire practice at a range would be traumatic for her. A semi automatic pistol would not be appropriate for her but she is capable of loading, unloading and safely handling a hammerless .38 snub nose revolver and will keep my Ruger LCR in her nightstand drawer when I am out of town. But she has no desire to carry in public, nor would it ever be appropriate for her to do so with her lack of training. Her only desire to carry is in the specific situation of her office when she is working late. So I was hoping to avoid putting her thru a live-fire course if possible.

 

[Mark W.]

The property owner can CC carry on his/her personal and private property? Yes? Without a CC permit? Yes? Inside you home would be an example. Outside on your private personal property another example. But I do not know if an associate or employee can also CC carry without a CC permit with permission of the owner. Grey area?

Also if you have imaginary or real deal concerns about another employee then perhaps this all should be addressed by other means. I had a MD Doc appointment this afternoon. I had to disarm myself to go inside the doctors office building. They had that silly stupid free kill zone sign. The ladies in the front office are all known to me.

When I asked them about the free kill zone they got instantly mad and very hostile. I had to change the subject fast. Strange how they went from zero to pissed so quick. One nice lady said that in Cave Junction everybody carries only not inside the Doctors office. Made no sense to me but there you have it. The Doc hunts Elk. No guns inside..

The guys at OFF would know your needful answers.

I have taken my pistol out of my pocket and placed it on the table next to the scales in an attempt to weigh less. The nurse just looked at me and asked me if I was ready? My doc and I often talk firearms during my appointments.

 

[Nick Burkhardt]

Long story short... So I was hoping to avoid putting her thru a live-fire course if possible.

She is NOT ready to carry and I hate to say it, but may end up having the firearm taken away from her if she draws and is not willing to shoot.

Seriously, get several types of pepper spray and practice deployment until she is comfortable with carrying it on body. One of those personal screamer alarms would be better scaring off the office jerk opposed to a shaky pistol.

 

[TeacherSmurf]

To me this would be like asking if you could drive a car to and from work, if necessary, because it is only a few miles, but never taking the test, never driving one before, and being deathly afraid of cars. Ride a bike or get a ride.

If she can't do what is necessary for her to get a permit, I don't understand why she would want a gun to defend herself, when there are other non-gun options available. I would suggest pepper spray and/or a taser (I think they are legal in Oregon).

 

[CountryGent]

I could be wrong, but I think you have to be the owner of the company to carry concealed at work without a permit..

I believe you are correct:

Possession Concealment Oregon law regulates the manner in which a firearm or handgun may be possessed. It is a crime to carry a concealed firearm upon one's person or possess a handgun that is concealed and readily accessible in a vehicle in Oregon without a concealed handgun permit. This prohibition does not apply to a person who is in their own residence or their own place of business.

 

[CountryGent]

taser (I think they are legal in Oregon).

FWIW, Taser International has a guide and a map here.

 

[RicInOR]

She is the HR manager of her company, so the only person who could fire her is either herself or the owner, who is seldom there and who is pro-gun. So her concern is legality, not company policy.
You mentioned an on line course. When I got my Oregon permit in 1997, it was a class I took in person at a gun range with live fire qualification. Has that changed? Is it possible to do everything online now?

Online courses are acceptable in Oregon.

The reason to do that is expediency.

I think you need to know the law, and an in person class allows for questions and such, which can work better for some people.
I recommend the OFF book. Oregon's Only No Compromise Gun Rights Organization - Oregon Firearms Federation


As for competency with the FA she'd be carrying, I think that is a given requirement.

So this concerns me greatly -

she is phobic of guns. ...
and that I carry, but gets severe anxiety at the sight and sound of a gun ...
Live-fire practice at a range would be traumatic for her

She needs a different solution for today.

good luck

 

[Camelfilter]

Having a firearm for self defense, and not routinely practicing is, well not the most intelligent thing one can do.

Having a firearm for self defense, NEVER practicing? How is that likely to end up?

a. unjustified shooting.
b. taken and used against her.
c. frozen and never drawn, when she should have.

OP, you know this, so I'm not understanding why you are supporting her on it & asking on here!

So no, it's a bad idea for her to carry without getting a CHL, not only that it's a felony. Have her take a women's class. With other women. A non live fire class, which is no longer required anyways.

She needs the range time though.

Or she shouldn't carry.

 

[soberups]

Having a firearm for self defense, and not routinely practicing is, well not the most intelligent thing one can do.

Having a firearm for self defense, NEVER practicing? How is that likely to end up?

a. unjustified shooting.
b. taken and used against her.
c. frozen and never drawn, when she should have.

OP, you know this, so I'm not understanding why you are supporting her on it & asking on here!

So no, it's a bad idea for her to carry without getting a CHL, not only that it's a felony. Have her take a women's class. With other women. A non live fire class, which is no longer required anyways.

She needs the range time though.

Or she shouldn't carry.

For the most part I would tend agree with you.

I have serious concerns about her relying on a gun for protection given her lack of training. And I have shared those concerns with her.

But in the end the decision is hers to make not mine. She is an adult with no criminal history and the same 2nd Amendment rights as the rest of us.

At least we are talking about it. And she is at least expressing a willingness to go to the range, which was not there before.

Given her history with guns, that in itself is admirable. This is a process which will require a lot of baby steps...

 

[Camelfilter]

For the most part I would tend agree with you.

I have serious concerns about her relying on a gun for protection given her lack of training. And I have shared those concerns with her.

But in the end the decision is hers to make not mine. She is an adult with no criminal history and the same 2nd Amendment rights as the rest of us.

At least we are talking about it. And she is at least expressing a willingness to go to the range, which was not there before.

Given her history with guns, that in itself is admirable. This is a process which will require a lot of baby steps...

Nice! (That she's willing to consider involving herself)

Yah, baby steps.

...in the meantime also take every step possible to mitigate her risk. Change of schedule, to coincide with everyone else perhaps? Discussion in regard to her specific concerns with other senior mngmt staff?

Random "days out of the office" if projects allow-work from home, good time to take self defence class as well.

Etc.

 

[ob1]

Long story short: she is actually the HR manager of the company. The employee in question has approached, but not reached, the threshold of behavior that would justify terminating him.

Trying to read between the lines here.

So if she is the HR manager, she would be the first in line to terminate this guy, if / when that time comes, while there is some underlying conduct leading up to this, her main concern is that he will seek revenge on her for him loosing his job.
How am I doing so far ?

If the above is the case, it sounds like she she needs to obtain additional HR training on this dynamic. I am pretty sure there are resources available to HR departments for this type of thing... be it in the form of seminars by larger LE agencies or the private sector. In fact thats a growing industry.
While she needs to always be aware of her personal security needs, she also has to understand that any physical force inflicted on an employee by a manager will likely end up in a law suit for her and the business. Nut case offender or not. This includes the use of dubious gas and shock gadgets.

She may need help to develop a work place contingency policy, including such things as an office evac plan and a response tree. By networking with other industry professionals and developing her own personalized plan she may gain a degree of personal confidence that would reduce some of her stress levels.

Her first stop would be at the local LE dept in her area who could put her onto additional resources.

ASIS would be another option:

ASIS Online

 

[uscsoldier]

Get her one of these

TASER C2 Bolt $50 Off with Free Shipping​

 

[pchewn]

Well if some OTHER employee (employee A) is so scared to come to work because of the behavior of "that guy", her job as HR manager would be to fix it so employee A could work without fear.

She would need to investigate and see if "that guy" could change his behavior, or if "employee A" is just imagining things.

Since she is "employee A" and she still feels scared and threatened, she needs to terminate "that guy". It is not worth it to have to deal with that toxic employee. Get rid of him, now. Hire a security guard to be there when he is terminated.

 

[TheGameMaster]

If you have a CHL, when OSP runs the background check, your given priority over other applicants; that is to say, you skip ahead to just behind the previous CHL holder in the que. And the NIC check comes back faster if you enter your social.