Is this thread number 432 on this yet?


This is true. Thank you for putting it up and to the others who put up information here and elsewhere too.

It has been ALL over the national AND international news including in the UK newspapers.

It is not some salami theory.

The STORY got more press - mass media coverage when it comes to GUN issues in the last couple of days too. From the left, right and middle mass media.

In fact, MC (Master Card.) specifically THANKED the .gov folks for putting out - putting up some more gun control.

The letter is online in one of a million links.

I am too tired and physically - shaky to post all of those LINKS. The forest fire smoke is really BAD here and I have been ill.

I do not know if the other companies made an OFFICIAL statement/letter like MC did but most likely they did. I saw the MC 'thank you' on several news websites.

The card companies already KNEW and still KNOW what we buy on our cards with all of our OTHER FINANCIAL DATA INFORMATION but as many people said including me - this is MUCH WORSE. They know all of our other DATA too. From a to z!

Side note and it may be too LONG to read for some people.

I always bought NIB firearms.

So I was still on RECORD for all of my Form 4473 paperwork from the late 90's and on.

Back in the late 90's and on, I used a fuel credit card to buy my 15 or so guns back east from my favorite FFL dealer. I paid it off in FULL and never paid one cent in interest for any card EVER in my entire life.

I used that card to buy ALL of my ammunition and a couple of holsters too. I bought my ammunition IN PERSON from 2 stores mainly back east.

I never reloaded so that was NOT listed in my long line of purchases.

I have written about this before when it comes to guns and cards = my own personal purchases.


I SAVED up - set aside my money for MY GUNS and other things in life, charged it, got PLENTY OF REBATES - freebies at the time = FREE GASOLINE, PAID the bill EARLY and IN FULL, win - win to me. Win for my late husband too.

I had 2 cards with my late husband. One that we used OFTEN and got REBATES on.
One used mainly for TRAVEL and got some freebies but that was not used that much.

I closed up those 2 accounts - 2 cards after he died.

I was still getting FREE GAS using those rebates (Coupons from the card company.) up to 5.5 months AFTER he died. I used them up at my local, rural village gas station which was 2.5 miles from my house in the country.

(We had already PULLED and moved our 2 at home fuel tanks - gasoline tanks from our land. One below ground - hand pump NOT electric and one ABOVE gravity fed tank - NOT electric. That old fuel company went OUT of business too. So when we heard that - we used up the FUEL and had them MOVE the tanks BEFORE THEY CLOSED UP and changed names IF they did sell to someone else or had NO buyers for that old county business.)

That was a NOW FORMER fuel card (BIG company!) that had different names in several states way back when that changed banks 2 or 3 (?) TIMES since he originally got it in the middle 60's.

He got the fuel charge card while working when he turned 18 years old. He did work before he was 18 years old but he had no card before he was 18 years old. He used it while working, going to his university, one other school and when he joined the USN. EARLY to middle 60's. He used that one card from the time he was 18 years old until he died at barely 56 years old.

He put ME on it - he asked me FIRST after we got married. NO interest paid ever.

The travel card was one that I got and I put HIM on it - I asked him FIRST. NO interest paid ever.

One thing that I did like was having those REBATES for all of those years from that fuel card! OVER 30 years!

But the way hacking and data leaks go on now - I would not use one now even though you have 'protections' and so forth.

AFTER he died, I used a debit card back east, I decided to get one with one bank account with one of my OLD banks back east. I used it back east and AFTER I moved out west for a time frame.

NO issues. Safe and all of my OLD bankers and 'newer bankers' out west knew me and still KNOW me too. I kept some old bank accounts from back east OPEN for a time frame too. Several years.

I did open an account out west so I established something LOCAL financial wise AFTER I moved out west. I set up a direct deposit with them too.


But once I went to a debit card for a short time frame in years, MANY YEARS AGO, I used cash or a check to buy firearms and/or for firearm STUFF.

As a middle aged (At the time.) widowed lady, I did NOT, not and not want to TRAVEL alone or camp alone or visit property alone with a RE agent carrying a LOT of money on me.

I did use that bank card from BACK EAST - the debit card, I had my check books with me and SOME CASH ON ME but not a LOT of cash due to the fear of ROBBERY even though out here you could and CAN LEGALLY carry a loaded gun in your vehicle and conceal - open carry depending on where you were. That was 20 years ago. We have some newer gun laws out here now too.

(I could OPEN CARRY and it was fairly common in that former state. But I could NOT have a loaded gun in the vehicle, any gun and ammo had to be kept all apart and NO conceal carry ON your body. That R governor kept on lying as you may or may not remember me discussing. HE would ONLY GIVE CCW TO THE PEONS if the head of the FOP and state patrol wanted conceal carry and he NEVER DID sign it or pass it since THEY did NOT want it passed and it was one of the LAST top 7 final NO ccw states in the country at that time. I did NOT move for gun rights for my retirement. I would NEVER move for gun rights ALONE or for ONLY 1 REASON. A Democrat governor finally PASSED and signed CCW laws back in that state SEVERAL YEARS after I moved out west.)

I no longer use that former debit card - I closed up the account after several years and moved the money out west. I did that with all of the accounts back east finally.

Now? My husband pays CASH for firearms, ammunition, etc. And he KNOWS that they know what he buys since his NIB gun/guns get bought from his favorite FFL man. We buy ALL of our ammunition, IF we buy any - we do not need/want any now, LOCALLY and pay CASH. That goes for his reloading supplies - CASH. He does not need/want any item there.

BOTH of us pay for almost everything in CASH and use a check for taxes, utilities, etc. and where we want PROOF OF PAYMENT and not just a cash receipt for our records. I am not worried about carrying SOME extra cash IF he is with me. I still would NOT carry as much if I was traveling ALL ALONE especially at 72 years old now.

I do BELIEVE that CASH SALES all across the country for any firearm or GUN STUFF will even be DEMANDED and checked OFF because the CONTROL FREAKS IN BOTH PARTIES and ANTI GUN FOLKS want everyone to go to a CHICAGO OR IL or FILL IN THE BLANK STATE TYPE OF 'FOID CARD'!

The international news response from many of their control freak LEADERS loved this NEW idea of CARDS being checked off when it comes to ALL PURCHASES of guns and any item firearm related.

IF all of them (Stateside too!) could get what they really wanted - they would get out of CASH SALES and cash payments for everything from A to Z! NOT only in GUN stuff!

That has already been going on for MANY years especially in the EU countries and elsewhere. They want to ELIMINATE CASH.

And they have already traced cards but THIS is much worse.

Another thing going on with the control freaks and IN VOUGE ideas.

FANCIER and newer SMART METERS that are only 10/11 years old (PUT in brand NEW when you built a new house.) are being replaced by even NEWER and smarter (LOL) SMART METERS and for more DATA COLLECTION - readings 3 times in 24 hours in many states too.

They can do a LOT with that DATA plus they can and may charge you HIGHER AMOUNTS during some time frames in a 24 hour time frame IF THEY DECIDE TO DO THIS.

(Texas and other states are doing this NOW. FACT not fiction on rate fees for some of their companies now.)

PLUS the BIG companies could shut you off easily REMOTELY and so forth. They can tell if your power is out supposedly - read meters differently too. That is NOT some theory to be scoffed at.

NW ENERGY in some parts of Montana did this for their ELECTRIC and natural gas line METERS too. These changes were made in most of the larger cities and in other MT towns ALREADY - ones who are NW ENERGY customers.

And if you did NOT want the change - the COMPANY had an option (FINE PRINT!) to charge you more money for some reason (?!?) in the FUTURE if you kept your newer but still GOOD 10/11 year old electric and natural gas SMART METERS too.

I do not have a co-op here. There are good and BAD ones all over the country if you check out their customer service in all ways.

There is a co-op in another part of this county and even in this town too.

I have NW ENERGY and they already changed mine. I spoke to the man who did the electric meter when he was here. I called NWE when I first got a note in my bill envelope to find out more. There was a NOTE on my front door knob too. Warning about a company that was doing work for NWE in my area AHEAD of time. I did not see or hear the gas meter man who made the change. Most likely - we were gone. Two different METER jobs were done on different days - several WEEKS apart.

Take care!

Last Edited:
Pocahontas wants to know.

Rrrrright,'s important to the Democracy.

Aloha, Mark
LIZZY ought to be checking out the MONEY LAUDERING TRAIL stateside and in the UKRAINE even if her NAME may be ON THE LIST with her bank account numbers in some FAR OFF COUNTRY!

Places where you are NOT declared 'bank wise' where even the SWISS CHANGED some of their bank policies!

The SWISS show and tell it all now according to the financial news. OLDER news but it is still kind of new for the SWISS BANKERS compared to the days of OLD.


Yes, Credit card companies track what we buy loosely in categories; currently, firearm retailers are classified as 5999 Miscellaneous retail stores or 5941 Sporting Goods Stores, and that's where it ends. They are creating new specific codes for guns & ammo, and this information is accessible to anyone, specifically the government, without a warrant or..why and how will this be used?

You need to know what they are already keeping..

- Every credit, debit, or check purchase is now kept...forever
-The history of every package sent to you or you sent by USPS, FedX, UPS is kept forever.
-Google keeps every search query you've ever made, and every website and forum is kept forever.
-Every email, post on FB, Instagram, or this forum, even if you deleted it, is kept ...forever.
-Utility usage is kept forever
-phone, email, and text
-Parking, speeding, tickets,

You might recall all those secretive data centers they have built to keep everything! Ultimately to build profiles of all of us and use computers to asses our risk, Risk of what? Anything those in control of the data deem concerning

The problem is, If I can get enough info on any of you and dig through it, I can probably build enough for probable cause of some kind

It's scary.

This administration has been seeking state data and lists of gun owners.

Some sheriffs are refusing.

Top fed data centers

Below represents nearly 2 million sq ft of government data storage run by the NSA. This is not for government agencies to use like the defense department or health department they have their own data centers

-Bumblehive is one of the largest government-owned facilities, costing a whopping 1.2 billion dollars. Its 100,000 sq-ft Tier III data center is used to monitor our nation.

-NSA data center located in Augusta, Georgia, extends over 160 acres of land and 604,000 square feet of facilities

-NSA Fort Meade for an estimated $895.6 million. state-of-the-art supercomputing powerhouse. The facility is over 600,000 sq-ft

-NSA data site on Lackland Air Force Base. Although the site is veiled in secrecy, the building is covered extensively by A/C units and accounts for 470,000 square feet of land.

-The NWSC is Located in Cheyenne, WY, and this data center 170,000 square feet. What is most impressive is the power density of 1,000 watts per square foot, ranking it among the top 1 percent of data centers in the world for efficiency.

-IBM built for government agencies' data center in Boulder, CO. Measuring in at 115,000 square feet,
Do you remember the name of the HUGE one (Data collection site.) that they built in UTAH?

I am not talking about the IRS data processing center where many states that USED to use FRESNO, CA are now forced to use the UTAH ONE.

IT was all over the news several years ago.


I always enjoyed this old movie. NOT so much any longer.

Gene Hackman! Great actor.

(I am DONE with Will Smith.)

A lawyer becomes targeted by a corrupt politician and his N.S.A. goons when he accidentally receives key evidence to a politically motivated crime.

I used to watch this movie several times and, finally, donated the disc to the library.

I watched it many years ago back east too. OFF of an old video tape machine.

Anyway, way back in the late 90's, some people did not even realize what the .gov folks were tracking and HOW they can just shut you down as a bank/credit union can or even CHANGE your name and information on some computer.

There were a couple of films not only OLD books about these matters when it comes to computer whiz kid .gov officials and what many .gov agencies can DO or not do with YOUR information or even what they can SAY about you - true or not to make their case.

Meaning, what THEY can and CHOOSE to call a few guns (One, two to fifteen or twenty.) and several types of RF and CF ammunition in a household and when they CHOOSE to call it an ARSENAL.

Most NON gun folks don't even realize how many rounds come in a simple BULK BOX of 22lr too.

CASH is king!

I think we should pressure banks to add another category: blue and green hair dye.

Gun rights groups along with firearm manufacturers should get together and create a subscription/pay/savings account service similar to paypal. Pay $2/5/10 or whatever a month into a saving account with the service company takes out a 1% fee which would go towards fighting gun control litagation and the rest for you to buy firearm related stuff.

Firearm manufacturers get to promote their products to a large audience interested in firearms and If you miss a payment(s), you simply lose out on specials and discounts.The more purchases or larger amount in your account, the larger the discounts.

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