Difference in loading handgun compared to rifle.

[Cj10488]

So my first attempt at setting up the dies. I picked up both RCBS and Lee dies. The Lee dies I didnt seem to have an issue with but it appears I'm buckling the cases with the RCBS dies.

First pic is the rcbs and second pic is the Lee. Both set to 1.260 coal. Suggestions? I'd prefer to use the RCBS dies.


Thanks
James

 

[DizzyJ]

Too much crimp on the RCBS die?

 

[Cj10488]

That's kind of what I'm thinking. I just played around with it a bit more with a second one and think I got it now. The RCBS instructions could be a bit more helpful.

James

 

[saxon]

seat to coal first then crimp

 

[Cj10488]

seat to coal first then crimp

Thanks. That's what I ended up doing with the RCBS dies. Prob a stupid question but do you think the first one is safe to shoot or should I pull it down and chuck the case.

James

 

[saxon]

Thanks. That's what I ended up doing with the RCBS dies. Prob a stupid question but do you think the first one is safe to shoot or should I pull it down and chuck the case.

James

not my gun so

 

[v0lcom13sn0w]

in my experience, pistols are easy and you dont HAVE to be exact on powder. its OK to be +\- .2 gr.

 

[gmerkt]

do you think the first one is safe to shoot

Might not even chamber,. wrinkled up as it is. Take it apart are reclaim the components.

The basic instructions that come with the die set don't tell you, "Seat and crimp bullet in two separate steps." I guess they want you to think it's easy, just do them both at the same time. You will learn that although trimming pistol cases isn't often necessary, they can vary a little bit in length and still be functionally interchangeable. But when it comes to trying to crimp and seat at the same time, then is when you will notice any differences in case length.

Plus, remember that when you are trying to seat and crimp in the same stroke, the seater plug is still pushing on the bullet to the very end of that stroke. Said another way, the bullet is trying to grind into its final position at the same time that the case is being crimped. This can result in some scuffing of the bullet. IF you want to do both seating and crimping at the same time, you would screw the die body up a ways, then set the seater plug to seat at your desired COAL. Now you have your bullet where you want it. Dial the seater plug up and out of the way. Next, carefully screw the die body down until it just contacts the mouth of the case. From this point, you will keep screwing it in slightly go get the crimp you want. Now go back and with the bullet seated in the case and fully up inside the seating die, dial the seater plug down to make contact with the nose of the bullet. Now your bullet seating die should be set to seat and crimp. You might have to do a fine tune, dial the seater plug in just a hair more but that's easy to check. At least this is how I do it when I choose to do both steps together. Mostly I do it in two steps.
About crimping on 10mm. You shouldn't need to do much. I like to use a taper crimp die to just touch it enough to make sure there's no gap between the mouth of the case and the bullet. However slightly you flare the mouth of the case, there will still be a slight air gap. Even if it's as slight as a sheet of tissue paper. If you look close, you can see it. But you don't want a tight crimp that would make a ring in the bullet wall.

I load 10mm for two pistols. My experience suggests that you should not use Winchester large pistol primers. Use a harder product such as CCI.

I like 10mm a lot. I like it for versatility. It has a wide range of bullet weights that may be used, 135 to 220 gr, lots of design choices. You can load it down for softer loads or load it hot if you like. Or in the middle. .40 S&W isn't near as versatile. I'm not the greatest pistol shot to ever come down the road but I'm happy being able to hit the black ball with open sights at 50 yards with my 10mm pistols. I've also got two .45's but I find myself not shooting those as much these days.
The one bad thing about shooting the 10mm, my fired brass is always hard to find. I suspect that if I looked on the moon, I might find some there.

 

[Cj10488]

Thanks for all the feedback... The bad one will be pulled down... Had to buy that collet for the puller anyways sometime... I loaded up 10rds of both cci 350s and wlp. That's all that was in stock. Loaded 5x 9.1 and 9.6gr of bluedot behind a 180gr xtp. I will keep working up from there. Using both the Hornady and Nosler books that's a out middle ground @ about 1100fps.

Thanks again
James

 

[Knute]

Like the others, straight wall cases make the 10 easy but if you load them up tp SAAMI full pressure always check you cases very closely. I had 3-4 start a crack at full-boat pressure using Blue Dot...luck I caught them.

Blue Dot gives an impressive muzzle flash and report out of a Glock 20 factory barrel...at an indoor range

 

[Mikej]

Realize that in your crimp stage a very light resistance on the ram is all it takes to squeeze down the slight flare that's left at the case mouth.

And regarding seat/crimp at the same time. I always do seat/crimp at the same time. I notice the difference in the ram due to different brass length. Being I do single stage, if I get a longer brass, that would be wrinkled with a full stroke of the ram, I'll just stop short of a full pull and give a little turn-in of the seater stem and a second stroke to keep OAL close. And then back off the stem for the next round.

 

[Lesliet]

On that wrinkled up case; I've noticed with the RCBS dies, that if you have the expander die adjusted down too far, you will buckle the case. The adjustment is pretty touchy, just a tiny bit of a turn at a time.

 

[Cj10488]

I got things finally dialed in thanks to all the help here. The RCBS die set let's me bell the case as well as expand it. That helped a lot in trying to get it to crimp and seat the bullet in the same step without over crimping.

I have I believe 50rds made up this morning without any issues. Lots of different loads from 9.1gr to if I remember 10.7gr. Whatever was the max Hornady charge. Used BOTH CCI mag and WLP so that way I can log results just in case I can't find one or the other. I prefer cci as I can easily look and tell if it's a range pickup or one of my reloads. I will be heading to the range in the morning hopefully and working my way up.

Thanks again for all the help
James

 

[Cj10488]

Well all the loads worked just fine with no pressure issues. Gun didn't like to cycle the lower charges which didn't surprise me cause it didn't like to cycle the low power factory ammo either. At the top end I had no issues and accuracy was pretty much spot on. Thanks again for all the help. Think I'm gonna load these to the max hornady charge weight and see how a few hundred rounds go. Didn't really notice a difference between the CCI Magnums and with WLP primers though.

Thanks again,
James

 

[2506]

You're going to quickly realize you need a progressive press if you shoot more than 50 rounds a month.

 

[Cj10488]

You're going to quickly realize you need a progressive press if you shoot more than 50 rounds a month.

I shoot an average of 1000rds a month combined in the various rifle and now pistol. Probably more than that actually if you count the factory 9mm that I buy. I can actually load faster than I can prep the cases. I've thought about a progressive but I wouldn't be able to get the quality and accuracy I like. I am going to have to get a new head for the rcbs turret press though. The last 50ish rounds I loaded up on the Rock Chucker I didn't like cause of having to switch the dies all the time. Guess I got too used to the turret with the 223 and 308. All my ammo is loaded to +/-0.02gr which is overkill for my shooting ability but I would never get the quality and accuracy of a progressive that I strive for. I work in quality management in the medical field so that probably doesn't help with my drive for quality.

James

 

[Member 5605]

make them so they cycle the pistol and the rifle will be fine.