How effective is an expandable baton?

Geardo

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So after a recent dog incident in the neighborhood, I purchased a 26" expandable baton as an alternative to using a gun and to supplement the liberal use of pepper spray.


It was totally a impulse buy, but now that I have it and have been beating on the heavy bag with it, I am really impressed and pretty curious about other uses for it, specifically to carry as a replacement for a firearm in a non permissive or non legal environment like work or California.

So my understanding of its various uses is as follows:

Level 0: create space by pushing away with tip of the baton, or even hammer fisted blow with the butt.

Level 1: strikes to broad meaty areas like the thigh and gut for pain compliance (this doesn't really apply to me)

Level 2: strikes to joints and arms, knees etc will cause possible permenant damage and hopefully take someone out of the fight.

Level 3: strikes to neck or head might be fatal and should be considered lethal force.

Is this accurate or just legal training CYA stuff? If all I have is a baton, and I am trying to defend myself from someone using lethal force such a knife or gun, will a strike to the head actually knock them out or kill them?

Would a strike to their forearm break bone or just hurt?

NOT asking for legal advice, just wondering how effective these things are if needed.
 

mkwerx

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If its a quality steel baton, yes, a blow to the head can be deadly. Fractured skill is really easy to do with one.

Strikes to joints like the elbows and knees can be disabling, but I wouldn't count on it. Strikes to the upper arms and thighs can have similar effect to a good cage fighter's round kicks - they will cause the muscles to cramp up and fatigue faster, but don't count on "instant" success. Strikes to the ribs *can* break ribs, but again, not instant compliance if the aggressor is hopped up.

If you have to use it for reals, don't count on it collapsing back onto itself easily. I used to be acquainted with a state trooper who beat the holy crap out of a truck driver with his issued ASP, and it had a permanent bow to it and would not close. The trucker, by the way, only gave up after he realized that the trooper was about to throw the baton down and go for the Glock 22 on his hip, and he didn't want to get shot.

Keep in mind that carrying a baton is generally a no-no in Oregon. Falls in the same class as clubs and saps. OK to own, but no-go for carry. I once wanted one for the same reasons you show. Later when I wound up working private security, I opted *not* to carry the baton, as they were less effective on gaining compliance than you'd hope, and pepper spray + good unarmed combatives will serve you better.
 

mkwerx

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Forgot you're in Washington - chk Wa state statutes on the carry of clubs & saps, maybe legal up there? But then again it could be like knives, and you may be hosed going town to town or county to city or whatever
 

mkwerx

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One more thought - a good solid hard wood walking stick is going to be more effective in ways than the ASP style batons - ask any cop who has used a wooden baton vs steel, and they'll tell you the wood batons work better. No one is going to give you grief over a walking stick. Sportsman's Warehouse sells some nice ones that are sanded, clear coat finished, and have a rubber tip on them. You can replace the rubber with a metal tip. ;)
 
What, you don't wanna touch someone's nasty skidded up undies with your gloves?:s0115:
Heck no....funny story: We were looking for a dude and got a tip. Show up at the house and find the guy in fishnet stockings and daisy dukes. Weird because he looks like Danny Trejo. Safety pat results in finding dope. He asks for us to bring a rubbermaid tote with his stuff and check it into jail property so he has his stuff when he gets out. He consents to a search so we don’t inadvertently bring contraband into the jail. I open the tote and the smell punches me in the face. It was full of very-used womens underwear.
 
The points you mentioned about tactical baton strikes to joints and limbs are about as practical as "just shooting to wound" or "Just shoot the gun out of their hand" or "just shoot them in the leg". In the heat of the moment, most trained self defense experts would likely not be able to guarantee a tactical or disabling strike with a baton and most firearms experts would struggle and waste valuable reaction time trying to shoot kumbaya. Maybe 5% of the best of the best in the highest state of readiness would be able to perform such feats. Of course, it's a noble thought to retaliate in a less than lethal manner but are you willing to gamble your life against Marty Methhead who just dosed and doesn't currently feel any physical pain or that rabid coyote/angryYorkie that knows no fear?
 

EHJ

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I had one.
Ended up using on my boat instead. For fishing. Well, for killing/stunning fish.
I hit fish with it.
Ended up losing it in Warrenton off a dock throwing it at a non-sleeping thief making off with a neighbors chest cooler.
They fly like tomahawks. Pretty sure it hurt, too. Guy dropped the cooler.

I hit fish with a regular stick now.
 
OP
Geardo

Geardo

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Thanks everyone! I kinda figured the stories online of it breaking bones amd such were BS, just based on common sense, but wasn't sure.

I am sure it will be effective on a medium sized dog if needed. o_O

Walking stick is hard to carry when running.
 

Alexx1401

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Thanks everyone! I kinda figured the stories online of it breaking bones amd such were BS, just based on common sense, but wasn't sure.

I am sure it will be effective on a medium sized dog if needed. o_O

Walking stick is hard to carry when running.
The most dangerous part of them is the tip. That ball on the end can be deadly. Due to the speed it's traveling on a swing. It's why when they teach how to use them they warn about that. Lots of those are made now with a "safety Tip" now too.
 

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