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newbie needs some help

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Hey everyone. Super new to the reloading scene here and just finished my first small batch that was more of a trial run to get to under stand the dillon 550 i got. Any ways. I loaded up some 9mm im concern is my recipe. Kinda worries i may have seated to deep? I have a bunch of berrys hollow base flat tip thick plate. I am unable to find any load data on these bullets. So i ended up trying to piece together something from what other people did.. not the brightest but wanted to play with the machine and dont mind pulling the bullets and starting over. Will be shooting from a glock 17 and ruger e9. They pass the plunk test in each gun. However my other 124gr ft store bought bullets are an overall length of 1.100. Does the recipe below pose a serious pressure concern?

berrys 124gr hbfp tp
5.2grain unique
Cci small pistol primer
Over all length was 1.065
 
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That feels sorta hot to me.

My Speer manual lists 5.2 grains of unique as the max load for some 124 gn jacketed bullets and 4.1 gn for some round nose lead (unplated) bullets. My newer Hornady book shows a max load of 5 gn on some 124 gn jacketed bullets but has no plain lead data.

I'd suggest Accurate powders -- they publish load data for a raft of bullets including Berry and Rainier. The powder measures excellently and burns very cleanly and their manual is free: Load Data « Accurate Powders

Using published data would be the right way to got in my opinion. For the Accurate powders, they list a COAL of 1.060" with your exact bullets and their powders. As for the length though, assumptions aren't your friend when blowing something up in your hand though.

powder.png
 
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bbbass

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Hmmmm, not a FP shooter cept when I used to shoot .40SW but FWIW

Berry's plated load similar to the Xtreme plated AFAIK and despite neither of those providing much guidance other than to say load them a bit hotter than lead and less hot than jacketed, they do load very similar to Lasercast Silver Alloy.

My Lasercast manual only shows a 122gr FP which may or may not have a similar profile to your Berry's. It lists OAL for their 122gr as 1.070. So, my guess is they are keeping them shorter than a round nose. I load my 115gr round nose at 1.10 OAL for instance. I'd say shoot them and if they are not showing signs of pressure or are wildly inaccurate your good to go.

On the subject of powder for your load, the Lasercast manual is giving 5.2gr of Unique as a min and 5.8gr as a max for a 124gr bullet.

Note: You may wish to invest in a Dillon case gauge... the plunk test is very good, but with the case gauge you can tell if the OAL is too long by if the bullet sticks up past the level of the gauge.
 
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...
Berry's plated load similar to the Xtreme plated AFAIK
...
On the subject of powder for your load, the Lasercast manual is giving 5.2gr of Unique as a min and 5.8gr as a max for a 124gr bullet.
...
I use the Berry's load data for similar Xtreme bullets and haven't blown up my hand yet. ;-)

The Lasercast info is interesting. Maybe my gut reaction was on the conservative side.
 

Mikej

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I'd like to ask how/where @Tonyguerreiro got the recipe for Unique at 5.2gr for a I24gr flat point PLATED bullet?

Hmmmm, not a FP shooter cept when I used to shoot .40SW but FWIW

Berry's plated load similar to the Xtreme plated AFAIK and despite neither of those providing much guidance other than to say load them a bit hotter than lead and less hot than jacketed, they do load very similar to Lasercast Silver Alloy.

My Lasercast manual only shows a 122gr FP which may or may not have a similar profile to your Berry's. It lists OAL for their 122gr as 1.070. So, my guess is they are keeping them shorter than a round nose. I load my 115gr round nose at 1.10 OAL for instance. I'd say shoot them and if they are not showing signs of pressure or are wildly inaccurate your good to go.

On the subject of powder for your load, the Lasercast manual is giving 5.2gr of Unique as a min and 5.8gr as a max for a 124gr bullet.

Note: You may wish to invest in a Dillon case gauge... the plunk test is very good, but with the case gauge you can tell if the OAL is too long by if the bullet sticks up past the level of the gauge.
Funny how the recipes printed can be so different from one source to the next.

The Lyman 49 book shows Unique at 4.5-5.0 grs for a Jacketed HP that should be similar in profile to a flat point. so I'd say it's pretty warm for a plated bullet.

I'd recommend comparing the loads with factory, as far as report and recoil?
 

bbbass

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I'd like to ask how/where @Tonyguerreiro got the recipe for Unique at 5.2gr for a I24gr flat point PLATED bullet?



Funny how the recipes printed can be so different from one source to the next.

The Lyman 49 book shows Unique at 4.5-5.0 grs for a Jacketed HP that should be similar in profile to a flat point. so I'd say it's pretty warm for a plated bullet.

I'd recommend comparing the loads with factory, as far as report and recoil?
Jacketed boolitts require a diff recipe than both lead and plated. The reason is that the jacket has more grip/resistance on the crimp when fired, and is slower going down the barrel, causing more pressure.

I'd trust the Lasercast manual that I quoted, and load Xtremes from their tables all the time. Thick plated might be slightly different, but not enough to cause tremendous worry. That's why I'd put 5.2gr as the starting point. IMO Lyman is being pretty conservative with that recommended load. Be interesting if they had a load for plated bullets or lead bullets of the same weight.
 
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Sounds like these guys have you on the way.

Flat point Bullets will more than likely have a shorter OAL, because they're flat on the end and won't extend out as far as the round nose variety.

As far as powder charge, it's always a good idea to start out on the low end and work your way up.
 
OP
Tonyguerreiro
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I'd like to ask how/where @Tonyguerreiro got the recipe for Unique at 5.2gr for a I24gr flat point PLATED bullet?



Funny how the recipes printed can be so different from one source to the next.

The Lyman 49 book shows Unique at 4.5-5.0 grs for a Jacketed HP that should be similar in profile to a flat point. so I'd say it's pretty warm for a plated bullet.

I'd recommend comparing the loads with factory, as far as report and recoil?
The old man i got all the reloading stuff said to start at 5.2 and stop at 5.6 hes a close friend and not a crazy stranger so i trust his judgement. I also seen the recipe from various forums while searching for berrys load data. Some people going up to 6 grains. But once again the data seems to vary quite a bit from each person or book. the seating depth on this load seems to vary quite a bit as well.. So i was a little nervous and figured id ask around to see what people thought? iv seen a few posts with seating as low as 1.060 to 1.200. Im really new to this Seems like everyone has a personal preference. I am looking for something that works safely for an average load using the left over materials i was given.
 
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The old man i got all the reloading stuff said to start at 5.2 and stop at 5.6 hes a close friend and not a crazy stranger so i trust his judgement. I also seen the recipe from various forums while searching for berrys load data. Some people going up to 6 grains. But once again the data seems to vary quite a bit from each person or book. the seating depth on this load seems to vary quite a bit as well.. So i was a little nervous and figured id ask around to see what people thought? iv seen a few posts with seating as low as 1.060 to 1.200. Im really new to this Seems like everyone has a personal preference. I am looking for something that works safely for an average load using the left over materials i was given.
The Western Powder book I excerpted above, lists 1.060 as the seating depth for the exact Berry bullet you have. At 1.065 I suspect you're fine, especially with the data @bbbas got out of the Lasercast book showing a starting weight at 5.2 gn. Add that to you're friend's advice and your knowledge about him, and if it was me, I'd shoot 'em. Of course, I've been known to be wrong! ;-)
 
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The Western Powder book I excerpted above, lists 1.060 as the seating depth for the exact Berry bullet you have. At 1.065 I suspect you're fine, especially with the data @bbbas got out of the Lasercast book showing a starting weight at 5.2 gn. Add that to you're friend's advice and your knowledge about him, and if it was me, I'd shoot 'em. Of course, I've been known to be wrong! ;-)
One other thought -- if you are concerned about the length, you can always run them through the seater die again after adjusting it -- too long is easy to remedy. Too short, though, that's a different matter so make very fine adjustments.
 
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ageingstudent

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I use the Berry's load data for similar Xtreme bullets and haven't blown up my hand yet. ;-)

The Lasercast info is interesting. Maybe my gut reaction was on the conservative side.
And FYI I have experimented extensively with FN plated projectiles with similar profiles and wieghts in .40 S&W in my Shield and a Sig p226...HSM, Rainier, Xtreme, Berry's vs. a same weight xtp hp jacketed. Very little if any difference across the chrony and only minute differences in POI even out to 25 yards. I was really expecting more of a difference somewhere but it never showed up. About the only thing I learned from the whole experience was that my shield likes rounds traveling at about 900 ft per second. No matter the bullet powder or primer combo a round traveling at around 900 feet per second shot great.
 

Mikej

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The old man i got all the reloading stuff said to start at 5.2 and stop at 5.6 hes a close friend and not a crazy stranger so i trust his judgement. I also seen the recipe from various forums while searching for berrys load data. Some people going up to 6 grains. But once again the data seems to vary quite a bit from each person or book. the seating depth on this load seems to vary quite a bit as well.. So i was a little nervous and figured id ask around to see what people thought? iv seen a few posts with seating as low as 1.060 to 1.200. Im really new to this Seems like everyone has a personal preference. I am looking for something that works safely for an average load using the left over materials i was given.
You old man is certainly trustworthy in your eyes, (as long as he didn't pass away due to a double charged round ;)). And these folks around here are some of the finest people I've had the pleasure to read and meet and I trust them fully to give me solid info. With that being said, I verify all of my loads by books and/or on line written sources also. Someones recommendation from HERE sends me to books and on line sources for confirmation. Using information gathered, and knowing what goes on inside that chamber and shell is a key part of it too.
 
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Mikej

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Jacketed boolitts require a diff recipe than both lead and plated. The reason is that the jacket has more grip/resistance on the crimp when fired, and is slower going down the barrel, causing more pressure.

I'd trust the Lasercast manual that I quoted, and load Xtremes from their tables all the time. Thick plated might be slightly different, but not enough to cause tremendous worry. That's why I'd put 5.2gr as the starting point. IMO Lyman is being pretty conservative with that recommended load. Be interesting if they had a load for plated bullets or lead bullets of the same weight.
No doubt about that. If Laser Cast has a load, you know that they prepared it and it was safe. And yeah, everything I read and hear says the manuals are more conservative these days than they were 50 years ago. I would suspect that you could increase all these loads by 50% and not blow your guns up. But I'M NOT going to do it. And don't recommend anyone else does. I go by the published loads for the majority of loads. And recommend a noobie does too. :) At least until they get a good feel for what's going on.



We should clarify to the OP that jacketed bullets can handle the highest velocity, where plated bullets, due to the plating not being as thick, or attached to the lead core as solid, may not handle the high velocity/pressure without the plating stripping off before or just as the bullet leaves the barrel. And lead/cast/alloy bullets, depending on alloy/harness can not take pressure and temperatures as extreme as plated and jacketed. Therefor lead/alloy bullets are generally run at lower pressure/velocity. No need to bring gas checks into it at this point.

I didn't want to introduce THAT whole can of beans to this thread because the OP is just getting started.
 

bbbass

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Berry's
Frequently Asked Questions


Where can I find load data for your bullets?

Load data from any load manual or website can be used. Full-metal jacketed, lead bullet, or plated bullet load data can be used as long as the following standards are adhered to:

  • The data contains the correct grain weight of bullet.
  • Berry's max recommended velocity is not exceeded. (This info is displayed on bullet boxes and product webpages.)
    • Standard Plate Bullets Max Velocity: 1,250 fps.
    • Thick-Plate Bullets (TP) Max Velocity: 1,500 fps.
  • Do not over-crimp the bullet. Crimping so tight that bullet deformation occurs, or plating is separated causing visible exposure of the lead core will cause tumbling, key-holing, and reduced accuracy.

Load data containing bullet descriptions such as Plated (P,) Berry's Bullet (BERB,) Total Metal Jacket (TMJ,) Copper Plated (CP,) or CPJ (Copper Plated Jacket,) refers to plated bullet data.

Cartridge Overall Lengths (COL) are found in the load data being used. DO NOT EXCEED SAAMI MAX COL SPECS.

For SAAMI MAX COL specs please click HERE.
(Edit: COL/OAL for 9mm Luger is listed as 1.000 Min, 1.169 Max)

Here are websites with load data information:

Hodgdon Reloading | Home

Load Data « Accurate Powders

Alliant Powder - Reloader's Guide
 
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Mikej

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That seems like a lot of spread.
It really is a unique powder considering the many calibers it's listed for. Unique qualities?

I have unique in the stable. I didn't really care for unique, it seemed dirty in the calibers I tried it in. It didn't measure all that well being a flake powder. But I still keep a couple #s, or so, around....because its,,,:rolleyes:,,,,Unique!
 

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