Poll: While carrying, is your chamber clear or locked and loaded?

[BUZO71]

They do, and have, mechanically fail. The way it was worded in your post made it sound like you popped open the door, aimed the gun at him, and said, "What do you want?"

-Steve

nope, through the door.

 

[240kph]

nope, through the door.

Okay. I guess that was my big point.

Stay safe,
Steve

 

[Unka-Boo]

The way I act? I'm not talking about carrying with one in the chamber, I'm talking about that particular post he made about opening the door with his gun pointed at the person on the other side. Without any knowledge of who he was aiming at and no indication of threat. Also, please don't call this a hobby. Going to the range, hunting, building guns - those are hobbies. Carrying a weapon for the purpose of defense is about life and death.

Sorry, should have split my comments.....the 2nd half wasn't necessarily directed towards you......

Hobby? If you're so worried about having a round in the chamber while you carry, it's a hobby. Being prepared means just that, not "well, I'm kinda sorta ready", or " can you please stop attacking me while I try and chamber a round?".

 

[Rackir]

Sorry, should have split my comments.....the 2nd Being prepared means just that, not "well, I'm kinda sorta ready", or " can you please stop attacking me while I try and chamber a round?".

I have to disagree with this. Being prepared is a personal decision, and one persons level of preparedness will not be the same as everyone elses. It's all about what makes you comfortable (which is the over riding purpouse of being prepared).

For example, I carry a 1911, 8 in the mag, 1 in the pipe, cocked and locked. One might (and many do) consider that over prepared. They may see me 6'3, 220 lbs and see carrying a gun at all as being over kill. Another though might feel unconfortable that I am not prepared enough. Wheres my back up mags? What if I wond up in an actual "firefight" scenario? What about a knife? How about a BUG in case of primary failure?

The fact is though, my level of preparedness is sufficient for my peace of mind. Certainlly there are circumstances I am not prepared for, but the same can be said for virtually everyone, no matter how prepared they are.

Anyone who chooses to carry is more prepared than if they chose not too, and they deserve kudos, not critique. Is thier level of preparedness adequte for you or I? Maybe not, but you can be certain our level of preparedness is not sufficient for others as well.

 

[240kph]

If you're so worried about having a round in the chamber while you carry, it's a hobby. Being prepared means just that, not "well, I'm kinda sorta ready", or " can you please stop attacking me while I try and chamber a round?".

I agree whole-heartedly about being prepared, I think we're on the same page about the issue. I just don't like seeing a word like "hobby" being used in reference to taking someone's life (criminal or otherwise)

-Steve

 

[Unka-Boo]

The fact is though, my level of preparedness is sufficient for my peace of mind. Certainlly there are circumstances I am not prepared for, but the same can be said for virtually everyone, no matter how prepared they are.

Well put.

It is a very good point that it's personal discretion, but I just can't see the point in carrying a gun for personal protection, and then not have it in a condition that's ready to use. To each his own.

 

[Doc In UPlace]

Here's the slap and shoot technique:

Doesn't work when the firearm is not ready to run.

Cruise was trained for months to get to this level of proficiency. Note that he uses Chuck Taylor's rock and fire on the first guy then transitions to isosceles on the 2nd guy.

(professional driver on closed course. Do not attempt, YMMV, void where prohibited, train the way you fight, and vice versa, save the whales, collect the whole set.)

 

[NWMoss]

Here's the slap and shoot technique:

Doesn't work when the firearm is not ready to run.

Cruise was trained for months to get to this level of proficiency. Note that he uses Chuck Taylor's rock and fire on the first guy then transitions to isosceles on the 2nd guy.

(professional driver on closed course. Do not attempt, YMMV, void where prohibited, train the way you fight, and vice versa, save the whales, collect the whole set.)

What movie is that? I want to watch it now...

 

[Unka-Boo]

What movie is that? I want to watch it now...

Collateral

 

[hunterdad66]

Here's the slap and shoot technique:

Doesn't work when the firearm is not ready to run.

Cruise was trained for months to get to this level of proficiency. Note that he uses Chuck Taylor's rock and fire on the first guy then transitions to isosceles on the 2nd guy.

(professional driver on closed course. Do not attempt, YMMV, void where prohibited, train the way you fight, and vice versa, save the whales, collect the whole set.)

His mindset was different in general because he was an assassin. In other words he was not afraid to use deadly force no matter what or who it was. I think that MOST people that say they carry and would use deadly force if necessary would be too afraid to actually pull the trigger.

Remember these questions in a shooting situation:

****Does the bad guy have the ABILITY to cause you or someone else great bodily injury?

****Does the bad guy have the OPPORTUNITY to cause you or someone else great bodily injury?

****Do you feel that your life or someone else's life is in JEOPARDY based on the actions or words from the bad guy?

 

[Doc In UPlace]

"I think that MOST people that say they carry and would use deadly force if necessary would be too afraid to actually pull the trigger."

Well then they are a big pile of trouble waiting to happen. As the Washington Criminal Justice Traning Commission course (which you've probably taken HD66, so you know) the first question you have to answer is will you be able to act to take a life in order to protect your own or someone elses'. If the answer is no, then they should stop right there.

Now of course the clip above is from a movie, but in that scene Cruise was being robbed by two guys who were taking his briefcase at gunpoint. Those two were not on his "job" list... so it's fair to place in a self-defense context.

 

[MikeIsh]

When I was camping with family, and these three guys pulled into the campground drinking, drove through the entire campground then back to park in front of our site.
I didn't carry then, I had my hand axe, and Navy survival knife, and told my wife if we hear the car door open, you get the kids from the tent, head for the river and up to the next camp, I will hold them off.
That is when all my friends said I needed a gun.
Since I have had other bad experiences, and decided they were right, I got a gun.

 

[hunterdad66]

"I think that MOST people that say they carry and would use deadly force if necessary would be too afraid to actually pull the trigger."

Well then they are a big pile of trouble waiting to happen. As the Washington Criminal Justice Traning Commission course (which you've probably taken HD66, so you know) the first question you have to answer is will you be able to act to take a life in order to protect your own or someone elses'. If the answer is no, then they should stop right there.

Now of course the clip above is from a movie, but in that scene Cruise was being robbed by two guys who were taking his briefcase at gunpoint. Those two were not on his "job" list... so it's fair to place in a self-defense context.

But Doc... the point I was trying to make is that Cruise was still a pro. I personally can't stand the guy, but he was well trained for this movie. His form and tactics were sound to a somewhat trained eye. But---he still was "a killer". Joe blow gun carrier might really be affraid that if I shoot this guy, the police are going to come and place me in cuffs, and take me in and question me 15 times to make I tell the same story all 15 times. Taking a life isn't the point. Being confident enough to pull the trigger and know that it is warranted is the point. I don't think a lot of carriers are capable of that.

 

[utvols]

Being an LEO for 30 years, you must remember major and minor muscle memory in a high stress situation and that you fight like you train. If you do not practice all the time, you will never remember to put a round in the chamber. Modern firearms will not go off without pulling the trigger. If you have a clear chamber, you have one expensive hammer and if I was facing you, you would be dead before your hand got to the slide. If anyone is that scared, get a revolver and keep the next cylinder clear ( 5 rounds), you can always pull the trigger twice, but I must go back to my first thought. If you pull the trigger and it goes CLICK! You will probably look at the gun and say what the F------ as the other guys bullet passes through your face.

Test this theory. I showed my daughter. Stand at the range and as soon as you pull your gun have someone run in the opposite direction. When they hear the gun go off, they stop. Measure the distance. It will be about 20'. If someone is closer than 20', they can gut you with a knife before you can fire. Now try it without a round in the chamber. You better have about 50 yards for them to run out. Bottom line, don't believe this movie crap, you better be able to get off a full mag before they get to you. Now you know why cops dump an entire 11 rounds at a perp with a knife. Try that test, you will be shocked. Close in- knife against gun- a tie at best. You better be mentally prepared to shoot in a bad situation. I never reccomend an autoloader to someone who doesent practice. Jam that fancy Sig ( stovepipe) you got and see how long it takes you to clear it. Over one second and you better file off the front sight, because if you get someone like me who trains daily or a former prison inmate, will shove that autoloader where the sun dont shine and boy that front sight will hurt.
Sorry to be so crude, but it is better to hide and pull your gun just in case than try to be a Joe hero and die in front of your kids. Remember the 9/11 highjackers. The guy in first class was the most highly trained MOSSAD anti terror officer in the world. When the first highjacker hit the cockpit door, he stood up to fight, the guy in the seat behind him cut his throat. One tiny error by the best in the world caused his death. How do people do that dont do this for a living??? Think about it, you might want to invest in a good Remington 870.

 

[NoOne]

I agree with Utvols. I trained LEO's for many years, and competed in 3-gun matches for nearly as long. Although I am retired from teaching now, I did a similar experiment to Utvols when I was "in my prime". A friend of mine was a 3rd degree black belt in Kendo and carried an asp baton in addition to his handgun. His claim was that because of practice, a person with a concealed handgun would probably never get to clear leather before he could stop the action. So here was the test.

I had an UNLOADED handgun checked by myself and my friend with the baton. After he had checked it and holstered the unloaded firearm in my holster, the test proceeded. Man with baton at 12 yards. My firearm concealed under a light shirt. I got to begin the action. As soon as I began the movement to complete the draw, my friend produced the asp, extended it, covered the distance between us and stopped his asp about 4 inches from my forhead. Athough I had my hand on the pistol, it was still in my holster and I don't believe that in real life, I would have been able to complete the draw stroke. I would have had a very deep dent in my forehead where my hairline starts.

So all the contentions made by Utvols are correct. There simply isn't time to do much when the action is "on". That was when I decided that the best option in really bad areas was having my hand on the loaded gun that was in my coat pocket. If necessary, shoot through the dang coat. But that would be much faster than any draw stroke on the planet.

Better yet, avoid bad areas and situations whenever possible. The best fight is one you weren't even involved in.

 

[swoop]

Don't understand why some would carry not ready to go. Read the two posts above and think about it. Why would you want to put yourself at such a disadvantage. The only thing I would add is to practice moving backward toward your strong side as you draw, to give yourself a little extra time.

 

[explorerimports]

Just out of curiosity, how many gunfights have you been in?

My opinion, keep the chamber empty. It takes half a moment to chamber a round and be ready to go.

What if your one arm is blocking or holding back the bad guy?
Think close quarters.

 

[bellarum]

FS M&P 9 17+1 in the pipe. Ready to use. Never been in a gun fight. God willing never will.

 

[slimmer13]

Four years three months. Pretty good

 

[brianjronk]

When I first started carrying, I left the chamber empty cause I wasn't too sure of everything yet. That changed in about a week after I realized that there was no way that the trigger was going to pull itself while in the holster. And if it's out of the holster, then I probably want it loaded.