Question about concealment (OR & WA)

[h4344]

***Sorry just noticed this is probably in the wrong section.

So i have my CHL class scheduled for the 10th this month but i thought i would ask here ahead of time just because i am curious. (Still gonna ask the instructor of course)

Since both Oregon and Washington both permit open carry and i will have my CHL for both states after my upcoming class (and paying the sheriffs fee of course). Is it an issue for my firearm to be exposed at any time (its a full sized 1911 outside the waistband) by accident while i carry?

I have read some online horror stories that you can possibly lose your CHL if someone informs the police you have a gun and they have you show them your permit. Is that the case or so long as your in a permitted place to carry you simply show your CHL to the officer and go on your way?

EDIT: Took my class and it went very well! I asked my instructor about this and he told me that legally i would be in the green (Oregon) however (He is not an advocate of Open Carry it should be noted) there is always the risk that somebody might notice and notify the police which could needlessly escalate the situation. Being in Portland, i REALLY do not want that attention with the latest events.

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[Camelfilter]

Someone would have to accuse you of drawing your firearm.

If you would happen to shop someplace that prohibits firearms on accident, they would simply ask you to leave (if it were visible). If you did not comply, you could be charged with trespass.

 

[bolus]

***Sorry just noticed this is probably in the wrong section.

So i have my CHL class scheduled for the 10th this month but i thought i would ask here ahead of time just because i am curious. (Still gonna ask the instructor of course)

Since both Oregon and Washington both permit open carry and i will have my CHL for both states after my upcoming class (and paying the sheriffs fee of course). Is it an issue for my firearm to be exposed at any time (its a full sized 1911 outside the waistband) by accident while i carry?

I have read some online horror stories that you can possibly lose your CHL if someone informs the police you have a gun and they have you show them your permit. Is that the case or so long as your in a permitted place to carry you simply show your CHL to the officer and go on your way?

There is a remote chance someone is going to see it and then call the police. its good practice so just work on keeping it concealed Im sure I've "printed" (outline of the firearm noticeable under clothes) but no one has ever said anything. Just try and think of the last time you were paying attention to someones belt line. No one really pays attention to that area.

So dont be worried. Get a good comfortable setup to conceal carry.

Oh, the farther you get outside of Portland, the less concern you will have. I've seen guys open carrying in Fred Meyers in Hillsboro and no one said a thing. But there are plenty of pearl clutchers in Portland who dont even want to be around a police officer carrying a gun.

 

[h4344]

Someone would have to accuse you of drawing your firearm.

If you would happen to shop someplace that prohibits firearms on accident, they would simply ask you to leave (if it were visible). If you did not comply, you could be charged with trespass.

There is a remote chance someone is going to see it and then call the police. its good practice so just work on keeping it concealed Im sure I've "printed" (outline of the firearm noticeable under clothes) but no one has ever said anything. Just try and think of the last time you were paying attention to someones belt line. No one really pays attention to that area.

So dont be worried. Get a good comfortable setup to conceal carry.

Oh, the farther you get outside of Portland, the less concern you will have. I've seen guys open carrying in Fred Meyers in Hillsboro and no one said a thing. But there are plenty of pearl clutchers in Portland who dont even want to be around a police officer carrying a gun.

Thanks for the quick responses! Seems pretty straight forward. So long as i keep it holstered there should not be any issue if im in a place that allows carrying of a firearm (if a cop asks i will of course show my CHL).

To bounce off what Camelfilter said...

Is the actual act of carrying a firearm in a place of buisness that prohibits guns illegal or is it only a problem if they ask you to leave and you refuse? I was under the impression for both states in question you can carry concealed anyplace that is not prohibited by federal law (Federal building, schools, bars, etc). Again i will obviously ask my instructor but as long as im here might as well ask.

 

[bolus]

Thanks for the quick responses! Seems pretty straight forward. So long as i keep it holstered there should not be any issue if im in a place that allows carrying of a firearm (if a cop asks i will of course show my CHL).

To bounce off what Camelfilter said...

Is the actual act of carrying a firearm in a place of buisness that prohibits guns illegal or is it only a problem if they ask you to leave and you refuse? I was under the impression for both states in question you can carry concealed anyplace that is not prohibited by federal law (Federal building, schools, bars, etc). Again i will obviously ask my instructor but as long as im here might as well ask.

they only can ask you to leave. The "no guns allowed" signs dont carry legal weight. Plus, would you want to be unarmed in a place that advertises that it's patrons are easy victims? Another reason why a good conceal carry technique is nice.

 

[Jim Colvill]

Thanks for the quick responses! Seems pretty straight forward. So long as i keep it holstered there should not be any issue if im in a place that allows carrying of a firearm (if a cop asks i will of course show my CHL).

To bounce off what Camelfilter said...

Is the actual act of carrying a firearm in a place of business that prohibits guns illegal or is it only a problem if they ask you to leave and you refuse? I was under the impression for both states in question you can carry concealed anyplace that is not prohibited by federal law (Federal building, schools, bars, etc). Again i will obviously ask my instructor but as long as im here might as well ask.

A business may prohibit firearms but it doesn't have the force of law. If you are asked to leave and fail to do so the most you could be charged with is trespassing. Also, as I understand it, you can carry in bars in Oregon. Basic rule of thumb: concealed carry means concealed.

 

[Camelfilter]

they only can ask you to leave. The "no guns allowed" signs dont carry legal weight. Plus, would you want to be unarmed in a place that advertises that it's patrons are easy victims? Another reason why a good conceal carry technique is nice.

The only difference comes in for folks who open carry. As a private business, they have the right to prohibit weapons (silly I know...). It's still not illegal to be there, they'd have to "trespass" you... Just a whole can of worms I'm not interested in.

It's just easier to remain concealed. Plus the other benefit of concealed, your not the first target in the rare event of bad happenings.

-I'm not against folks who do open carry at all, just my personal feelings on the subject.

 

[PiratePast40]

I believe you were also inferring that anyone can ask to see your CHL. That's not true. You must have it on you and show it to law enforcement if they ask, but not to just any Joe Schmo.

Do yourself a favor and read the state laws concerning concealed carry before your class. You'll have a much better experience if you have some good info to start. You can also go to the OFF web site and buy a copy of the handbook on concealed carry laws in Oregon. Just remember that it's a handbook and was put together with the current laws at the time of printing. We could easily be looking at more new laws at the end of the spring session. It'll be an "emergency"!
Oregon's Gun Laws. A guide for gun owners in the Beaver State.

 

[HuckleberryFun]

Correct me if I'm wrong --and I'm sure you will-- but in Oregon if you open carry you do not have to show ID if an LEO asks unless the LEO suspects you of a crime. If you conceal carry, however, and the LEO asks then you do have to show your CHL.
See this video of a guy open carrying in Eugene when stopped by Eugene PD:

I like it when at the end the cops confer and one says "we better let this one go.. this is one guy that knows his rights."

 

[wired]

In 25 years of open and concealed carry ( but not really caring if I expose myself ) in Oregon and Washington Ive never heard of anyone calling the cops on myself or anyone I knew personally. If the cops show up and you are carrying concealed , for whatever reason people do that sort of thing, just show him your license. Not saying it doesnt happen , it just doesnt happen to me. Then again I wouldnt go to Eugene on a bet. I flat dont like scumbag hippies and consider a Rainbow Family gathering to be nothing short of a target rich environment.

Only reason I have a permit is so I can "carry" in my glovebox. Rest of the time its on my hip if I am actually carrying.

 

[Medic!]

I'd rather my gun be seen sticking out. Than my azz crack.

 

[teflon6string]

I'd hate to be minding my own business with a visibly holstered pistol on my hip when some gun-hating whacko decides it's time to further their twisted agenda and fabricate a story that I had "scared" them by "brandishing" a weapon.

Far fetched I know, but sadly, I wouldn't put it past some of the vindictive, preachy, panicky pantoads I see mincing around Portland.

So, since I don't have a gushing fountain of extra lawyer money for frivolous BS like that, no one ever knows I'm armed.

 

[Koda]

Since both Oregon and Washington both permit open carry and i will have my CHL for both states after my upcoming class (and paying the sheriffs fee of course). Is it an issue for my firearm to be exposed at any time (its a full sized 1911 outside the waistband) by accident while i carry?

legally no, virtually it depends on where you are... Portland, let us know how that works out for you.

I have read some online horror stories that you can possibly lose your CHL if someone informs the police you have a gun and they have you show them your permit. Is that the case or so long as your in a permitted place to carry you simply show your CHL to the officer and go on your way?

you cant lose your gun for lawful carry even if someone notices your carrying and calls the cops. You would have to be doing something else thats illegal to have a problem.

Is the actual act of carrying a firearm in a place of buisness that prohibits guns illegal or is it only a problem if they ask you to leave and you refuse? I was under the impression for both states in question you can carry concealed anyplace that is not prohibited by federal law (Federal building, schools, bars, etc). Again i will obviously ask my instructor but as long as im here might as well ask.

its only a problem if you refuse to leave then you are legally trespassing. Keep in mind they can ask you to leave for any reason, not just because you may (or may not) have a gun on you.

Also, there is no federal law that prohibits CCW in bars and you can carry in schools with a state issued CHL. In Oregon its legal to carry in bars with a state permit. Depending on your class you probably wont get good instruction on the laws... A good resource for Oregon laws is already mentioned by PiratePast40: Oregon's Gun Laws. A guide for gun owners in the Beaver State.

also see handgunlaw.us for all states laws...

 

[etrain16]

It's best to understand the laws in each area you intend to carry. State law may, in some cases, be trumped by local ordinances, though at least in Oregon, there are limits on what they can prohibit, and that's known as State Preemption - meaning they can't, on a local level, create laws/ordinances that trump at least certain state laws.

With regard to carry in Oregon, if you have a CHL, you will find you are exempted from any local restrictions on carry (open or concealed), if you have a valid CHL.

Here is what is said in the most current Multnomah County gun ordinance (passed back in 2014):

What if I have an Oregon Concealed Handgun License?
As required by State law, the ordinance exempts concealed handgun permit holders, and
others, from the loaded open carry provisions.

Source: https://multco.us/file/9312/download

So, anywhere in Multnomah county, you are legally allowed, by state law, to carry open or concealed, if you have a CHL. Note, however that the CHL is a concealed handgun license. Attempting open carry of say, an AR style rifle and you may have other issues. I don't know if they will split hairs on that point, but I certainly wouldn't put it past them.

By the way, do not carry your gun in Multnomah county unless you have your CHL on your person. Their ordinance basically states that they can find you guilty if you don't have the CHL physically on you. Don't leave it at home, don't forget it in your car. Just FYI.

I am personally a "concealed means concealed" person, primarily for the fact that I don't like advertising to anyone, including potential bad guys, that I'm armed. I've been carrying on and off for over 20 years and have never had, to my knowledge, my gun spotted by anyone.

 

[Stomper]

An OR CHL exempts you from all local gun regs, if you have a CHL you can open carry a long gun in Portland, Eugene, and Salem, even into the Capitol Building with a CHL. I saw OSP checking for CHL's on dudes OCing their "scary" rifles @ the 2A rallies down there.

I'm not one to OC a rifle "just because", but you CAN do it... if you want to.

 

[Hayshaker]

In 25 years of open and concealed carry ( but not really caring if I expose myself ) in Oregon and Washington Ive never heard of anyone calling the cops on myself or anyone I knew personally. If the cops show up and you are carrying concealed , for whatever reason people do that sort of thing, just show him your license. Not saying it doesnt happen , it just doesnt happen to me. Then again I wouldnt go to Eugene on a bet. I flat dont like scumbag hippies and consider a Rainbow Family gathering to be nothing short of a target rich environment.

Only reason I have a permit is so I can "carry" in my glovebox. Rest of the time its on my hip if I am actually carrying.

If your in Wash St ~~You'd better have in ON your person ~~ Glove box does not cover it

 

[wired]

Nope. That is a common misreading of the law. The RCW only says that to carry it on your person you need the CPL and that includes in your car. It is perfectly legal to leave the loaded gun in the glovebox as long as you have a CPL. Another shining example of Washingtons poorly worded gun laws.

http://www.handgunlaw.us/documents/WAAGLetterOnCarryInVehicle.pdf

RCW 9.41.050
Carrying firearms.
(1)(a) Except in the person's place of abode or fixed place of business, a person shall not carry a pistol concealed on his or her person without a license to carry a concealed pistol.
(b) Every licensee shall have his or her concealed pistol license in his or her immediate possession at all times that he or she is required by this section to have a concealed pistol license and shall display the same upon demand to any police officer or to any other person when and if required by law to do so. Any violation of this subsection (1)(b) shall be a class 1 civil infraction under chapter 7.80 RCW and shall be punished accordingly pursuant to chapter 7.80 RCW and the infraction rules for courts of limited jurisdiction.
(2)(a) A person shall not carry or place a loaded pistol in any vehicle unless the person has a license to carry a concealed pistol and: (i) The pistol is on the licensee's person, (ii) the licensee is within the vehicle at all times that the pistol is there, or (iii) the licensee is away from the vehicle and the pistol is locked within the vehicle and concealed from view from outside the vehicle.
(b) A violation of this subsection is a misdemeanor.
(3)(a) A person at least eighteen years of age who is in possession of an unloaded pistol shall not leave the unloaded pistol in a vehicle unless the unloaded pistol is locked within the vehicle and concealed from view from outside the vehicle.
(b) A violation of this subsection is a misdemeanor.
(4) Nothing in this section permits the possession of firearms illegal to possess under state or federal law.

 

[Hayshaker]

You better read #2 A2 again.

 

[wired]

OK. Now you made me do it...

http://www.handgunlaw.us/documents/WAAGLetterOnCarryInVehicle.pdf

Skip the legalese and go to the last highlighted paragraph.

 

[Hayshaker]

OK. Now you made me do it...

http://www.handgunlaw.us/documents/WAAGLetterOnCarryInVehicle.pdf

Skip the legalese and go to the last highlighted paragraph.

View attachment 311479

I stand corrected ~~ thank you. really appreciate that.