IIIa vest with best coverage

titsonritz · Dec 18, 2021

Alexx1401 said:
You must have the person I responded to on ignore so you can't see what I was responding to. This is what he asked:

"Who do I tell if I think a LEO is delusion and dangerous the public? I know this guy with a strange affinity for antagonism. All he ever wanted to be was an annoyance and people's enemy."

I have to guess he is trolling but, figured what the hell. Just in case he really wanted an answer. Has noting to do with Soft Armor but threads here often "drift". I was responding to an LEO here about how I liked the vest he recommended to me a good while back. Thought "maybe" this was why the guy came up with his question but who knows. It is the net after all

I was more answering to him than you. But yeah... :s0092:

American123 · Dec 18, 2021

Longwalkhome said:
About every cop killed on duty is wearing body armor. While there are plenty of cops saved by body armor it still isn't 100% protection and they use the best armor they can find.

That's the problem with the human head/neck and major blood vessels in the neck, they are important to keep living and they aren't often protected.

Alexx1401 · Dec 18, 2021

American123 said:
That's the problem with the human head/neck and major blood vessels in the neck, they are important to keep living and they aren't often protected.

Your gut is one of the worst. A vest made to allow you to function can not cover your lower gut. Anyone shot there who lived can tell you they often wanted to die while waiting to be healed. VERY nasty place to get shot. Sadly we still lose a lot of LEO's even with how far the tech has come with Vests but, hell of a lot of them are still this side of the sod due to having one when they needed it. It's why I choose to wear one even though I do not have too. Hopefully I never have to put it to the test :s0140:

CamoDeafie · Dec 19, 2021

Lets see.

Soft 3A armor, sufficient to protect against 80% of threats, sorta light, can cover a lot, but still doesn'r cover "everything" (head, neck, groin, legs)...
Unless you go overt like the Military does with the helmet, neck guard, shoulder/upper bicep guard, dick flap, and end up being a turtle with very little mobility (may as well as throw in 2 main rifle plates and 2 side plates while we're at it!)

Problem?

Quite spendy for the quality and the NIJ certified or reputable brands. I don't know why people still support SafeLine Defense when they are not NIJ certified, and for the prices they're asking...

I'd sooner support Midwest Armor and Stealth Armor Systems as they do have armor models that are on the NIJ certified products list and uses tried and true Aramid/Kevlar fibers for the armor as well as the newer Dyneema stuff.

Relatively... Level IV Standalones can be had for NIJ certified plates from $115-130 each for Body Armor Outlet's 4401SH 10x12s, to $260 a set of RMA 1155 Multicurves (not NIJ because NIJ only rates 1 model of a whole range, the 1155 single curves are NIJ certified); to $220+ for HighCom 4S17Ms depending on size (Large SAPI multicurve are $240 each plate).

Try finding "In Conjunction With" Level 3 or 4 plates that are as affordable, and not used/surplus.

For most people, yes soft armor is really more useful but they are not as affordable as the hard plates available.

You can uparmor the basic plate carrier by getting soft armor cummerbunds, abdominal armor, neck/torso armor, dick flaps, and so forth.
Actually you could also go simple and put side plates on the combination, and then just dick flap/abdominal armor and neck armor along with helmet if you're going overt.

American123 · Dec 19, 2021

Alexx1401 said:
Your gut is one of the worst. A vest made to allow you to function can not cover your lower gut. Anyone shot there who lived can tell you they often wanted to die while waiting to be healed. VERY nasty place to get shot. Sadly we still lose a lot of LEO's even with how far the tech has come with Vests but, hell of a lot of them are still this side of the sod due to having one when they needed it. It's why I choose to wear one even though I do not have too. Hopefully I never have to put it to the test

All true, the gut is exposed, and while the spine is in the other side of it, the gut isn't the 1 shot stop that the T-Box is. There's a lot of training around avoiding making your head the visible target to incoming bullets because there's no armor there and it's often deadly.

Alexx1401 · Dec 19, 2021

American123 said:
All true, the gut is exposed, and while the spine is in the other side of it, the gut isn't the 1 shot stop that the T-Box is. There's a lot of training around avoiding making your head the visible target to incoming bullets because there's no armor there and it's often deadly.

Bob and weave if being shot at

American123 · Dec 19, 2021

Alexx1401 said:
Bob and weave if being shot at

I remember reading an article/study about police gunfight encounters. The number of times a policeman was killed by a relatively untrained person was statistically a lot higher than they thought it should be per the numbers, so basically they looked into it analytically and found that a lot of bad guys were basically just point shooting at short distances and they also were finding that the movement tactics of officers were leading to their heads being the primarily exposed part of their body to the gunman during the gunfight. Basically they were presenting their most fatal part of their body as the only target of opportunity and the result the gunman was shooting at what was available and hitting it often enough for it to be looked into more deeply.

They gave examples of officers looking over the top of cover/concealment as typically more likely to get hit in the head compared to moving laterally to the left or right and looking that way. There a strange counterintuitive issue about how by exposing potentially more of your body by looking left or right around cover and concealment it reduces the likelihood your head becomes the sole focus of gunfire.

This doesn't apply to extended ranges with rifles where you want the smallest target possible for the enemy to hit, though it would still be a good idea to look around cover as opposed to over cover and obviously silhouetting yourself, but at short distances with pistols, it was interesting to consider.