Biden admin wants 200 grizzlys in North Cascades Nat'l Park

[Tlock]

Use the 3S rule.
Shoot
Shovel
Shut-up
Works for wolves too.

I would never do that!

 

[HighlandLofts]

It actually works on anything that you don't agree with.
I wouldn't waste my time digging a
hole, the first and third S,s is my options.
I'm immune to using a shovel.
In real life other animals will eat off of any dead carcass so nothimg goes to waste.

 

[whiskeybill]

Being a Native Montanan, I can attest that Grizzlies were not a thing in central / eastern Montana since the days of settlement. The Lewis & Clark expedition had encountered them on the lower Missouri River in 1803 near the sight of present day Fort Peck. When I was growing up, they were pretty much only in the vicinity of Yellowstone or Glacier. Grizzlies have recently moved from the Beartooth mountain range into the Pryor Mountains south of Billings, with at least two having taken up residence. The attached article has a Grizzly sighted in central Montana near Lewistown. Another sighting even further east in the area of the C.M Russell Wildlife Refuge (The Missouri Breaks) was reported in the Billings Gazette recently. These bears are not planted, they are on the move. There are healthy populations of Grizzlies in northwest Montana and the Panhandle of Idaho, as well as British Columbia and Alberta. Just who is to say that they won't move into the North Cascades on their own? It wouldn't surprise me a bit if there are already Grizzlies there.

https://dailyinterlake.com/news/2022/may/03/grizzly-bear-confirmed-central-montana-mountains/

 

[osprey]

Grizzlies and Wolves that move in on there own from naturally established populations are ok with me. Govt. planting them is not Ok with me because they do not have effective management plans written in to deal with burgeoning populations. Hunting wolves and grizz to control populations needs to be part of these plans if they are going to force them on us.

 

[fishfearme]

Ha got me laughing bro!

Use the 3S rule.
Shoot
Shovel
Shut-up
Works for wolves too.

 

[The Heretic]

I know a LOT of people here don't like most predators, especially those (wolves, coyote, bears) that prey on game animals they hunt and/or livestock, or that they think are dangerous to humans (statistically, moose and bison are more dangerous than bears or wolves or cougars).

But I believe and think (there is a difference between the two) that large apex predators have an important place in the environment. Brown bears (and wolves) used to roam much of western USA and they were important to the health of their prey.

So I look forward to having the wilderness more wild by having the predators it once had in its natural state.



That said, I am sure I will get a lot of negative feedback for this - so have at it. I am used to it. Just don't expect me to waste time arguing about it.

 

[Tlock]

I know a LOT of people here don't like most predators, especially those (wolves, coyote, bears) that prey on game animals they hunt and/or livestock, or that they think are dangerous to humans (statistically, moose and bison are more dangerous than bears or wolves or cougars).

But I believe and think (there is a difference between the two) that large apex predators have an important place in the environment. Brown bears (and wolves) used to roam much of western USA and they were important to the health of their prey.

So I look forward to having the wilderness more wild by having the predators it once had in its natural state.



That said, I am sure I will get a lot of negative feedback for this - so have at it. I am used to it. Just don't expect me to waste time arguing about it.

I haven't had my coffee yet.....to be continued

 

[Bobbygun]

I know a LOT of people here don't like most predators, especially those (wolves, coyote, bears) that prey on game animals they hunt and/or livestock, or that they think are dangerous to humans (statistically, moose and bison are more dangerous than bears or wolves or cougars).

But I believe and think (there is a difference between the two) that large apex predators have an important place in the environment. Brown bears (and wolves) used to roam much of western USA and they were important to the health of their prey.

So I look forward to having the wilderness more wild by having the predators it once had in its natural state.



That said, I am sure I will get a lot of negative feedback for this - so have at it. I am used to it. Just don't expect me to waste time arguing about it.

Let me guess. You're either:
1) Not a hunter
2) An awesome hunter or
3) Someone with access to some really great private land to hunt


Me:
1) Old
2) Hard of hearing
3) Tired of eating tag soup instead of elk and deer.

 

[The Heretic]

Let me guess. You're either:
1) Not a hunter
2) An awesome hunter or
3) Someone with access to some really great private land to hunt


Me:
1) Old
2) Hard of hearing
3) Tired of eating tag soup instead of elk and deer.

1) I don't hunt anymore because my health problems don't allow it. If I could, I would - hunt elk.
2) I am a poor hunter - but I am not sure what that has to do with this issue?
3) I don't hunt to kill things, I hunt because I enjoy it, and because it provides food (although, I don't care for venison - I do like elk, bison, rabbit, pheasant, duck, turkey meat - I would usually give any venison to my parents but they are gone now).
4) I can hunt on my own land, if I wanted to - I have deer here. It would be easy to hunt them because they come right past my house - but like I said, I don't care for venison. I would only hunt them if I had to (SHTF).

 

[Bobbygun]

I am a poor hunter - but I am not sure what that has to do with this issue?

I believe the impact of additional predators is felt more by poor hunters and those of us that can't get into (or get a downed animal out of) the places we used to go due to age, health, etc. There will still be game out there for those who want it bad enough and are able/willing to pay the price physically and/or financially.

 

[Andy54Hawken]

Just because an animal or plant was in any area historically...
Is no reason to re-introduce it to that area.

Time and the land itself has changed since the plant or animal was there originally.
Point being here...
What was once able to survive and thrive 100 , 200 or however many years ago...
Does not mean that it will do the same now.

Research and care must be taken to ensure that a re-introduced plant or animal has both
a chance to survive / thrive as well as an actual role to play in today's area.
Andy

 

[Tlock]

Just because an animal or plant was in any area historically...
Is no reason to re-introduce it to that area.

Time and the land itself has changed since the plant or animal was there originally.
Point being here...
What was once able to survive and thrive 100 , 200 or however many years ago...
Does not mean that it will do the same now.

Research and care must be taken to ensure that a re-introduced plant or animal has both
a chance to survive / thrive as well as an actual role to play in today's area.
Andy

Thank you Andy....well put

 

[Hemlock]

1) I don't hunt anymore because my health problems don't allow it. If I could, I would - hunt elk.
2) I am a poor hunter - but I am not sure what that has to do with this issue?
3) I don't hunt to kill things, I hunt because I enjoy it, and because it provides food (although, I don't care for venison - I do like elk, bison, rabbit, pheasant, duck, turkey meat - I would usually give any venison to my parents but they are gone now).
4) I can hunt on my own land, if I wanted to - I have deer here. It would be easy to hunt them because they come right past my house - but like I said, I don't care for venison. I would only hunt them if I had to (SHTF).

The hunting camp I used to belong to had a plaque above the door. "The experience is what matters. The trophy is only the excuse."

 

[osprey]

As Andy alluded to, the land has changed. This is mainly due to man's impact/encroachment on it and what used to be good habitat for these predators is not necessarily compatible with these virtuous plants. As I stated before, if they expand on their own, from naturally occurring populations, it is probably meant to be and the land and other critters, including man, probably can abide.
However spending our tax dollars to put square pegs in round holes is folly and ends up costing us even more in the long run. Wolves have already cost Western state taxpayer's plenty because of depredation of livestock and lost revenue from hunting. They need to take a hard look at the lands carrying capacity of these predators and the compatibility with the animals already here including man! As a tax payer, I resent having to pay professional hunters and trappers to take out "problem predators". As a hunter and taxpayer, I also deplore lost hunting opportunities and the lack of inclusion of hunting as a tool to control these predator populations. If they are going to plant them, there needs to be a plan in place to allow hunting of these predators to control populations written into the plan. Hunting of these predators should be triggered by meeting realistic recovery goals set by science not by what makes them feel good. Hunting of these predators should not be a knee jerk reaction afterthought.

 

[Tlock]

As a tax payer, I resent having to pay professional hunters and trappers to take out "problem predators"......well that hurts! We are people too

 

[Bobbygun]

As a tax payer, I resent having to pay professional hunters and trappers to take out "problem predators"......well that hurts! We are people too

Gotta be honest. When I read that post, my first thought was: Tlock.

 

[Tlock]

Gotta be honest. When I read that post, my first thought was: Tlock.

Being effective at going in and targeting a specific animal causing a problem isn't a easy thing to do. Not everyone can do it....it takes a special skill set and years of experience. We are the csi of the animal crime scene world. We arnt just a bunch of rednecks running around with cool guns and thermals.....OK so I lied We are!

 

[Jcon268]

Wonder how many neon clothed hikers will have to be mauled before it's determined it's a bad idea again.

Have they tried talking to the bears yet? I've heard you can get on their good side by just getting to know them better.

 

[Jcon268]

View attachment 1744187

Or if you're a redneck Russian, it seems like they get a lot of free passes from bears. Never figured out how they can keep a bear as a friend/pet.

 

[The Heretic]

Have they tried talking to the bears yet? I've heard you can get on their good side by just getting to know them better.

Their good "side" is the inside of their tummy - from their POV anyway.