Nightmare firearms sale and jerk FFL

[Cougfan2]

I can see this developing into a prime time series, "The PBP Chronicles".

 

[satinwood]

Thank you so much for the original posting PBP. This was not only entertaining, it was educational. Glad to know that everything worked out. There was a lot to be learned from reading all of this. Thanks again.

 

[Weathermaker]

Good Reading.

 

[Wenis]

It appears the simple solution is for the FFL to give the gun to the original customer and STFU.

BAM! Roasted.

 

[TyPercy]

BAM! Roasted.

 

[OcelotZ3]

So since the store rep went to the trouble of subscribing to NWFA to bash PBP, do you think the guy will be man enough to admit he was wrong on this forum?

 

[Trlsmn]

I doubt he thinks he is wrong and I doubt he has ever admitted he was wrong in his life contrary to overwhelming evidence.

 

[twoclones]

Sad to think the FFL could have avoided all the damage to his reputation by just not being a pain in first place.

I always figure that when a guy is being a colossal pain that something is going bad in his personal life. Think about how much energy it would take to be a jerk all the time!

 

[ajf1]

PB thanks for the post and the education, along with the drama that rolled out. Trismn had some pretty bad reviews on this huy and I had found some neg. things as far as 2004 on this guy. Hopefully it was a learning experience for the buyer also who now knows about his local dealer. Good Job for sticking to it.

 

[MarkAd]

a little more coal oil on the fire.
A quote from Sam's website
"Items such as firearms, ammunition, primers, powder, exploding devices, cleaning solvents/sprays/cleaners & lubricants are HAZMAT items "
Excues me but since when is shipping a firearms a hazmat item

 

[Gunner3456]

a little more coal oil on the fire.
A quote from Sam's website
"Items such as firearms, ammunition, primers, powder, exploding devices, cleaning solvents/sprays/cleaners & lubricants are HAZMAT items "
Excues me but since when is shipping a firearms a hazmat item

Ask PP. Shipping a firearm to Sam is hazardous.

 

[Mac_Fan]

I doubt he thinks he is wrong and I doubt he has ever admitted he was wrong in his life contrary to overwhelming evidence.

Sad, but this is probably the truth.

 

[badclam]

SAMS SHOOTERS EMPORIUM jergoff attitude should be reason enough to boycott his business. You don't have to pass an I.Q. test or have any social skills to be an FFL. He's worried about $30,I bet his attitude cost him more than that. Spread the word about SAM'S ATTITUDE EMORIUM.

 

[tionico]

well, glad it worked out for the purchaser, and for you, Penguin. I do admire your playing bulldog, making all the phone calls, dragging ATF into it, trying with what resources you had available to repair someone else's problem. Beyond the call of duty, as far as I can see. Well done.

Too bad this guy held out until the Big Boys with the Badge and Gun had to chat him up and tell him to get off it. If the purchaser had a legal impediment, that would be one thing. But the ONLY thing standing in the way was a personal preference of the FFL Dealer. The way thngs stood, even if you had gone down there you could not have forced him to release the gun to the buyer, nor could you have taken the gun back (you are not an Arizona resident, thus cannot take possession of a handgun from a FFL Dealer in another state.... never mind the FACT that it is your property.

Part of this mess shows up just how stupid and abusive the federal regulations are. I mean, what part of "shall not be infringed" covers this sort of garbage? And how does this insanity NOT fall under a restriction of interstate commerce? But, those are the present laws, and we bow to them or will certainly find ourselves in trouble.


For those who are thinking they won't ever deal interstate, or other than FtF, please, think again. I've traded (bought and sold) many arms interstate, and never had the slightest problem. Only thing was, when I shipped a handgun to Georgia, to an FFL Dealer for transfer, I did not include a copy of my driver's license.... they had requested it, but failed to mention that it is mandatory under Georgia State Law. I had to drive to a copy place, make a copy, and mail it to them... delayed the transfer a few days. I've found an incredibly great dealer right here in my town... and anyone thinking of trading out of state would do well to locate a local FFL Dealer and actually go and talk face to face, asking a pile of questions... what about private sellers shipping to you for transfer? What about receiving guns from California? what about........ make sure you know their fee structure, whether they charge sales tax on the service (since it is a SERVICE, Washington tax is NOT chargeable) and/or on the value of the gun itself (not required under Washington law, I've checked). Once you have your own dealer lined up to serve you for transfers, you can buy from out of state and be assured he will be there to HELP you, not cause more trouble. Also, by visiting (or at least chatting him up on the phone) you'll get a good sense of what sort of a person he is..... don't lock yourself out of the potential of buying and/or selling interstate, but make sure you've got the legal bases covered. When selling, go way beyond the minimal, make certain the dealer will accept shipment from a non-licensee. (some will not..... no basis in law, "there is no reason for it, but that's our policy". You might even ring up to several dealers local, and decide which one seems best suited for a long-term transfer dealer relationship.

FtF is great.... when it is within the same state.

 

[Searcher451]

Wow. I just spent the better part of half-hour reading all of the posts in this thread. It's quite an education, and not nearly as entertaining as you'd hope simply because it was such a pain for the good guys involved while it was going on. In any event, glad that it worked out for you, Penguin, and for your buyer. It's not enough to say that all's well that ends well here because, even though this ended well enough, it sure was a mess while it lasted. The entire circumstance does point out at least a few things, however: 1) Deal locally whenever you can; 2) know your dealer whenever you can; 3) treasure a local resource like this website, which puts us all in touch with folks who are close by and far easier to get to know personally; 4) when you have to deal with a foreign shop or long-range FFL licensee, make sure in advance that the indivudual/shop will accept a shipment from a non-FFL holder, simply because not all of them do. That last step alone might have saved a whole lot of grief and headache for the principals involved here.

 

[Kanewpadle]

Just took a look at Sam's website. A lot of the prices are way out of line. You can learn a lot by looking at a company's website. This is one reason why I buy and sell face to face.

 

[Trlsmn]

Just took a look at Sam's website. A lot of the prices are way out of line. You can learn a lot by looking at a company's website. This is one reason why I buy and sell face to face.

I noticed on his website that he has a lot of guns on consignment, I wonder if he turns in his consignees in as Unlicensed FFL's too?

 

[Intoodeep]

Wow...it amazes me how easy it is for people commit suicide of reputation on the net. This guy is surely a tool and he confirmed it with his senseless actions.
This is a good education for the members of the forum; good job PBP and honorable actions on your part .

 

[Stomper]

Yeah... PbP prevailed and got to keep the proceeds from the sale, but he had to see his attorney, and the last I checked a good one costs $200-$400 an hour.... so he probably lost even more on this deal.

 

[w_houle]

Is there a relation between MohaveSam and SAMS SHOOTERS EMPORIUM?