WA Post ban rifles?

[x2ndxall]

You also have the demoralized people in the western half of the state

Not going to lie, it's disheartening. It's hard to keep telling yourself that your vote matters. But still, I will continue to cast my ballot until it's banned.

 

[Hueco]

also add that everyone in the thread bagging on WA residents talking about guns that are "compliant" ...

WTF are we supposed to do?

Not comply? Great, read the law... this is implemented in a way where our compliance is not required.

How can you go on a hunger strike when you arent being offered food?


We have zero choice in this... again, our compliance isnt necessary. The industry, distributors and LGS is where compliance is at, and they will comply without question.

No one is going to put their paycheck, stock price or dividends on the line to make a stand for 2A rights. We have seen examples of this across the country for 30 years. NO one is coming to save you.


This is the future. It was inevitable. Too many Republicans stayed home over the years grumbling and nitpicking candidates and did turn out to vote, been that way for decades. I dont want to hear about cheating either... if we all turned out, it would be next to impossible to cheat... but since we only make like a 30% showing its real easy to cook the numbers or just have more dems show out. Theyll vote for Hitler if he were on the Democrat ticket... but the Reeepublicans will get a wild hair about a candidate because they said something about something sometime and well dag nabbit IM not voting for that son of a bubblegum!
Nevermind its better have someone who votes in your favor 70% of the time than let someone win who will vote against you 100% of the time.

Universal suffrage was a mistake and democracy is a joke.... but here we are. Laugh now, but the rest of you will be next.

So shut yer yaps and let us think about guns we can get, while we can still get them at all.

Just look at how most R's treat Crenshaw for a fine example of what you're saying.

People are still gung ho for a Trump '24 ticket. As if we couldn't do better than a 76 year old silver spoon billionaire? The fact that his name is even being seriously considered just proves the insipid legacy of his generation and their inability to let go of power, lest it be ripped from their cold dead hands.

The country is arguably in worse shape than it was in the 60's but every time someone mentions returning to an older policy, it's the R's that get their panties in a bunch.

Unless it's guns, of course.

Just sayin' - if people want to act like Walt Kowalski and just yell at people to "get off my lawn" go right ahead - but don't be surprised when the world evolves without them.

 

[Alexx1401]

Not going to lie, it's disheartening. It's hard to keep telling yourself that your vote matters. But still, I will continue to cast my ballot until it's banned.

YEP! A LOT of gun owners tell anyone who will listen not to bother to vote. Then after each election they say "see I told you"

 

[Knobgoblin]

Definitely got to stop seeing things as Red and Blue . Start talking to your neighbors about voting along the lines of "we know this doesn't work " . Probably going nowhere, but it's worth a shot.
When you go straight at someone who selected the "D" from birth , you can't just demand they reverse course. Maybe with patience and logic...idk

 

[solv3nt]

Definitely got to stop seeing things as Red and Blue . Start talking to your neighbors about voting along the lines of "we know this doesn't work " . Probably going nowhere, but it's worth a shot.
When you go straight at someone who selected the "D" from birth , you can't just demand they reverse course. Maybe with patience and logic...idk

The big Island of Hawaii is a perfect example of this. In general, the people have very conservative beliefs, but someone long ago told them to vote D, so they always have.

When I was at the county, I ate lunch with some of the old guys. A staunch D was complaining about his tax dollars going to some handout. I told him I couldn't help but laugh since that's party platform funding, and it's something I complain about.

 

[Old Dog]

Not all of us in EWA are shiftless, lazy arseholes... Just sayin'...

I know; I did not mean to imply anything negative about my fellow gun-owning, RKBA-supporting brothers and sisters east of the Cascades. I've lived and worked over there and I'll take that culture any day over King or Pierce Counties. If anything, I more pi$$ed-off at the meek gun-owners in WWA who never challenge any of the foolishness that's spouted by the politicians and media over here.

 

[shibbershabber]

Not going to lie, it's disheartening. It's hard to keep telling yourself that your vote matters. But still, I will continue to cast my ballot until it's banned.

I know my vote doesnt matter in most cases.
But we all know we wont win the lottery, but we buy a ticket anyway sometimes.

Its a small ask every couple of years

 

[Member 53328]

Just look at how most R's treat Crenshaw for a fine example of what you're saying.

People are still gung ho for a Trump '24 ticket. As if we couldn't do better than a 76 year old silver spoon billionaire? The fact that his name is even being seriously considered just proves the insipid legacy of his generation and their inability to let go of power, lest it be ripped from their cold dead hands.

The country is arguably in worse shape than it was in the 60's but every time someone mentions returning to an older policy, it's the R's that get their panties in a bunch.

Unless it's guns, of course.

Just sayin' - if people want to act like Walt Kowalski and just yell at people to "get off my lawn" go right ahead - but don't be surprised when the world evolves without them.

Well Crenshaw is a piece of sh!t. So there's that….

 

[Ura-Ki]

Not going to lie, it's disheartening. It's hard to keep telling yourself that your vote matters. But still, I will continue to cast my ballot until it's banned.

Your not alone Brudda!

More then half this countries people have ZERO voice or representation in ANY national office.
2016 was a fluke, but 2020 was NOT, and the D's abuse of power, and subsequent orgy of excess, and draconian legislation that has followed.
How do we as a people in good conscious put a Bumbling Potato in the white house, how did that happen?
Joe has always been about his own power, and he was never shy about things being "His Way" and the face he has NEVER ONCE ever done anything even remotely good or beneficial for this nation speaks volumes, and yet, look where he is today.
Many voters have simply given up, with close to 50 years of corruption, people asking themselves if it even matters, and yea, more then a little disenfranchised with the whole thing, they don't vote.
With Mail in Voting it's so easy to cheat, this isn't helping at all. we spend far more effort defending this then we do many other things, like, I don't know, Our border, and they want all the illegals to be able to vote too.
People are so absorbed with voting party line, that they are forever lost when change is needed, and they cannot square their vote with the party, so they vote it anyway, hoping the good will somehow outweigh the bad.


It all adds up to the same result, People have Given Up, and I cant really blame them!


Good to see ya back Brudda, wasn't the same with out ya!

 

[Jaxrug1497]

Post ban plans...
Vote pro gun...sign any sort ballot of repeal for this asinine law.

As for firearms...it really don't affect the firearms that I enjoy and collect.
However...I am against such laws simply because they don't do a damn bit of good...
And...once one gun law like this is passed....it makes it easier to pass more of them.

I do see a rise in popularity of older pump action rifles and semi autos like the aforementioned 760 ,740 and 750 series by Remington.
As well as lever action rifles.
Andy

Even though at times I am frustrated by the NRA I renewed my month donation to the NRA-ILA, they are filing challenging lawsuits against this type of over the top firearm rules. Also please join the 2nd Amendment Foundation, they fight these laws that are violations of the 2nd Amendment. Even as a life member you will receive requests for money from them but they have to be able to pay the lawyers so I keep donating. They are located in Bellingham, Wa. I know there are other great gun organization that help so please pick one and join it. Thank, Ron

 

[Andy54Hawken]

Even though at times I am frustrated by the NRA I renewed my month donation to the NRA-ILA, they are filing challenging lawsuits against this type of over the top firearm rules. Also please join the 2nd Amendment Foundation, they fight these laws that are violations of the 2nd Amendment. Even as a life member you will receive requests for money from them but they have to be able to pay the lawyers so I keep donating. They are located in Bellingham, Wa. I know there are other great gun organization that help so please pick one and join it. Thank, Ron

Not sure why you quoted me.

However.....
I am a Life Member of the NRA....and Welcome to the forum.
Andy

 

[Koda]

Definitely got to stop seeing things as Red and Blue . Start talking to your neighbors about voting along the lines of "we know this doesn't work " . Probably going nowhere, but it's worth a shot.
When you go straight at someone who selected the "D" from birth , you can't just demand they reverse course. Maybe with patience and logic...idk

IMO its the blue that projecting everything as one or the other. If you don't agree your racist, phobic, pick any number of egregious insults. Its a huge risk talking to your neighbors about politics, you live next door to them. Social gaslighting is a symptom of tyranny.
Liberal friends who I know well enough to say "we know this doesn't work" still voted blue.
There was a faint glimmer of hope last election that Drazan actually had a chance... somehow enough people did see things weren't working.

But it wasnt enough. I dont see how people can see whats become of Portland and still vote blue, is telling of how bad things are when people vote partyline even when its failing. Sorry, I... weve been let down too many times, Oregon is toast.

 

[American123]

Well, everyone including you have ignored the OP in favor of a political discussion, so there we are.

What is different now? That people use military rifles often to kill larger groups of people than seemingly any individual did decades ago. And the military weapons got more useful for that role.

I think that's pretty much an established fact. The opinion is whether the behavior of bad people in 1910 with bolt action rifles has anything to do with the behavior of bad people in 2023 with semiauto carbines. And whether that behavior can be moderated via weapon access. But the comparison between the two is weak, at best. Especially when you consider that the US now uses carbine sized M16s for the role that a water cooled Browning .30 machinegun was used for when those bolt action rifles were mailed to your home.

The question isn't about hardware, it is about values, motivations, belief systems, and the general loss of respect for fellow man.

Did people in American society commit less mass murder in the past because the hardware was different in some cases than it is today?

Or did they commit less mass murder in the past because their value system was greater and they averted acting on such ideas?

The obvious answer seems to be the latter. And the fault lies at the feet of multiple reasons. One undeniable reason is that when a cultural shift takes place that encourages people to believe that there is absolutely nothing after death, then that emboldens people to act in the now and commit terrible atrocities without additional fear, other than death, which to someone who hates their current experienced life, they may generally welcome the end to their life anyway.

There then seems to be two camps of people. The people who kill themselves and only themselves, and the evil people who decide to kill anyone else they can before dying themselves. People have been killing themselves forever with whatever method has been available to them. Mass murder on the individual scale is on an uptick. Guns have been generally widely available in this country for the last 250 years, that hasn't changed. It's been the belief system that has drastically changed.

We still see mass murder in other countries, they may use different methods: knives, axes, bombs, box trucks, etc. If it was simply a gun issue, this wouldn't occur where modern firearms are highly regulated and unavailable.

Beyond that, whose to say what is right and wrong? The law? What if the people don't agree with the law? When the value system is only rooted in the words of men, it's meaningless to those who disagree with them. Moral relativism is a killer.

 

[Koda]

The question isn't about hardware, it is about values, motivations, belief systems, and the general loss of respect for fellow man.

Did people in American society commit less mass murder in the past because the hardware was different in some cases than it is today?

Or did they commit less mass murder in the past because their value system was greater and they averted acting on such ideas?

What Ive understood is the rate of mass murders doesn't change, but the population has grown exponentially. Americas population has tripled in just the last 100 years. That's 3 times more mass murderers....
the sticky point is the hardware is certainly more effective, I dont think anyone can deny that?

 

[American123]

What Ive understood is the rate of mass murders doesn't change, but the population has grown exponentially. Americas population has tripled in just the last 100 years. That's 3 times more mass murderers....
the sticky point is the hardware is certainly more effective, I dont think anyone can deny that?

I'd read more:

What the data says about gun deaths in the U.S.

More Americans died of gun-related injuries in 2021 than in any other year on record, according to the latest available statistics from the CDC.

www.pewresearch.org

It's a good read. There's a chart that shows mass shooting incidents have increased by a factor of more than 12 since the year 2000 to the year 2020.

So unless the population also increased by a factor of 12 since the year 2000, the basic explanation that population increased and therefore mass shootings are simply reflecting that same ratio, doesn't hold water.

The motivation is the key piece. These people are motivated and then they act on those motivations. It's a conscious decision to willfully enact evil against others. The question is, why more now than in the past?

 

[Member 34319]

Post ban…

I wouldn't be mad if someone recreated the Remington 7615.

 

[Koda]

I'd read more:

What the data says about gun deaths in the U.S.

More Americans died of gun-related injuries in 2021 than in any other year on record, according to the latest available statistics from the CDC.

www.pewresearch.org

It's a good read. There's a chart that shows mass shooting incidents have increased by a factor of more than 12 since the year 2000 to the year 2020.

Third sentence of that article:
"Despite the increase in such fatalities, the rate of gun deaths – a statistic that accounts for the nation's growing population – remains below the levels of earlier years."

I might agree that its possible that there is a surge or spike in mass murdering due to copycat contagion but Ive always heard the percentage of any criminal element stays the same. I think what we are seeing today is just an increase in the sheer number of mass murderers reflecting the exponential population growth.

 

[American123]

Third sentence of that article:
"Despite the increase in such fatalities, the rate of gun deaths – a statistic that accounts for the nation's growing population – remains below the levels of earlier years."

I might agree that its possible that there is a surge or spike in mass murdering due to copycat contagion but Ive always heard the percentage of any criminal element stays the same. I think what we are seeing today is just an increase in the sheer number of mass murderers reflecting the exponential population growth.

Did you scroll down to the bottom?

Gun related homicides are not the same as mass murder incidents. Scroll down to the chart at the bottom. It's a clear trend and the number of incidents increased by a factor of 12 since the year 2000. The population has not increased to that extent, there is a disproportionality there.

 

[bradsteen]

I'd read more:

What the data says about gun deaths in the U.S.

More Americans died of gun-related injuries in 2021 than in any other year on record, according to the latest available statistics from the CDC.

www.pewresearch.org

It's a good read. There's a chart that shows mass shooting incidents have increased by a factor of more than 12 since the year 2000 to the year 2020.

So unless the population also increased by a factor of 12 since the year 2000, the basic explanation that population increased and therefore mass shootings are simply reflecting that same ratio, doesn't hold water.

The motivation is the key piece. These people are motivated and then they act on those motivations. It's a conscious decision to willfully enact evil against others. The question is, why more now than in the past?

+1 on motivation. Yes, guns can cause a lot of harm in the wrong hands, but so can a car, an airplane, fertilizer.... heck, even a computer can cause massive harm and loss of life. Just look at cases of mass stabbings and vehicle based attacks. When a bad guy can't get his hands on a gun, he'll use some other means to live out his sick fantasy. For this reason the method is almost irrelevant - the willingness to cause harm is what matters.

 

[Ura-Ki]

I'd read more:

What the data says about gun deaths in the U.S.

More Americans died of gun-related injuries in 2021 than in any other year on record, according to the latest available statistics from the CDC.

www.pewresearch.org

It's a good read. There's a chart that shows mass shooting incidents have increased by a factor of more than 12 since the year 2000 to the year 2020.

So unless the population also increased by a factor of 12 since the year 2000, the basic explanation that population increased and therefore mass shootings are simply reflecting that same ratio, doesn't hold water.

The motivation is the key piece. These people are motivated and then they act on those motivations. It's a conscious decision to willfully enact evil against others. The question is, why more now than in the past?

I think what we are actually seeing is a manifestation of suicidal tendencies, where in the past the numbers of folks contemplating suicide was tempered by fear of the act ( and consequences of failure to succeed in that act) , into the instant satisfaction of actually carrying through on it using weapons. What's more, one of the bigger motivators in suicide is through perceived social imbalance, historically, people would get upset with their employers, or fellow employees, and would also have issues with friends and/or family ( And Now, Social Media) , driving them to the edge of considering suicide. Today, we see the traditional barriers to that removed, and combined with "Making a Statement" they go off the rails seeking retaliation against even the slightest perceived slight, and we now see the results of that!
Combined with Mental Health issues apparent in practically Every single shooter, as well as known medication abuses of those who self medicate, or are simply not getting treatment that they need, and it's the perfect storm every single time! And we don't even need to look at the guns to see where this all leads.