Open carry stop

[slickaj115]

> slickaj115;890445]Society is the conglomeration of everyone living and working together.

In an ideal world, you are correct.

> That said, most people dont like guns, dont wanna see them, and get easily spooked

Just want to point out that we said the same thing during WWII? ala Japanese Internment Camps
Same for African Americans up to the 60's.
Same with Muslims anytime there is an attack, even before we find out who was responsible. (Timothy-OK)

Sometimes our "don't likes" are just personal problems, but we have to move on.

> End of rant

Me too.

Well, the difference between my example and yours is one is controllable and the other is not. A person cannot change their heritage, but you sure as hell can simple tuck away your "piece". It is completely up to the individual. I get what you are saying, but what I was trying to get across is - why create a possible commotion, that otherwise COULD, very easily, be a non-issue. Just tuck your piece away IWB, whatever, and go about your daily life. To each their own I suppose...

 

[hermannr]

- why create a possible commotion, that otherwise COULD, very easily, be a non-issue. Just tuck your piece away IWB, whatever, and go about your daily life. To each their own I suppose...

You ask: "why create a possible commotion?" First may I say, I have OC'd in Portland, and Gresham, and Eugene, and several other "larger" Oregon towns and have never "created" a "commotion". I have also OC all over WA and ID and have never created a commotion... so your word "possible" is very loose.

Secondly: The answer is "Normalize" OC. You know, get society to see that it is a common legal activity, just as LE OC is.

Why does no-one get upset when they see LE with an OC weapon? Even an M4, while decked out in a bullet proof vest and riot gear??? That view of LE has been normalized, society accepts it as "normal". Or even the "practice drills" where LE drives through a city (like Houston) in armored vehicles sprouting belt fed machine guns and being escorted by armed helicopters like an invading Army? Why do they do these drills? To normalize the activity. Right or wrong, society must see that an activity is not a danger to society in general, to be normalized.

The carry of a weapon for your personal self defense is guaranteed by the 2A, as well as the OR A1/S27, the WA A1/S24 and some article/section of most other state's constitutions. As in the Idaho Supreme Court decision in "in re Brickley", there needs to be an unfettered method of carry...in ID, OR and WA that unlicensed method is, is OC...no license required.

Remember, if you license a "right", it is no longer a "Right", but becomes a privilege. Society needs to understand that Joe Citizen can carry for HIS/HER self defense just as well as LE can carry for their SD, no nanny permit from the king required. How is that going to become normalized if those that carry feel they must hide their weapons like a criminal for fear of being "hassled"? Do you think Rosa Parks thought she might be "hassled"? when she refused to move to the back of the bus?

 

[Kevatc]

The whole reason for the gun control issues that stated back in the 19th century (yea, the 1800's) was because "those that are up to no-good conceal their weapons. Honest men carry openly" That was stated to my dad by a very old man back about 1950. I was there and heard the old man make that statement. I was a young kid...it stuck.

It's a different day and age. I understand your thoughts in this thread and at no time have I said you shouldn't OC. Do what you want. It's a low blow so to speak to suggest that only honest folks OC. The implication of your statement is that CCing is not honest.

 

[U201491]

It's a different day and age. I understand your thoughts in this thread and at no time have I said you shouldn't OC. Do what you want. It's a low blow so to speak to suggest that only honest folks OC. The implication of your statement is that CCing is not honest.

Until you change the education system that has brainwashed current generations and the socialist marxist indoctrination is replaced with real American ideals, you will NEVER normalize OC.
When kids are suspended for going bang with their finger pointed, or an 11 year is suspended for saying the word gun, or a kid is suspended for chewing a poptart into the shape of a gun, there wont be any "normlization" of OC.
I grew up in an era where we took our rifle or shotgun (depending on the hunting season) toschool and kept it there until school was out and then hunted the canyons and fields on the way home. No that was not some remote rural town, it was oregon city, or.
The kids now and since the 60's are brainwashed and communized.
Just as Kruschev stated "we'll beat you without firing a shot"
Today things are not normal in America period ! They never will be again, until Americans get the juevos to take education out of these socialist, marxist, communists hands. No, I DO NOT EXAGGERATE ANY OF IT.
From McCarthy forward, America has become AmeriKa. People have been diverted by nonsense and gadgetry and entertainment into a closed box of self centered me,me,me and blinded by this apathy while they strolled in and took your kids minds and created the left wing extremism that is rampant in society today. They have infiltrated into education, politics (in a big way), enviromentalism, fish and wildlife, planning commissions and any and all places that they can exert control over the people. It is so rampant half the population is accepting it as "norm" without knowing any better. IE; they were educated (brainwashed) that way.



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[Father of four]

Darn great post Taku!!!!

 

[U201491]

Darn great post Taku!!!!

I just wish people could get the message and see what has happened to them and our country.
We have tried to warn people since the 60's when we first saw the plan graphed out then watched it progress step by step. The left attacked with their alinsky techniques and accusations of conspiracy theories and it became the attack phrase for several decades while they progressed their agenda. Now we must retake our country by aggressive means relentlessly or lose it. They have accelerated their attack. We must accelerate our defenses in what ever mode it needs to be to beat them.

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[hermannr]

I just wish people could get the message and see what has happened to them and our country.
We have tried to warn people since the 60's when we first saw the plan graphed out then watched it progress step by step. The left attacked with their alinsky techniques and accusations of conspiracy theories and it became the attack phrase for several decades while they progressed their agenda. Now we must retake our country by aggressive means relentlessly or lose it. They have accelerated their attack. We must accelerate our defenses in what ever mode it needs to be to beat them.

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My dad was a master chess player. He always said: "the best defense is a strong offense"

The problem is those that are concerned with the state of our country, and our constitution, have never taken the offense, we have always just stood on the defense.

What we need to do is actively recruit candidates that will stand on the REPEAL of the infringements to our RIGHT to carry. Then we need to support those candidates with our time and effort, not just our treasure.

 

[hermannr]

It's a different day and age. I understand your thoughts in this thread and at no time have I said you shouldn't OC. Do what you want. It's a low blow so to speak to suggest that only honest folks OC. The implication of your statement is that CCing is not honest.

You are correct, times have changed, to our detriment. It is time for us to take the offense and make change to our benefit.

BTW: I only quoted a very old man, probably born in the 1870's maybe 1860's, and an Idaho State Supreme Court decision. There were then and are now, people that do believe that to hide an honest carry, was not being on the up and up. Sorry if you do not like it, but it is true.

I will tell you CC guys one thing normalizing OC will do FOR YOU! Once it is generally accepted that Joe citizen can carry for his/her own protection, no-one will freak out if your CC is accidentally exposed, and there will be fewer businesses that attempt to restrict any carry. I am concealed (for the purposes as defined by law) every winter when I need to wear a coat for the weather, so I am not 100% anti-CC. However, I do not intentionally conceal just to conceal, and I did resist getting a nanny permit from the king for over 25 years. Having to wait for my new toy was the straw that broke that camels back.

Like with the gays, it will never happen unless you come out of the closet and actively assert your position.

 

[U201491]

AGAIN, I don't have a problem with OCing. I am glad you had a great experience with cops while OCing. For me I would rather go low profile. I'm not one of those "hey look at me and did you notice I have a gun on my hip" type guys. The less I am noticed the better. Like Teddy Roosevelt said, "speak softly and carry a big stick". I'd just prefer that nobody thinks I have a big stick.

Yep, better to make em wonder
Surprise works in your favor also.
And as an additional thought, if I were a bad guy wanting a gun, what better place to get one than by blind siding someone that you can plainly see has one available. That has occurred on more than one occasion.
Just preference, but I would rather be trained well and have the surprise element on my side.
Those that want to OC, I can only wish them well and may God be with them wherever they are.

 

[drew]

You are correct, times have changed, to our detriment. It is time for us to take the offense and make change to our benefit.

BTW: I only quoted a very old man, probably born in the 1870's maybe 1860's, and an Idaho State Supreme Court decision. There were then and are now, people that do believe that to hide an honest carry, was not being on the up and up. Sorry if you do not like it, but it is true.

I will tell you CC guys one thing normalizing OC will do FOR YOU! Once it is generally accepted that Joe citizen can carry for his/her own protection, no-one will freak out if your CC is accidentally exposed, and there will be fewer businesses that attempt to restrict any carry. I am concealed (for the purposes as defined by law) every winter when I need to wear a coat for the weather, so I am not 100% anti-CC. However, I do not intentionally conceal just to conceal, and I did resist getting a nanny permit from the king for over 25 years. Having to wait for my new toy was the straw that broke that camels back.

I believe people should be able to carry however they want without asking for the king's blessing. I got an OR permit specifically because of cities like Portland. After I got it, I carry concealed a lot more.

 

[Father of four]

I believe people should be able to carry however they want without asking for the king's blessing.

I agree 100%. So does the 2nd Amendment in the Constitution. "Shall not be infringed."


A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.


Until .......The Peoples government employees later makes laws infringing on those rights unless The People take a class, pass a background check, pay a fee and carry a permit?

 

[Father of four]

So what would the government employees do to The People if say there where like 300+ million citizens with CHLs, make us do something else?

 

[Kevatc]

Like with the gays, it will never happen unless you come out of the closet and actively assert your position.

Oh.

 

[bajagill]

Darn great post Taku!!!!

+1 :-D

 

[drew]

I agree 100%. So does the 2nd Amendment in the Constitution. "Shall not be infringed."


A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.


Until .......The Peoples government employees later makes laws infringing on those rights unless The People take a class, pass a background check, pay a fee and carry a permit?

Unfortunately, the SCOTUS interpretation probably allows such restrictions. The OR state Constitution which contains stronger language regarding firearms or the laws themselves are the areas to look at.

Adopting Constitutional Carry would settle the issue. Unfortunately, I don't think it will happen in OR or nationally.

 

[hermannr]

I would also add that cities or counties can restrict whether you can open carry a LOADED weapon... Portland, Springfield, Eugene, etc...

ORS 166.173(2)(c) and (2)(d). read them, learn them and remember them. ORS 166.173(2) "does not apply too:" (c) "any person licensed to carry a concealed weapon" (d) (short paraphrase) anyone with an OR CHL.

 

[hermannr]

I agree with this post, you have the right, but, do you want to be known for having a weapon on you?? I'd rather conceal carry, that way IF there was a situation where you needed to protect yourself, and or others, the perpetrator would REALLY be surprised. I'd rather it NOT be known i have a weapon on myself, than advertise it. Low key, can be a HUGE advantage in your favor. But, if you decide to continue open carry, go all out, get a t-shirt, with this embezzled on the back/front " I have a gun".

You do realize that this thought process is exactly why CC in most of the US is restricted? You do it to yourself, and everyone else with that attitude. Read the Idaho State Supreme Court Ruling from 1902. In re BRICKEY. It is short. may change your attitude a bit.

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Until you change the education system that has brainwashed current generations and the socialist marxist indoctrination is replaced with real American ideals, you will NEVER normalize OC.
When kids are suspended for going bang with their finger pointed, or an 11 year is suspended for saying the word gun, or a kid is suspended for chewing a poptart into the shape of a gun, there wont be any "normlization" of OC.
I grew up in an era where we took our rifle or shotgun (depending on the hunting season) toschool and kept it there until school was out and then hunted the canyons and fields on the way home. No that was not some remote rural town, it was oregon city, or.
The kids now and since the 60's are brainwashed and communized.
Just as Kruschev stated "we'll beat you without firing a shot"
Today things are not normal in America period ! They never will be again, until Americans get the juevos to take education out of these socialist, marxist, communists hands. No, I DO NOT EXAGGERATE ANY OF IT.
From McCarthy forward, America has become AmeriKa. People have been diverted by nonsense and gadgetry and entertainment into a closed box of self centered me,me,me and blinded by this apathy while they strolled in and took your kids minds and created the left wing extremism that is rampant in society today. They have infiltrated into education, politics (in a big way), enviromentalism, fish and wildlife, planning commissions and any and all places that they can exert control over the people. It is so rampant half the population is accepting it as "norm" without knowing any better. IE; they were educated (brainwashed) that way.



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Why send children to socialist brainwashing centers in the first place?

 

[Blitzkrieg]

You do realize that this thought process is exactly why CC in most of the US is restricted? You do it to yourself, and everyone else with that attitude. Read the Idaho State Supreme Court Ruling from 1902. In re BRICKEY. It is short. may change your attitude a bit.

Actually something like 36 states are now shall issue CC

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Unfortunately, the SCOTUS interpretation probably allows such restrictions. The OR state Constitution which contains stronger language regarding firearms or the laws themselves are the areas to look at.

Adopting Constitutional Carry would settle the issue. Unfortunately, I don't think it will happen in OR or nationally.

USSC be damned