Discussion in 'General Firearm Discussion' started by tac, Jul 2, 2010.
That was pretty informative!
A good video to promote the shooting sports and pro-gun organizations.
Of course to own any firearm is very difficult in the UK unless you are well connected. All firearms are outlawed in the majority of areas.
Canada and Australia have both been invaded by the same gun control organizations that shut down gun ownership in the UK. Both are dealing with registration issues to own certain types of weapons.
Handguns, semi-auto shotguns/rifles and others have been eliminated from civilian ownership in most areas.
It is amazing to me that Canada that has a very small population and lots of wild dangerous territory has allowed the large metropolitan areas to dictate gun laws. Lack of a Second Amendment and a Bill of Rights is one reason restriction happened so quickly.
In the US the same anti-gun groups have twisted the Constitution and demonized the bill of rights and second amendment to work toward the same outcome. We fight back with all we have, but as populations become more and more urban and dependent on the Government, someday we may lose gun rights here too.
Not meant to offend you but maybe I am not up on the laws in the UK. But it was my understanding that a citizen could not own a handgun to keep in their home or on their person. If you are required to obtain a license and then place said gun in the gun club then thats a lot different from having the ability to take it home for personal potection.
Last I heard from the shooting organizations that I used to read literature from in the UK, they were restricting airguns to club ownership membership also. Not exactly a country that trusts it citizens.
When I drive into Canada I always get the third degree about do I own firearms, how many do I own, do I have any in the vehicle, am I sure! Quite a drill, and I understand that to pack a handgun in the woods for backup is not allowed, rifles only and those must be on some gun registery. I do understand that they are trying to eliminate that registry right now but getting lots of resistance from the anti-gun groups.
Australia picked up most of the handguns for distruction, along with the semi-auto rifles, including the pump shotguns I believe. They can keep the bolt action, lever action and single shot items and maybe single action handguns. But the point is a large portion of the guns folks owned were picked up and destroyed.
So to compare the UK, Canada, and Australia to the laws that currently exist in the US you will find a world of difference.
But I do agree that if that was the only option I had, I too would be a member of a gun club to be able to enjoy the shooting sports, no matter if my firearms were kept locked up at the gun club.
Contrary to popular belief, Firearms are not banned in the UK.
There are certain prohibitions and restrictions though.
What you can't have:-
1) Semi-Automatic, or Self-Loading and Pump action rifles.
These were banned after the 1987 shootings in Hungerford. Tighter restrictions were put on High-Capacity shotguns after this event also.
Strange as this was, because the murderer Michael Ryan actually used a M1 Carbine, an AK and a Browning handgun during his rampage and not a shotgun.
2) Centrefire, or Fullbore and Rimfire handguns.
These were banned after the 1997 school shooting in Dunblane, Scotland.
Killer Thomas Hamilton, a gun club member (and very dubious character) armed himself and entered a junior school and killed 16 children and their teacher before killing himself (as they always do).
What you can have:-You can essentially own most classes of firearms (even the ones listed above) so long as you can provide 'good reason'.
UK Firearms Law has certain classes of Firearms.
These fall under various 'Sections' of the Law.
All firearms are originally classed under Section 1, and then depending on their status, can be reclassfied further.
So What do we have......
Section 1 Firearms.
Black Powder or muzzle-loading handguns.
Black Powder or muzzle-loading rifles.
.22 rifles, including semi-auto, or self-loading.
Centrefire, or fullbore rifles.
Silencers, suppressors and sound moderators.
Short barrelled double barrelled shotguns.
There is no limitiation on high capacity detachable magazines.
Minimum barrel length for a rifle is 12" and minimum overall length is 24".
This means you can have folding stocks as long as the firearm is no shorter than the minimum 24".
High-capacity shotguns are governed by the overall lengths in place for other shotguns.
Therefore minimum barrel length is 24" and minimum OAL is 40".
To acquire a Firearms license, you must be of good character with no recent serious criminal record.
You must also provide 'good reason' for owning each firearm.
These reasons are usually 'being a member of a target shooting club' or 'pest and vermin control', 'deer stalking and management' etc.
Sound moderating items 'suppressors and silencers' are generally permitted because of issues relating to noise pollution and hearing damage etc.
Section 2 Firearms.
Any shotgun with a barrel diameter of less than 2" and a max capacity of 3rds.
Essentially, any double barrelled shotguns or restricted capacity semi-auto's and pumps.
Acquiring a Shotgun License is generally easier than a Firearms license.
Section 5 Firearms.
All other firearms fall in to this category.
This category covers all firearms that are generally prohibited from civilian ownership and includes Handguns and Semi and full automatic firearms.
It also covers gas and pepper spray's and explosive devices.
A Section 5 license is issued by the Home Secretary instead of the Police.
To acquire this license you must have 'a very good reason'.
This is usually only granted to those working in the Security and Military Arms industry.
They can also issued to those that provide arms and training to the cinema and TV industry.
Section 7 Firearms.
Section 7 is reserved of Handguns etc that would generally be prohibited, but for certain historic or other reasons were exempted from general ownership.
Section 7.1 Handguns that can be held at home but are not permitted to be fired.
Section 7.3 Similar to above, but if you wish to acquire permission to shoot these firearms, they must be kept in a secure club, where they must remain .
There is very little restriction on these. You need to show your license to a dealer to purchase.
There are quantity restrictions placed on firearms ammunition.
There is also a further restriction placed on expanding ammo and projectiles. These are only granted for the shooting of live quarry and are not permitted for target shooting, unless zeroing.
Firearms ammunition, as with all firearms and shotguns can be kept at home, but must be locked away securely when not being used.
I believe you can buy a silencer over the counter at the local hardware store for about $50.
No background check.
Can you confirm this Tac?
When I am in Germany, I hang out with a few ex-pats from UK. They were the ones that told me about this.
Of course in the US, if we're not a felon or Chicago resident, once we have the money, we must have a good reason too.
Like "I want one."
I read recently that some citizens of GB seriously want the gun laws reviewed. One reason stated was that they felt it was ridiculous that England's/GB's Olympic pistol team was not allowed to practice at home. They were required to go to France or some-such nonsense.
And a firearm relies on an ignition source and chemical propellant. No amount of muzzle energy turns an airgun into a firearm.
I realize you may only be looking to "enlighten" us ignorant Americans about GB's gun laws, but I am wondering why else this may have been posted here.
Reading the laws, and hearing from other English hunters and shooters elsewhere leads me to believe that these restrictions constitute serious infringements to keep and bear arms. No amount of propaganda is going to convince me that those laws "aren't that bad."
Thank God and the founders for the Constitution, the Bill of Rights and especially the 2nd Amendment.
The notion of having to go down to the police station to buy a new rifle or shotgun leaves me cold.
I'm not slamming your country tac, just it's restrictive gun laws.
I wrote the "ignorant Americans" remark because we are, when it comes to the finer points of domestic policy/laws of other countries. Not a reflection on you or your position. No need to remove any posts as far as I'm concerned, and no apology necessary.
Thanks for the more detailed education. It has reinforced my notion that we still have the best protections against gun restrictions. And it sheds some light on how these restrictions come about and who/what to be wary of.
That's a good thing.
And I'm sorry the UK's gun laws suck like they do, but maybe you can get some "hope and change" going over there and lose some of them!!
Perhaps "uninformed" rather than "ignorant", though being ignorant of what the laws actually are equates to being uninformed. It's just that the term "ignorant" has a fairly large negative indice.
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