The best all around rifle caliber for hunting

[Captain O]

When it comes to LSWCHP in the .41 Remington Magnum you are better off using a fairly hard cast bullet (about 2% tin in the alloy). This is a 215-grain bullet driven to about 1050 fps. (This allows for variation due in the b/c gap). At approximately 1025 fps, yielding 501.65 foot-pounds of energy.

Ample for penetration and far lower recoil than the Soft Point "hunting loads". It would work well and drive the 215 grain hard enough to gain decent expansion without leading.

 

[Kruel J]

More game animals have been killed with .22LR than any other cartridge!!!

Yep!

 

[DeanMk]

Okay, I really don't know and I don't have a dog in the fight, so to speak. Let me approach this from a sort of reverse angle and hopefully learn something.

What shortcomings would make 30-06 less than the ideal all-around hunting caliber if I could only have one rifle?

Prarie Dogs...if you're huntin' for pelts....also, Squirrels, bumble bees, etc. ( )

 

[Kruel J]

LOL. Yeah, there is such a thing as overkill.

 

[DeanMk]

I know the old story, but Elmer Keith was RIGHT! (He usually was). Both of those loads made the 4" barreled S&W Model 58 perform exactly as needed!

Leave it to someone on the police force to screw it up.

LOL!
I think it was the SWC version of the .41 Mag that helped inspire Skeeter to develop his .44 Special load.
Both have ME's of around 500 f./lbs.


Dean

 

[DeanMk]

I bought my first 41 Mag in the 80's when just about the only ammo available for it was the two listed loads. It really torqued my then wife that I spent so much money on ammo when Pay-Less closed out their sporting goods department, but I got 9 boxes of Remington ammo for less than half price. Most of it was that SWC lead crap. It always leaded up the barrel and was a complete PIA to clean up after. I always wondered if that's why the police ended up with JHPs instead of SWCs.

Something about your story rings a distant, but still familiar bell, so....could be!
Too bad we couldn't interview someone who was a cop back then and used the .41.

 

[teflon6string]

More game animals have been killed with .22LR than any other cartridge!!!

True dat. My grandfather took out more than a few deer from 1940-60 on his farm in Cove Orchard.

 

[FishnhuntOR]

They all do something better than the 06, but none of them do everything as well

 

[Boboclown]

Prarie Dogs...if you're huntin' for pelts....also, Squirrels, bumble bees, etc. ( )

Wait, I thought those were all stuff you hunt with a .50 BMG! <|:•)

 

[orygun]

They all do something better than the 06, but none of them do everything as well

I agree.

 

[Andy54Hawken]

At the risk of boring everyone and sounding like a broken record...

With a traditional muzzleloader you can hunt both small and big game.
I have gotten grouse , rabbit and coyote along with deer , bear and elk with my .54 Hawken rifle.
For small game I just aim for a head shot. ( well coyotes still heart / lung shot if I can )

One can also load a light charge...for instance my normal load for my Hawken is 80 grains of 2F...I have done good shooting with a half charge of 40 grains.

It also helps that I pretty much have been shooting this rifle for almost 20 years now...
I tend to do all my shooting with it , plinking and hunting.
For "all around use " of any rifle , it pays to know it , inside and out ...and just how to shoot it under all hunting conditions.
Again "Best" is subjective...for me its my Hawken.
Andy

 

[DeanMk]

Muzzle loadimg = Hand loading in real time.
At .54 cal, your Hawken is almost the same as 28 gauge....and I wish my own 20 gauge single had a 30-40 inch barrel!

 

[Jamie6.5]

Okay, I really don't know and I don't have a dog in the fight, so to speak. Let me approach this from a sort of reverse angle and hopefully learn something.

What shortcomings would make 30-06 less than the ideal all-around hunting caliber if I could only have one rifle?

The biggest shortcoming of the -06 that I've seen is not from the cartridge but the owners.
That being: Don't overestimate the size/weight bullet you need to do the job.

To wit: Far too many -06 shooters seem to believe they need a 180 grain bullet for elk, and they're sacrificing velocity and therefore flatter trajectories.
A 165gr SBT at 2900FPS makes for fine elk medicine.
Just like the 150gr makes a great deer bullet.

Much closer to the .270 using 150gr/130gr, in that they shoot faster/flatter, but still deliver enough punch.

An -06 is not a 300Win Mag, don't ask it to be one and you won't be disappointed.

And if you want to shoot 180-200gr class bullets, go get a .300 mag of some variety. There's about 3 or 4 to choose from.

 

[Brutus57]

Go old school, make an Atlatl and your own obsidian points, never jams, you can make new ammo on the spot and it's taken woolly mammoths and three toed giant sloths for generations. Most hunters would stll be using them for North American game if that .30-06 Springfield thingy hadn't come along.

Brutus Out

 

[orygun]

The biggest shortcoming of the -06 that I've seen is not from the cartridge but the owners.
That being: Don't overestimate the size/weight bullet you need to do the job.

To wit: Far too many -06 shooters seem to believe they need a 180 grain bullet for elk, and they're sacrificing velocity and therefore flatter trajectories.
A 165gr SBT at 2900FPS makes for fine elk medicine.
Just like the 150gr makes a great deer bullet.

Tradition, that's why the 180gr is soooooooo popular in the 30-06.

I spent a very large amount of time going over every single ballistic table I could find comparing the paths of 165, 168 and 180gr bullets out to 500 yds, specifically focusing on the velocity range the 30-06 will "normally" achieve. While I do agree with Jamie's statement, I found the drop difference minimal and the energy still in favor of the 180gr. The main reason I picked the 180gr had to do with needing a large quantity of ammo in a short time frame, and I wasn't interested in changing bullet weights just before completing a two day shoot. I also load one round for this gun. One bullet that will work for everything, one charge weight so velocities and trajectory don't change.
Traditionally the 180gr just "fits" the 06, but then there wasn't much to choose from between the 150 and 180gr bullets for years. These days we not only have more bullet weight choices, we have so many bullet style/brand choices in factory loaded ammo than ever before.

I was considering testing some 168 gr bullets, but when the Ackley Improved project (and the incredibly long delay associated with it) came along, I began testing all over again with 180 so I could make a direct comparison.
Now 2900fps with a 180gr bullet is what I've got. I'll try again later with the 168 and am curious to see what it will do. I think it could be "the new" weight to get the best out of the "06 case, especially when paired with a fairly tough bullet, again an option not available years ago.

FYI, three very good reasons I had for keeping my "Improved '06" over the same rifle in 300 Win Mag. One more round in the mag. Two inches less barrel (HUGE difference in a blind or even just the tangles we have on the west side of the Cascades) and an honest two pounds less rifle weight. Less rifle weight makes that big, somewhat heavy VX-R tolerable. Even if my 06 was "just" a 30-06, these things would have meant the 300 sits while the '06 hunts.

 

[Jamie6.5]

Tradition, that's why the 180gr is soooooooo popular in the 30-06.

I spent a very large amount of time going over every single ballistic table I could find comparing the paths of 165, 168 and 180gr bullets out to 500 yds, specifically focusing on the velocity range the 30-06 will "normally" achieve. While I do agree with Jamie's statement, I found the drop difference minimal and the energy still in favor of the 180gr. The main reason I picked the 180gr had to do with needing a large quantity of ammo in a short time frame, and I wasn't interested in changing bullet weights just before completing a two day shoot. I also load one round for this gun. One bullet that will work for everything, one charge weight so velocities and trajectory don't change.
Traditionally the 180gr just "fits" the 06, but then there wasn't much to choose from between the 150 and 180gr bullets for years. These days we not only have more bullet weight choices, we have so many bullet style/brand choices in factory loaded ammo than ever before.

I was considering testing some 168 gr bullets, but when the Ackley Improved project (and the incredibly long delay associated with it) came along, I began testing all over again with 180 so I could make a direct comparison.
Now 2900fps with a 180gr bullet is what I've got. I'll try again later with the 168 and am curious to see what it will do. I think it could be "the new" weight to get the best out of the "06 case, especially when paired with a fairly tough bullet, again an option not available years ago.

FYI, three very good reasons I had for keeping my "Improved '06" over the same rifle in 300 Win Mag. One more round in the mag. Two inches less barrel (HUGE difference in a blind or even just the tangles we have on the west side of the Cascades) and an honest two pounds less rifle weight. Less rifle weight makes that big, somewhat heavy VX-R tolerable. Even if my 06 was "just" a 30-06, these things would have meant the 300 sits while the '06 hunts.

The 180 in an -06AI makes a lot more sense than a factory loaded 180 in a standard -06, I'll give ya that!

 

[DeanMk]

Isn't there some principal of aerodynamics that says a long, thin body is superior to a short fat body, when it comes to flying through the air?
Given that, does a 150 gr. bullet from a .270 work any better for long distance shots than a 150 gr. .30-06 bullet?
Maybe that's not a big enough difference in diameter to matter?

Dean

 

[Jamie6.5]

Isn't there some principal of aerodynamics that says a long, thin body is superior to a short fat body, when it comes to flying through the air.
Given that, does a 150 gr. bullet from a .270 work any better for long distance shots than a 150 gr. .30-06 bullet?
Maybe that's not a big enough difference in diameter to matter?

Dean

The 150gr .270 does have a BC advantage over the 150gr '06 bullet, and is slightly flatter shooting at longer ranges IIRC, carrying slightly more energy downrange.

Better BCs are the result of not only better aero profiles but also the increase in sectional density as a weight goes up for a given diameter, making the slug longer.

 

[Captain O]

Isn't there some principal of aerodynamics that says a long, thin body is superior to a short fat body, when it comes to flying through the air.
Given that, does a 150 gr. bullet from a .270 work any better for long distance shots than a 150 gr. .30-06 bullet?
Maybe that's not a big enough difference in diameter to matter?

Dean

Yes. This is why the 6.5 x 55mm Swede was/is such a good man-killer. The American army opted for the 7.62 x 63 (.30-'06 Springfield was initially loaded with a 150-grain bullet) this was done so that he could accurately place a shot and kill a man at 1000 yards (914.4 meters).

 

[orygun]

The 150gr .270 does have a BC advantage over the 150gr '06 bullet, and is slightly flatter shooting at longer ranges IIRC, carrying slightly more energy downrange.

Better BCs are the result of not only better aero profiles but also the increase in sectional density as a weight goes up for a given diameter, making the slug longer.

And another part of the "reasoning" behind choosing the 180gr bullet in an '06. (Sorry, Jamie, I just couldn't resist!) The 147-150gr class of bullet is pretty short in a .30 cal and while it can be blazing fast at the muzzle, it sheds that speed pretty quickly.

IF I were shooting a .270, a round that I have a lot of respect for, I'd likely be shooting a 150gr bullet, and like normal, I'd be pushing it as hard as I safely could. That case has enough capacity to make that bullet move out and that weight/diameter bullet should hang onto it's velocity for a long time.