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Is pulling the trigger as part of the disassembly process a bad/undesirable design?

Discussion in 'General Firearm Discussion' started by titsonritz, May 1, 2013.

  1. titsonritz

    titsonritz has left the building. Well-Known Member

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    Over and out
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2016
  2. DieselScout

    DieselScout S Clackamas County Well-Known Member

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    No
    /thread
     
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  3. Netspirit

    Netspirit Bellevue, WA Active Member

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    I was part of that discussion.

    While I believe in 4 safety rules, having a disassembly method that does not involve pulling the trigger is a positive thing that should be recommended, so new shooters learn to pull it only when they intend to open fire. A design that forces you to pull the trigger and provides no other options is, IMHO, fundamentally flawed; you should not have to develop that reflex/habit.
     
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  4. RBid

    RBid Wilsonville, OR Well-Known Member

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    Habits and safe handling > everything else. Whether it's practicing your draw, building trigger finger discipline, checking chambers, or malfunction clearing, everything needs to be hard wired. When I practice weapon manipulation, I always start with chamber check practice. I specifically train to press check, and pause for a full second to let what I see sink in, instead of making a half-assed press-shut motion.

    "I thought it was empty" is a way of saying, "I didn't check the chamber." If you do what you're supposed to to, you won't have problems.
     
  5. jbett98

    jbett98 NW Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    I was taught to depress and hold the trigger while gently lowering the bolt handle down into the closed position on a bolt action rifle.
    That way, the firing pin is not cocked when the bolt is returned to battery.
     
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  6. Nwcid

    Nwcid Yakima and N of Spokane Well-Known Member

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    I know everyone seems to think this is just a feature of new guns it has been used for well over a century now. Even the 1891 Mosin needs the trigger pulled to remove the bolt.........
     
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  7. stmcelroy

    stmcelroy Madras, OR Well-Known Member

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    So I'm going to assume dry fire practice is safe, but taking apart a unloaded gun to clean it is unsafe?

    Nothing wrong with having to pull the trigger to disassemble a gun as long as you practice safe gun handing rules.:thumbup:
     
  8. tony r

    tony r vancouver wa New Member

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    I don't care to dry fire. I broke a shot gun firing pin years ago dry firing. Like some of you I de cock my rifle firing pins as well. I make a careful brass check before pulling the trigger to disassemble anything.
     
  9. Solomon

    Solomon Vancouver Active Member

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    All of my striker fired pistols require a trigger pull to take down (Glocks and PPQs). I have no issue with it, but I can see why some police departments prefer a platform that doesn't.
     
  10. John H

    John H Whatcom County Well-Known Member

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    If you are to stupid to disassemble a weapon because of pulling the trigger, you are just plan to stupid to operate that gun at ANY time.

    If you follow the saftey rules there is no problem.

    Maybe just maybe they did it that way so Darwin will have a chance.
     
  11. bluesurf

    bluesurf Portland Active Member

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    I concur. That is my thinking also.
     
  12. Nwcid

    Nwcid Yakima and N of Spokane Well-Known Member

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    There is a problem with this poll though, the choices are not accurate.

    There is a difference between someone that "prefers" and a person that thinks it is a "bad idea".

    There might be people that do not find anything unsafe about pulling the trigger but still prefer to have guns that do not require it. In my case I find nothing wrong with guns that have external safeties but I prefer to carry ones that do not have them.
     
  13. Nwcid

    Nwcid Yakima and N of Spokane Well-Known Member

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    No worries, just a thought.
     
  14. MountainBear

    MountainBear Sweet Home, OR Well-Known Member

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    It's a horribly unsafe practice, as long as you only follow one rule of gun safety at a time. If you can walk and chew bubblegum at the same time, then you should be able to follow all four rules and not have an issue.

    But, I will remind, rack the slide several times. Lock the slide back. Visually inspect the chamber. Physically check the chamber. Then lower the slide and continue disassemble. Extractors fail. Don't rely on them to clear your chamber. Always double check. If you don't it's not if you'll get bit, it's when.
     
  15. coop44

    coop44 Tacoma ,WA Well-Known Member

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    to answer the question - no

    If I say what I want to about stupid anal retentive children I will get in trouble, oops.

    Reading up about the origins of this thread, I now understand. Glock, it figures. Why would anyone want a gun that "any idiot can use"? Just get an "I am an Idiot!" bumper sticker. Lots cheaper.

    But I guess Gaston is counting on all of their dollars and continued support.
     
  16. DieselScout

    DieselScout S Clackamas County Well-Known Member

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    There is no substitute for safe gun handling; loaded, unloaded, safe or not. Having to pull the trigger to disassemble is not a design flaw and there is nothing wrong with it. Anytime the trigger is pulled the muzzle is pointed in a safe direction. It's pointed at something for all intents and purpose I could destroy.
     
  17. Netspirit

    Netspirit Bellevue, WA Active Member

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    Dry firing is still firing, just without ammo - you simulate the conditions, "play-pretend", pull the trigger to imitate the act of shooting.

    A design that insists on the trigger having 2 very conflicting functions (pulling for firing, pulling for making firing impossible) is known to lead to numerous AD/NDs - yes, because those people did not follow the safety rules (were too tired, drunk, careless, inexperienced, whatever). And some people will always make those mistakes because they are people, not pieces of machinery. A design that makes disassembly just a bit safer (or more "idiot-proof" if you will) cannot be a bad thing, can it?
     
  18. Netspirit

    Netspirit Bellevue, WA Active Member

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    What about people around AD/NDs (family, friends, neighbors, bystanders) - are they also expendable?
     
  19. PiratePast40

    PiratePast40 Willamette Valley Well-Known Member

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    Almost every striker fired pistol half cocks the striker when you rack the slide. Why wouldn't you want to release the striker spring before disassembly? Just makes sense to me. You could do it with the slide released but it really doesn't matter.

    I dry fire all the time, what's the big deal?
     
  20. DieselScout

    DieselScout S Clackamas County Well-Known Member

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    What about them? Negligent discharges can happen with any gun, but as long as the safety rules are being followed there should be no problem. An ND into the sub floor of my house is going to hurt my man hood, my pocket book and my ears. Safe gun handling with any firearm is rule number one.
     
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