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Why does the this Admistration hate endangered species?

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by Bigfoot, Mar 10, 2012.

  1. Bigfoot

    Bigfoot Clack Co. OR Well-Known Member

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    Three articles on bird killing wind turbines.

    For reference if a US citizen picks up an eagle feather here is the punishment.

    "Anyone who possesses an eagle feather, and doesn't meet the requirements, could face fines up to $100,000 and a year in prison. A second offense is upgraded from a misdemeanor to a felony, and carries a maximum penalty of two years in prison and a $250,000 fine. The act also provides for a civil penalty of up to $5,000.”

    Wind, timber and hypocrisy in the Pacific Northwest | The Daily Caller

    Wind Companies Not Presecuted for Killing Birds | TheBlaze.com


    Wind Farms In Pacific Northwest Paid To Not Produce | Fox News

    All this carnage in exchange for 3% of US power generation and even less in the NW.

    Since the government don't really care about the birds it makes you wonder if the destruction of the NW timber industry was not the goal all along.
     
  2. Kevatc

    Kevatc Oregon Well-Known Member

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    There are trade off's with every way of producing power. Is the trade off of the devastation done by the Deep Water Horizon fiasco worth it? What happens if fracking really does contaminate aquafers?
     
  3. sadiesassy

    sadiesassy Prescott Active Member

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    Do not forget that California spent millions to recover the Condor. California wants alternative eneergy.
    The number one killer of Condors are Wind Mills.
     
  4. billdeserthills

    billdeserthills Cave Creek, Arizony Well-Known Member

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    Let them use Solar power,
    Damn, there is always someone whining in Kali
     
  5. Swedish K

    Swedish K SW Washington Moderator Staff Member

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    Why does the this Admistration hate endangered species?

    Could it be that they are reptiles and don't like competition for funds?

    On a more serious note - I often wondered why they haven't tried a more solid blade design like the old water pump windmills - if it appeared to be a solid disc when rotating the birds might not fly into it....
     
  6. Bigfoot

    Bigfoot Clack Co. OR Well-Known Member

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    The oil companies came forward and self-reported many of those 28 dead birds to the feds, migratory birds, not endangered. In return the feds brought maximum charges and spent 45 days flying helicopters looking for more.

    On the other hand they could just walk out to Altamont Pass and pick up endangered Golden Eagles. 70 dead in one year. No charges.

    Nah, no double standard, no cronyism.

    I have a theory on the California Dust Bowl. I'm expecting them to turn the water back on right after the family farmers sell out to huge farming corporations who are connected and give massive contributions to the CA politicians. And the two inch Delta Smelt? I predict a miraculous resurgence.

    Solar power. I grew up with Glamis Sand Dunes as my playground. BLM shut down half of the dunes due to a little frog that comes out when it rains and then goes back underground. They've been trying to close the rest of the dunes by using one excuse or another ever since. They shut down much of the desert for use because of the endangered Desert Tortoise. Now I see that they are scrapping off miles of desert surface in prime tortoise habitat for a giant solar powerplant. Looks like they don't really care about the endangered tortoises either.

    See how the feds are going Barred owl hunting? I wonder how many Spotted Owls will get shot instead since they are very difficult to tell apart, they even crossbreed. Think the feds really care about Spotted Owls?
     
  7. Mark W.

    Mark W. Silverton, OR Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    I hate to bring this up. Since we all seam to be going along so nicely here. BUT Neither the Bald Eagle nor the Golden Eagle is on the Endangered Species list

    Nor are Most of the raptors that this article would be including.

    A valid point would be the number of BATS killed by these eye sores.

    THAT said I am not a fan of Wind Turbines or the way they are being rammed down our throats and budgets.
     
  8. joken

    joken Corvallis Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Unintended consequences of Government interference in the market place. For example, Bonneville ( us rate payers) are going to be paying the wind turbine owners in the gorge to not produce power during peak run off periods in the winter. Bonneville makes so much power that there is no market for the wind generated electricity at certain times.
    Unintended negative consequences created as a result of liberal good intentions are typically ignored by the media. The list is long.
    The only endangered species this administration hates is us hard working, God fearing men and women.
     
  9. billdeserthills

    billdeserthills Cave Creek, Arizony Well-Known Member

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    I don't think the admin hates endangered species,
    Seems to me like it is just another tool in their arsenal of stuff to use against Citizens
     
  10. Swedish K

    Swedish K SW Washington Moderator Staff Member

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    Just an FYI - a guy I used to work with recently retired from the State of CA - he was involved in getting solar power systems set up at most of the desert prisons in CA - they were pressuring him to push wind farms on some of the prison properties as well. He wasn't all that thrilled with the concept and pointed out an issue that as of yet has no solution. The immense pressure and heat created within the gear box on windmills on occasion will result in the windmill catching fire as they have not yet developed a lubricant that holds up under the conditions (especially when a bearing fails). The fire often spreads to the plastic/fiberglass housing and the resulting fire puts large amounts of toxins / carcinogens into the atmosphere. The prison system already pays out thousands for breeding programs every year to replace the endangered species that are killed on the lethal electrified fences that safeguard the maximum security prisons (including spotted owls). They also have paid insane amounts for biologists to capture and "humanely" exterminate non native species that compete with the endangered animals.
     
  11. JimmyS1985

    JimmyS1985 St.Louis Active Member

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    I for one like windpower. Ever since Ronald Reagan took out Jimmy Carter's solar panels on the White House, conservation of energy has largely been attacked by people on the right. THis makes no sense to me though, they complain about taxes a lot, well higher energy prices, from increased consumption is essentially a tax. I paid over $40 to fill up my miata, now with the government giving $100 billion to oil companies to go out and find new supply, I expected oil prices to be lower than they were under the Clinton administration, but it seems instead that the oil companies have stabbed us in the back, taken our tax dollars to go find new supply, and then threw it into their coffers while keeping prices for gasoline very high. I for one am against corporate welfare, the corporations need to pull themselves up by their own boot straps and start paying taxes instead of asking tax payers to subsidize their business operations.

    When it comes to energy policy though, conservation should be the only policy. And if one of those ways is wind farms using up not much land and only requires maintenance to generate electricity, Im in support of it. Even if you don't believe in Global Warming, conservation of energy is still good policy in that it means lower prices, renewable energy such as windfarms is also a good way to generate a lot of electricity without the use of fossil fuels.

    My personal favorite policy that I think should be implemented is High Speed Rail, they've made it work in Germany, France, Japan, and now China, we have large populations on the sea coast cities, so I would like to see high speed rail traversing the coastal areas. If there was a high speed rail line that could go from St. Louis to Chicago in 2 hours, I would be all over it, spend the day in the Chicago, hop back on the train at the end of the day, walk out to my car in the parking lot and go home. I think for medium sized distances, it would rival or surpass Air Travel while using a fraction of the fossil fuel needed to traverse long distances. There is no profit motive for the private industry to provide high speed rail in this country, so naturally, like highways and air travel, it would need to be subsidized, but I think one of the key things to having a strong economy is for the government to provide methods of transportation for citizens to traverse the country (Im not saying buy each citizen a car, but to provide a high speed rail network that citizens can use) As fossil fuel prices go up, there will be larger demand for things like high speed rail in the future, so I think it will be inevitable that we fund such a program and it will be good for the country as a whole.
     
  12. sailorman2010

    sailorman2010 Tri-Cities, WA Member

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    With all the raptors being killed at these wind farms, I'm pretty sure the rodent population goes up (coyotes couldn't keep up with controlling them). If these wind farms are located near farms or rural neighborhoods area's, just think of the possible explosion of mice, rats, etc. that carry diease and can ruin anything they get into (crops/storage). This is an issue that isn't brought up much.
     
  13. Mark W.

    Mark W. Silverton, OR Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    How long does it take for a windmill to create enough electricty to make up for the huge amount of energy and resources required to build the Windmill? This is the problem

    Cost to product 1kw of electricity

    Nuclear: $0.019
    Coal: $0.027
    Natural Gas: $0.081
    Wind:$0.030
    Hydroelectric: $0.009
    Solar: No estimate found

    Comparing Energy Costs of Nuclear, Coal, Gas, Wind and Solar
     
  14. Bigfoot

    Bigfoot Clack Co. OR Well-Known Member

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    And when they finally pay for themselves and the taxpayer subsidy runs out they sit there and produce free power right?

    No, they get abandoned.

     
  15. billdeserthills

    billdeserthills Cave Creek, Arizony Well-Known Member

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    A company in my area called Solar City wants to install their solar panels on your home, then sell you electricity for 10% less than the electric company. Right now they have an additional $1,000 bonus.