How do you know a citizen is law-abiding if you don't run a background check?

[coctailer]

Ya, there should have been a "not" in there.
Armsdealer, could you confirm please?

If you have reasonable doubt, then it's up to you to defend yourself in court. That is the tough part. What is reasonable doubt? That will be up to the US Attorney's Office to decide, not any ORS.

I would highly recommend doing a BG check for ALL private sales.

 

[Armsdealer]

Correct, current law does require private sales to include a background check. Federal law (Title 18, Chapter 44, Section 922(a)(5) prohibits private sellers from selling firearms to individuals who you know or have reasonable cause to know does not reside in the same State. Also prohibited is the selling of firearms to people you know or have reasonable cause to know are disqualified from buying a firearm (Title 18, Chapter 44, Section 922(d).

I do NOT want to argue or engage in a debate. However, responsible gun owners should be aware who they are selling firearms to. You don't need to call OSP for a background check. Just ask a few questions.

I suggest a bill of sale be executed also. It saved my butt one time. I bought a pistol from a gal and then she reported it stolen. Once I showed the police the bill of sale with her signature on it the problem became her's. I believe she ended up defending an insurance fraud case.

My apologies. Correct, current law does NOT require private sales to include a background check. (Unless of course you are at a gun show in Oregon!)

 

[Armsdealer]

I don't really care if you argue or engage in a debate, though I have little patience for folk that pop in, issue a proclamation, than say "but I'm not going talk about it" But that being said . . . Please to defend this statement:



Please show me were, in ORS, or Federal law, that is true.

I'm sorry for trying to help you out. On-line forums and emails are terrible venues for debating complicated issues like Federal and State gun regulations. A simple mistake with the key board tends to make a complicated subject worse.

Take care and good luck.

 

[VinnieBoomBah]

I'm sorry for trying to help you out. On-line forums and emails are terrible venues for debating complicated issues like Federal and State gun regulations. A simple mistake with the key board tends to make a complicated subject worse.

Take care and good luck.

Thank you for clearing that up.

 

[aflineman]

I'm sorry for trying to help you out. On-line forums and emails are terrible venues for debating complicated issues like Federal and State gun regulations. A simple mistake with the key board tends to make a complicated subject worse.

Take care and good luck.

No problem man. I think we have all been there once or twice ourselves (I know that I have).

 

[fromotoc]

If it's someone I don't know, I might ask for an ODL, but since the 2nd amendment says "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed", I don't see how any law to regulate gun ownership is legal, so I just take the money and call the deal done. There was only one time I didn't sell the gun to someone, a person who couldn't speak english, and I decided that if they couldn't speak english they probably weren't american, so they didn't have constitutional rights, and that sale didn't happen.

 

[CEF1959]

There was only one time I didn't sell the gun to someone, a person who couldn't speak english, and I decided that if they couldn't speak english they probably weren't american, so they didn't have constitutional rights, and that sale didn't happen.

Non-Americans in the U.S. enjoy rights under our constitution too, and in a nation of immigrants such as ours, it's been common for people who are newly-arrived Americans not to speak English yet. As for the 2A, even people who don't speak English are people, as in "...the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."

But if you were legitimately concerned that the sale might have been illegal, you were right to be cautious. I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that someone who only spoke Russian was here illegally for the Russian mafia, but I wouldn't do a transaction that didn't feel right.

 

[gunnails]

How does one go about performing a back ground check on some individual, how long does it take, how much does it cost?

 

[Contract_Pilot]

About 2 weeks ago I meet up with someone to buy what seemed to be a good deal. The first time a few months back the guy did not want to meet at the airport and flaked out on me.. I flew to go look at a kimber stainless .45 the guy showed up this time in a beater vehicle looked like a slob had masive nits in his hair he was so desperate to sell he told me if you buy it here and now I will drop the price $200..

I told him lets go inside I wanna field strip it and look at it closer "I did not want to do it in his car looked like a dumpster"

He was very hesitant but decided that it would be OK, as long as I was quick he had people waiting.

He asked me why I was writing down the serial number I told him I am gonna go call and verify it's not Hot.. As I went to the phone he gatherd it up and tried to leave but his car would not start... hahaha.

The police pulled up about 10 min later to see what the problem was as he was under the hood of his car very suspicious. They ran him and he had several warrants and guess what a stolen .45 and some other contraband items. They listened to his story then they came over to talk with me, I told them what I was doing there and I declined any further questioning without an attorney present. they ran my name I was clean "I know I am" they lectured me on how I should not meet people off the internet or the street to purchase firearms.

Another officer showed up he asked me if I had any weapons, drugs, etc. He wanted to search me? I told them I do not consent to a search of any kind. Then they asked if they could search my plane I told them flat out NO. They said if your not hiding anything then there should be no problem with us searching! I told them get a warrant. They told me they will bring a dog out I told them I still do not consent to a search.

After about an hour of denying to answer any of their questions I asked them if I was free to go they told me not till you answer a few questions. I asked them am I under arrest? they said no! So am I free to go? They told me no we think you may have drugs in the plane can we search it? I told them no you are not searching myself or anything I own and if you had a real probable cause you would not need to ask.

Another cop showed up, this one has a bit more of an attitude (must be playing good cop bad cop) threatening to arrest me if I don't talk and hold me till the DEA and FAA check out my plane and and dog was on the way. I said great I like puppys... He said they do not need a warrant or my consent to search as I have associated with a known drug dealer!

About a half an hour passes... they gave me another lecture about how unsafe it is etc. and told me sorry for the delay and that I am free to go!

Talk about a waste or resources... they could have been out catching criminals but they decided I need to be harassed that day.

It's not just buyers but sellers could also not be law abiding people... No wonder the guy did not want to meet at the airport the first time hahaha he was a criminal selling stolen firearms and dope. If he would have had reliable transportation he would have not been busted. Lets hope that nice .45 goes back to it's right full owner it was very nice lots of custom work done to it.

If they look like a dope addict/criminal and/or it's to good to be true it usually is. If in dobut run the serial number it's free if they won't let ya or hesitate walk no, run away.

 

[gunnails]

About 2 weeks ago I meet up with someone to buy what seemed to be a good deal. The first time a few months back the guy did not want to meet at the airport and flaked out on me.. I flew to go look at a kimber stainless .45 the guy showed up this time in a beater vehicle looked like a slob had masive nits in his hair he was so desperate to sell he told me if you buy it here and now I will drop the price $200..

I told him lets go inside I wanna field strip it and look at it closer "I did not want to do it in his car looked like a dumpster"

He was very hesitant but decided that it would be OK, as long as I was quick he had people waiting.

He asked me why I was writing down the serial number I told him I am gonna go call and verify it's not Hot.. As I went to the phone he gatherd it up and tried to leave but his car would not start... hahaha.

The police pulled up about 10 min later to see what the problem was as he was under the hood of his car very suspicious. They ran him and he had several warrants and guess what a stolen .45 and some other contraband items. They listened to his story then they came over to talk with me, I told them what I was doing there and I declined any further questioning without an attorney present. they ran my name I was clean "I know I am" they lectured me on how I should not meet people off the internet or the street to purchase firearms.

Another officer showed up he asked me if I had any weapons, drugs, etc. He wanted to search me? I told them I do not consent to a search of any kind. Then they asked if they could search my plane I told them flat out NO. They said if your not hiding anything then there should be no problem with us searching! I told them get a warrant. They told me they will bring a dog out I told them I still do not consent to a search.

After about an hour of denying to answer any of their questions I asked them if I was free to go they told me not till you answer a few questions. I asked them am I under arrest? they said no! So am I free to go? They told me no we think you may have drugs in the plane can we search it? I told them no you are not searching myself or anything I own and if you had a real probable cause you would not need to ask.

Another cop showed up, this one has a bit more of an attitude (must be playing good cop bad cop) threatening to arrest me if I don't talk and hold me till the DEA and FAA check out my plane and and dog was on the way. I said great I like puppys... He said they do not need a warrant or my consent to search as I have associated with a known drug dealer!

About a half an hour passes... they gave me another lecture about how unsafe it is etc. and told me sorry for the delay and that I am free to go!

Talk about a waste or resources... they could have been out catching criminals but they decided I need to be harassed that day.

It's not just buyers but sellers could also not be law abiding people... No wonder the guy did not want to meet at the airport the first time hahaha he was a criminal selling stolen firearms and dope. If he would have had reliable transportation he would have not been busted. Lets hope that nice .45 goes back to it's right full owner it was very nice lots of custom work done to it.

If they look like a dope addict/criminal and/or it's to good to be true it usually is. If in dobut run the serial number it's free if they won't let ya or hesitate walk no, run away.

======================================================

Where is it done for free? Who do you call.

 

[Contract_Pilot]

To check a firearm against the stolen record files, call 503-378-3070.

http://tbabs.org/OSP/ID/fics.shtml

 

[torpedoman]

good rule of thumb is if they are willing to pay a fair price they are honest men criminals buy stolen guns at very low prices from their pals or just steal them.

 

[UncalledForGabe]

I usually wont sell a handgun without a chl. Sometimes its hard to tell who's a criminal and who's not!

 

[gunnails]

To check a firearm against the stolen record files, call 503-378-3070.

http://tbabs.org/OSP/ID/fics.shtml

=====================================================

Thanks for the number and the link, good stuff to know.

According to the OSP web sight background checks are only done for FLH dealers and private citizens only at gun shows.

So where does a private citizen go for a back ground check on a potential buyer?

 

[gunnails]

So if some one was able to figure out how to do a background check, and the suspect comes back clean, then that means that they are a responsible citizen who would never commit a crime?

The CHL thing does nothing for me other then show me they are not a convicted felon, doesn't mean they are not criminal or worthy of doing business with.

Selling a rifle, I doubt I would even ask to see ID, If I was to ever to sell a hand gun then I would do a bill of sale signed and dated, and I would verify that they are residents of the same state as I. If I did not like the looks or sound of you, then I would not sale, but I do not foresee doing any background checks.


Yep.

 

[nathanh]

I don't believe that felons should be disbarred from owning firearms unless they are currently incarcerated. If they are still criminals at heart, they will get a weapon somehow or other and commit crimes. If they abide by the no guns for felons laws, then they aren't a danger anyway.

I'm a convicted felon and I own guns so maybe I'm a little biased.

 

[Beefcake]

I don't believe that felons should be disbarred from owning firearms unless they are currently incarcerated. If they are still criminals at heart, they will get a weapon somehow or other and commit crimes. If they abide by the no guns for felons laws, then they aren't a danger anyway.

I'm a convicted felon and I own guns so maybe I'm a little biased.

I thought there was a statute of limitations on this law. In other words, I was recently told by the instructor of a college criminal justice class that a felon could not posess a firearm for 5 years from the time they are released supervision, but that they could own one after that. I don't recall if they had to apply to restore their right of gun ownership, but he clearly told me that it wasn't a life-ban. Can anyone confirm this? I am really curious, but I haven't researched it to confirm one way or the other.

 

[nathanh]

I thought there was a statute of limitations on this law. In other words, I was recently told by the instructor of a college criminal justice class that a felon could not posess a firearm for 5 years from the time they are released supervision, but that they could own one after that. I don't recall if they had to apply to restore their right of gun ownership, but he clearly told me that it wasn't a life-ban. Can anyone confirm this? I am really curious, but I haven't researched it to confirm one way or the other.

It depends on the type of crime and the state. It is not automatic in Washington. For details on Washington law see http://www.washrecord.com