Vaccination nuts like these need to be stopped.

[ma96782]

Waking up in the morning is dangerous. Does that keep you in bed all day?
I have had a family friend that was fiercely independent and lived on his own. Found dead on the crapper. Nearly 90 years old.

We can all find exceptionally tragic occurrences that fit our narrative, you found yours. Congratulations.

Read his Death Certificate?

Maybe.....his death was due to Covid-19.

Yeah.....


YES.....I believe in choice.....it's up to YOU how you live your life. Though IMHO and for the record.....

If YOU choose unwisely.....it's on YOU.

Ask Siri (or Alexa).

"What are the FREE government programs available to those who have caught Covid?"

Yeah......the vaccine has been available for a long time now. Pleanty of time to decide.

OK, Ok, ok......
Not to mention that individuals may have a medical reason (or maybe a religious reason, etc...) why they shouldn't take the vaccine. So, YES of course.....if in doubt......contact your own doctor/clergy/etc... for advice.

BTW....I went to a case where the old guy passed away while taking a $h^#. It's called.....

"The Dump of Death"

NOT a technical term. But effective for describing the cases.

But then......so?
Did you read the thread about where the OR Health Dept reported 9 deaths (people aged 65 to the eldest being 95 years old)......case #2904 to #2812?

Source: www.Oregon.gov/oha

Rrrrright......all 9 died from Covid-19 (while having under laying health conditions).



Aloha, Mark

 

[BBQ Guy]

Read his Death Certificate?

Maybe.....his death was due to Covid-19.




Aloha, Mark

Happened long before the virus BS....

 

[ma96782]

Happened long before the virus BS....

OMG......



Aloha, Mark

 

[Natorade92]

I got vaxxed because my cardiologist said I should, and she has my confidence. Given that we check all the boxes for dying of it, vax is the lesser evil.

It most certainly is not. You have no idea of the long term effects of an experimental MRNA injection and neither does your cardiologist.

 

[Bob D]

It most certainly is not. You have no idea of the long term effects of an experimental MRNA injection and neither does your cardiologist.

We also don't have any idea about the long-term effects of a novel virus less than two years old. We do however know the short-term effects of both, and the decades of experimental research into mRNA vaccines. I weighed the pros and cons with my doctor, and it was an easy decision for me and my family to roll the dice on the vaccine rather than rolling the dice on the virus. Every treatment method we rely on was experimental once.

I firmly believe in freedom of personal choice where vaccines are concerned, and I also firmly believe in the freedom of a community and its duly-elected leadership to enact safety regulations regarding communicable diseases, and the freedom of every business to enact and enforce their own rules where employee and customer safety are concerned. Not getting vaccinated for this disease will probably wind up being a pretty large inconvenience to those who choose that option, but that's sometimes the result of sticking to our convictions when the majority of society goes the other direction. Decisions have consequences either way.

 

[Natorade92]

We also don't have any idea about the long-term effects of a novel virus less than two years old. We do however know the short-term effects of both, and the decades of experimental research into mRNA vaccines. I weighed the pros and cons with my doctor, and it was an easy decision for me and my family to roll the dice on the vaccine rather than rolling the dice on the virus. Every treatment method we rely on was experimental once.

I firmly believe in freedom of personal choice where vaccines are concerned, and I also firmly believe in the freedom of a community and its duly-elected leadership to enact safety regulations regarding communicable diseases, and the freedom of every business to enact and enforce their own rules where employee and customer safety are concerned. Not getting vaccinated for this disease will probably wind up being a pretty large inconvenience to those who choose that option, but that's sometimes the result of sticking to our convictions when the majority of society goes the other direction. Decisions have consequences either way.

Do you not realize that the entire testing system for this so-called pandemic is entirely rooted in a lie? The CDC itself cannot produce an isolated sample of covid 19 to be studied, which means it cannot be accurately tested for. Their test can't be trusted to tell the difference between covid and the flu, one coronavirus from another which means the delta variant can't be accurately tested for either.

Coronaviruses are seasonal, like the flu. Why are the flu numbers down 95 percent from last year? You're being lied to. And now we know vaccinations don't protect you from transmission and in most cases are making cads of what is being called covid wose. Now we are being told boosters are going to be needed, in some cases up to 10 a year for a disease that has a 99.99% survival rate if you have no comorbidities.

This entire "pandemic" is a sham. Its a lie. Easily disproved. A trojan horse for fascism through medical enforcement.

 

[Bob D]

I have heard all those things from some of the more paranoid people I know, but I'm not sweating about it. I hope that it is, as it appears to be, mostly untrue.

There are some who are convinced things are as you say, but my Doctor is not one of them. Here is some information from sources you probably think are lying to you. I'm not invested in convincing anyone of anything, and many studies have proven that showing people information that disagrees with their beliefs only entrenches the beliefs they already have, so do with it as you like. Maybe someone else who comes across this might start thinking about it.

Do you not realize that the entire testing system for this so-called pandemic is entirely rooted in a lie? The CDC itself cannot produce an isolated sample of covid 19 to be studied, which means it cannot be accurately tested for.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/lab/grows-virus-cell-culture.html
"On January 20, 2020, CDC received a clinical specimen collected from the first reported U.S. patient infected with SARS-CoV-2. CDC immediately placed the specimen into cell culture to grow a sufficient amount of virus for study.
On February 2, 2020, CDC generated enough SARS-CoV-2 grown in cell culture to distribute to medical and scientific researchers."

Their test can't be trusted to tell the difference between covid and the flu, one coronavirus from another which means the delta variant can't be accurately tested for either.

https://www.reuters.com/article/fac...vid-19-pcr-tests-misinterpreted-idUSL1N2P42U5
"New guidelines from the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) withdrawing their request for Emergency Use Authorization for a coronavirus test introduced in February 2020 do not mean that these polymerase chain reaction (PCR) tests have failed to differentiate between COVID-19 and Influenza, as users online claim. Rather, the agency is advising the adoption of new tests that can check patients for both SARS-CoV-2 and Influenza viruses."

Coronaviruses are seasonal, like the flu. Why are the flu numbers down 95 percent from last year? You're being lied to.

https://www.jhsph.edu/covid-19/articles/no-covid-19-is-not-the-flu.html
"What would you say to someone who insists to you that COVID-19 is 'just the flu'?
'Since December 2019 [as of October 20, 2020], COVID-19 has killed more people in the U.S. than influenza has in the last five years.
Influenza is a significant burden on the population, but COVID-19 has had a vastly larger effect.'"

And now we know vaccinations don't protect you from transmission and in most cases are making cads of what is being called covid wose. Now we are being told boosters are going to be needed, in some cases up to 10 a year for a disease that has a 99.99% survival rate if you have no comorbidities.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMe2110605
"As of June 19, 2021, Covid-19 vaccines are estimated to have prevented 7.2 million infections and 27,000 deaths in England alone. Similarly, in the United States, an estimated 279,000 deaths and up to 1.25 million hospitalizations have been averted as of the end of June 2021."
Sources are cited for these claims at the end of the article.
https://apnews.com/article/fact-checking-970830023526
"Dr. Thomas Giordano, professor of medicine and section chief of infectious diseases at Baylor College of Medicine, said that many people who survive COVID-19 have long-term symptoms, and that people who survive it can spread the disease to high risk patients who will not be as lucky. 'One in 500 people in the U.S. has died from COVID. To try to trivialize it and say it's nothing, it doesn't matter, I think it's just a gross mischaracterization of what we are all living through'."

This entire "pandemic" is a sham. Its a lie. Easily disproved. A trojan horse for fascism through medical enforcement.

You may be right, I'm not doing my own virological research and have no choice but to trust the information coming from the vast majority of those who are. However, it does not appear to be so easily disproved; almost everyone believes that it's happening. Three people I know have died. 10-15 more were hospitalized for more than a week. I don't see that happen during most flu seasons, and I'm no more scared of fascism on this issue than I was when Jenny McCarthy was ranting about fascism from schools requiring polio and MMR vaccines 15 years ago.

I believe that you and those who believe as you do are sincere in your fear surrounding this, and I wish I could help, but from my perspective, it is very obvious that you're being wildly misled to stoke more fear and division.

 

[BrentN]

Pfizer and BioNTech speed up timeline for offering Covid-19 vaccine to placebo volunteers

Pfizer and its partner BioNTech plan to start offering their Covid-19 vaccine to clinical trial volunteers who received placebo several months earlier than initially planned.

www.statnews.com

makes it tough to "follow" the science. Especially when
"companies argued volunteers should receive the vaccines sooner for both ethical and practical reasons."

So I am starting to believe there is no science, only politics. Someone please convince me otherwise.

Plus-

COVID-19 Vaccines

Vaccines are seen as one of the best ways to stop COVID-19. Learn more about the types of vaccines, including the newly approved Novavax.

www.webmd.com

In addition to-
The 2 highest profile humans on earth, POTUS and V-POTUS, stating one year ago, that they would not take the Trump vaccine. One year later, highly encouraging everybody to take the jab. Governors mandating it. And what changed in the interim? Well, we have found that the vaccine is not nearly as effective as we thought. Hmm.



I am not an anti, but what science exactly are we looking at?

 

[BBQ Guy]

I am not an anti, but what science exactly are we looking at?

Depends on whom you are conversing with.
I forgot who said it here at NWFA.
Essentially their statement was you could not have planned to eff all of this stuff up as badly as it currently is.
Which I agree with 10000000%.

Id be easily swayed if there weren't multiple conflicting studies issued daily.
I'd be swayed if the leading agencies in this weren't back tracking on their statements every other week.
I'd be swayed if there was an ounce if transparency to all of this.
I'd be swayed if they actually took the preventive measures needed to stop new variants from entering our country via international travel and border hoppers.

Right now the Ringling Brothers are getting a lesson on how to run a circus.

 

[Bob D]

It's difficult to do, but if possible, it's best to take the politics out of it.

What Trump said and what Biden said aren't important, those are two dudes with two big obvious agendas. One thing they both have in common though; they listened to their doctors and got vaccinated, along with their entire families. So did DeSantis, Abbott, and all the rest.

 

[BrentN]

It's difficult to do, but if possible, it's best to take the politics out of it.

What Trump said and what Biden said aren't important, those are two dudes with two big obvious agendas. One thing they both have in common though; they listened to their doctors and got vaccinated, along with their entire families. So did DeSantis, Abbott, and all the rest.

True, but who exactly put the politics into it? At the onset, the CDC lied and said masks were not necessary. This was a lie to, theoretically, save masks for healthcare workers. We all know honesty is the best policy, but the CDC lied. At the onset, Gov. Brown tried to be deceitful and HIDE the information related to covid-19. Lol, she quickly realized the errors of her ways (aka was advised...) and has been issuing "emergency' orders since. Failure and deceit by the WHO, China cover-up, Wuhan lab investments, Fauci involvement, fact-checker website backtracking. An internet search apparently wants to tell me that patient zero was in Seattle. HA!!! In the last year and a half, can we at least have a study of the effectiveness of masks, scientifically, with a control group? Nope.
Strangely, I am old enough to remember liberals telling me to question authority, it sorta stuck. Now I can't find a liberal anywhere to question any authority.
Oregon is the only state in the union to outlaw mandating vaccines for healthcare workers, the "old" liberal mindset must really irritate Kate.
At last check, DeSantis and Abbott were both for individual choice. I am all for that, sounds like the most political-free answer to me.

 

[revjen45]

"It most certainly is not. You have no idea of the long term effects of an experimental MRNA injection and neither does your cardiologist."
Also recommended by my primary care doc, who in addition to MD has a PhD in molecular biology so I think she groks it.
Given that we (The Beloved and I) both check all the boxes from dying if we catch it the vax is indeed the lesser of evils.
Immediate liklihood of death is a greater evil than possible long term consequences of unknown nature.
Note that my decision was based on the advice of people who have my confidence - not WHO, Fedgov, Fauxcci, Biden, or any other proven liars.

 

[BBQ Guy]

"It most certainly is not. You have no idea of the long term effects of an experimental MRNA injection and neither does your cardiologist."
Also recommended by my primary care doc, who in addition to MD has a PhD in molecular biology so I think she groks it.
Given that we (The Beloved and I) both check all the boxes from dying if we catch it the vax is indeed the lesser of evils.
Immediate liklihood of death is a greater evil than possible long term consequences of unknown nature.
Note that my decision was based on the advice of people who have my confidence - not WHO, Fedgov, Fauxcci, Biden, or any other proven liars.

I can respect this, a lot.
I may not agree with it, but i can respect it.

I think it is fantastic that this thread has not been locked up. Turned nasty. It has been civil, respectful, and educational. Good job on adulting ya'll.

 

[slimmer13]

A fully vaccinated couple that work at my wife's company just both passed away from Covid. They were both severely overweight, as are the vast majority of Covid deaths.

I wish some emphasis was put on the importance of a healthy lifestyle in staving off all disease.

 

[BBQ Guy]

A fully vaccinated couple that work at my wife's company just both passed away from Covid. They were both severely overweight, as are the vast majority of Covid deaths.

I wish some emphasis was put on the importance of a healthy lifestyle in staving off all disease.

That is crazy.
This is exactly why i am hesitant to bother with this medication. If it offers 0-100% efficacy but who knows where you will fall on that scale, why use it?

It requires hard work, sacrifice, and dedication but i choose to live a mostly healthy lifestyle. My personal belief is that it will sustain me more than a medicine cabinet full of pharmaceuticals for a much longer period.

Everyone is free to make their decisions though.

 

[Aero Denezol]

What Trump said and what Biden said aren't important, those are two dudes with two big obvious agendas. One thing they both have in common though; they listened to their doctors and got vaccinated, along with their entire families. So did DeSantis, Abbott, and all the rest.

This is well said. DeSantis has urged the public to get vaccinated, as have other Governors in the South, like Alabama Governor Kay Ivey.

The virus has killed two people in my family and one other is on the respirator. None of them were/are vaccinated. I hate the gun grabbing big government socialists maybe even more than many of you. But this is not a political issue. This is one of those rare times we are forced to come together as a country.

Every time a dozen more people wind up in the ICU and the leadership starts talking lockdown and mandate it hurts our business, and hurts our employees and their marriages and their children.

 

[slimmer13]

Everyone is free to make their decisions though.

Ish. How free are you if you are a healthcare worker or teacher and you have to choose between medical freedom and feeding your kids?

 

[Bob D]

Ish. How free are you if you are a healthcare worker or teacher and you have to choose between medical freedom and feeding your kids?

Same as anybody else; making decisions on careers based on ever-changing requirements and sacrifices of personal freedom.

I know an Army contract is slightly different, but when I signed up I agreed to let them do just about anything they wanted to my body. When I was landscaping, I was actively destroying my back and knees in exchange for money. Now I sit at a desk, and I have to spend an hour a day working out to make sure THAT won't kill me. Some ways of making money require jumping through hoops. There is always the option to find a career in self-employment where you at least get to decide for yourself which hoops are worth jumping through.

 

[slimmer13]

Same as anybody else; making decisions on careers based on ever-changing requirements and sacrifices of personal freedom.

I know an Army contract is slightly different, but when I signed up I agreed to let them do just about anything they wanted to my body. When I was landscaping, I was actively destroying my back and knees in exchange for money. Now I sit at a desk, and I have to spend an hour a day working out to make sure THAT won't kill me. Some ways of making money require jumping through hoops. There is always the option to find a career in self-employment where you at least get to decide what hoops you want to jump through.

I disagree. Traditionally, employers would dictate your speech, dress, etc. The removal of personal belief exemptions for vaccines, is a more recent trend which crosses a line IMO. It's an overreach that enters the territory of bureaucratics making medical decisions. Vaccination status discrimination should be illegal everywhere, like it is in some states.

That seems like a very traditionally liberal position. It is remarkable that so many of them are so lock step with their party, they won't continue to support liberal ideals when their party turns away from them.

 

[ma96782]

Do you not realize that the entire testing system for this so-called pandemic is entirely rooted in a lie? The CDC itself cannot produce an isolated sample of covid 19 to be studied, which means it cannot be accurately tested for. Their test can't be trusted to tell the difference between covid and the flu, one coronavirus from another which means the delta variant can't be accurately tested for either.

Coronaviruses are seasonal, like the flu. Why are the flu numbers down 95 percent from last year? You're being lied to. And now we know vaccinations don't protect you from transmission and in most cases are making cads of what is being called covid wose. Now we are being told boosters are going to be needed, in some cases up to 10 a year for a disease that has a 99.99% survival rate if you have no comorbidities.

This entire "pandemic" is a sham. Its a lie. Easily disproved. A trojan horse for fascism through medical enforcement.

Speaking in GENERAL.

Yeah.....it's all getting so that......

We'll need a medical degree and we'll have to research everything ourselves/personally before we decide stuff.

You can't even TRUST the doctor. He's a friend or supporter of __________? Or went to school at _________? Or has stock in ________? Whatever.

_________________
_________________

Then......
If RESEARCH came out of CHINA. Can we even trust it?

Aloha, Mark