Smaller Concealed Carry Weapon

[9mmMike]

Looking to get something a little more easy to conceal than my G26. My current conceal options are G26, G19, 2.5" S&W 66, Springfield Champion.

I'm looking at Kahr MK9, Para Carry or PDA 9 (possibly .45), Springfield EMP 9mm.

The compact 1911's are nice (thinner), but grip length is .75" greater than my G26, and the grip length is the hardest part of concealing my Champion. The increase in overall length is almost nothing and doesn't make a difference. The Kahr is small in all ways, and has enough capacity for what I'm wanting, but I'm just not sure of the loooong trigger. I handled and dry fired quite a few today and the trigger just felt really wierd (I like the LDA trigger better). Also, it's really small, and I got rid of a PF-9 as it just hurt too much and I couldn't rely on it. Thye all stainless frame would help.

Just looking for input relative to factors I might have overlooked and maybe others experiences in carrying very small pistols 9mm and larger.

THX

Mike

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[jordanvraptor]

Never fired the PF-9 but I had a Kahr PM9 and recoil on it was very mild and not painful at all.

 

[the4thshake]

Smaller guns are harder to draw from a holster. In a high stress situation you don't wan't want somthing that is difficult to deploy. On the other hand, big guns are harder to make dissappear under your clothing. You have to find a balance between the two that works for you.
I think thickness is a bigger issue then lenght or height. You would be amazed at how well a good quality, properly fitting holster will hide a decent sized handgun.

 

[9mmMike]

I agree, and I do not scrimp on my carry equipment. I've got everything from Crossbreed, to Ted Blocker and Galco, and others... One issue is I do sit a lot so I need the appropriate holster for that, but think I've found it and now just maybe need a slimmer gun, especially for Summertime attire.

 

[PlayboyPenguin]

...I do not find the Kahr MK series that much easier to conceal than the Glock 26/27/33. Especially if you put wood grips on the MK9. Of course I am basing my opinion on the MK40 which is a tad bigger than the MK9. If you really want the easiest to conceal option you might want to look at the PM9 instead of the MK9. The difference between it and the Glock 26 is muck more evident.

 

[PhysicsGuy]

Look at getting a P or PM series Kahr, very light and compact, although you pay a little more than options like the Pf-9, you get quite a bit of gun, and it doesn't set you back as much as an EMP will.

My personal preference is for the PM45

Also do you want to get rid of that 66?

 

[Ben B.]

The Kahr with the +1 mag is about ideal. I use mine for a pocket gun. I think the DA trigger is rather nice, it's smooth and light, it does have some preload so the pull is not cocking the full amount. But if this is for a carry gun, and you are serious, who cares if it has a long trigger? It's a better trigger than most revolvers.

My personal Kahr is the PM40, and while the muzzle blast with CorBon is pretty remarkable, the recoil is not much of concern. I shoot it well and it lives in my pocket. It is perfectly reliable with jacketed ammo and my CorBon DPX, but the feed ramp does not like soft lead bullets. I've even shot the gun in IDPA matches and done well with it.

"Playboyenguin" is incorrect. The MK series and the PM series are the same height, width and length as each other, use the same slides/barrels, same mags, and fit in the same holster. Also the 9 and the 40 are almost the same size, 1 oz heavier, .05" wider and .04" thicker. And any of these are smaller than the G26 in every dimension, except that the metal frame MK9 weighs 3 ounces more than a G26, while the PM9 weighs 5 ounces less than a G26.

 

[MarkSBG]

A high quality holster will make a large difference. I am a slender build and can adequately conceal a G30.

I find that I would rather carry my thicker/heavier/larger G30sf than my G26 because of the holster difference. My G30 has a MiltSparks VMII that makes carrying much easier, while my G26 has a kydex holster which is uncomfortable.

 

[MarkSBG]

Also do you want to get rid of that 66?

And that G19? I carried one for years and LOVED it.

 

[PlayboyPenguin]

"Playboyenguin" is incorrect. The MK series and the PM series are the same height, width and length as each other, use the same slides/barrels, same mags, and fit in the same holster. Also the 9 and the 40 are almost the same size, 1 oz heavier, .05" wider and .04" thicker. And any of these are smaller than the G26 in every dimension, except that the metal frame MK9 weighs 3 ounces more than a G26, while the PM9 weighs 5 ounces less than a G26.

Nope, you are making the mistake of believing the Kahr website which is not correct. They measure the slide only. On the all steel MK series the grip is not integral to the frame and adds quite a bit of width to the body of the firearm. Especially if you add the wooden ones. I have both the PM40 and the MK40 and it makes for a noticeable difference. The polymer frame of the PM40 makes it much slimmer and easier to conceal. Never trust manufacturers creating measuring.

I will try to get out the calipers and the camera when I get home and post a couple pics.

 

[PlayboyPenguin]

All three guns side by side . From left to right...Glock 26, Kahr PM40, Kahr MK40

Glock 26 width


Kahr MK40 width


Kahr PM40 width

 

[cyclesarge]

Do you have a measurement of the MK with the polymer grips. I have no doubt thicker wood grips would make the gun with wood grips thicker.

 

[Ben B.]

I also understand that thicker grips make the grip thicker. I have a Beretta 21a with aftermarket wood grips that measure 34.29 in width, and it still fits well in the pocket. As does the Kahr MK and PM series. The G26 does not. I think that the Kahr guns are at the upper limit in dimensions for a pocket gun.

It remains true that the MK series and the PM series are the same height, slide width and over all length as each other, use the same slides/barrels, same mags, and fit in the same holster.

 

[cyclesarge]

I carry an MK9, in some ways it is too small. It's hard to draw from IWB, though very easy to conceal. I also carry OWB but the weight of the grip becomes evident and the grip tips out, pointing the gun more at my hip. My P239 actually conceals easier on the hip because the longer barrel keeps the grip from sticking out. I don't doubt that a better holster would fix this. I love the MK9 but if I were buying again I'd probably go for a K9 or P9.

 

[Ben B.]

I carry an MK9, in some ways it is too small. It's hard to draw from IWB, though very easy to conceal. I also carry OWB but the weight of the grip becomes evident and the grip tips out, pointing the gun more at my hip. My P239 actually conceals easier on the hip because the longer barrel keeps the grip from sticking out. I don't doubt that a better holster would fix this. I love the MK9 but if I were buying again I'd probably go for a K9 or P9.

Do you use the +1 mags, or the flush fit? I find the flush fit are too small, and I seem to lose nothing in concealability with the +1, while I gain a lot of grip.

 

[9mmMike]

Problem with that is that it adds quite a bit to the grip length, thus taking away one of the dimentional advantages of the MK9. I don't have a problem with the short grip when shooting at all, and another round in the mag is going to only increase grip weight and the tip out that Cyclesarge is experiencing.....

Great pics PP. Really brings to light the discrepancy in width in the frame area rather than just the slide measurement. 7mm is over a quarter inch, correct ?

 

[Ben B.]

Being able to wrap a pinky on grip would help the draw from the IWB. The "tip out" with OWB sounds like a low quality holster problem, if a dinky Kahr does that.

 

[PlayboyPenguin]

Problem with that is that it adds quite a bit to the grip length, thus taking away one of the dimentional advantages of the MK9. I don't have a problem with the short grip when shooting at all, and another round in the mag is going to only increase grip weight and the tip out that Cyclesarge is experiencing.....

Great pics PP. Really brings to light the discrepancy in width in the frame area rather than just the slide measurement. 7mm is over a quarter inch, correct ?

Yeah, 7mm is about .27 inches.

Here are the pics comparing the MK40 with polymer grips to the Glock 26 and PM40. As you can see it is still much closer to the glock than the PM. Take it from someone who actually ons all three guns. The Glock and MK40 are about the same carry experience (especially when you take weight into account) and the PM40 is much nicer. Plus, I cannot imagine why someone would pay the extra money for the very nice all stainless MK series and then leave polymer grips on it. If you want polymer grips get the PM version. The wooden grips not only make it easier to grip but also absorb recoil better.

PS: make sure to refresh your browser for an accurate measure. I forgot to caliberate the calipers before measuring the first time. Just a tiny difference but want to be as fair as possible.

Kahr PM40 w/polymer grips


Kahr PM40


Glock 26

 

[cyclesarge]

Being able to wrap a pinky on grip would help the draw from the IWB. The "tip out" with OWB sounds like a low quality holster problem, if a dinky Kahr does that.

Yeah, it's a Desantis thumb break holster, like 90% of the guns weight is at or above the height of the belt, causing the "tip out", I carry my P239 in the same type of holster but the gun rides a lot lower due to the extra length of the gun, which keeps the gun a lot tighter to my body. I use a pinky extension on the 6 round magazine, I like shooting it better than the longer 7 round mag.

 

[cyclesarge]

Next question for P.P., does the extra weight of the MK over the PM help reduce the recoil? Also you say "The wooden grips not only make it easier to grip but also absorb recoil better.", does this mean you are willing to trade a little width for easier handling?